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Child Item

Welsh digital switch over-Irish reception questions answered

[Deleted User]

Ok phase one of the digital switchover of the main tx Presely used in south east ireland for UK analogue reception has completed.

What has happened ?

BBC 2 analogue is gone.
ITV one Wales analogue has moved to the BBC 2 frequency.

The New high power BBC A mux [with BBC1 ,2 and 3 cbeebies etc] is broadcasting at 20kw erp instead of the previous 1.5kw.

Is reception possible in the south east and will it be reliable?

So far the answer seems to be yes.

On september 16th all analogue from presely will be switched off and channels like ITV one and ch4 and five will be on 20kw muxes and should also be as reliable as the new BBC one mux is now.

Viewers will need to retune their idtv's once again on september 16th to continue to receive the new higher power digital service.

A lot of viewers in co wicklow use a relay Arfon for their UK analogue reception.
This is used for example in wicklow town,much but not all of Arklow and greystones and areas inbetween.
If you still have BBC 2,you are on arfon.
arfon is not changing untill october.
It is only going to be one tenth of the power of presely so it's unclear that it will be as useable.
Some viewers may have the option of switching their aerials from arfon to presely-especially in the arklow area.

To the best of my knowledge,people in Rathdrum are using presely and inland in places like Aughrim and Tinahely also.
My rule of thumb as to whether reliable digital reception will be available to those areas and to those on arfon is pretty much wait and see at this time.
If you usually have fair to good analogue reception,then it is fairly likely that you will have consistent good digital reception.
I'm basing that on the fact that it seems that the new high power digital transmissions from presely remained stable and strong the other day when the analogues were very poor or even unwatchable at my location.

The purpose of this thread is to provide reasonable reliable [but amatuer as I am an amatuer] information on the changeover as it affects wexford,wicklow and probably carlow and Kilkenny and maybe waterford.

By all means ask any questions and I and one or two others here will endeavour to answer them.

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fat-tony

mrdtv wrote: »

You don't say where you are: previously did you get Preseli or Arfon analogue very well? I would skip the grid and get a modern high gain Yagi or log: further down the coast Preseli seems to be doing very well. If you already have FTA satellite I would sit tight , observe what's going on, find out what the neighbours are doing (eg try the box there!), and wait till Arfon comes on. Then you can make an informed choice and decide what to invest in.

I believe Ger is in the Kilpeddar area. Around there and Newtown, Greystones and Kilcoole, the analogue transmitter of choice was Arfon.
Arfon's no good to me - I already have Freesat. I'm waiting to see if Llanddona lights up at DSO - maybe

mrdtv

fat-tony wrote: »

I believe Ger is in the Kilpeddar area. Around there and Newtown, Greystones and Kilcoole, the analogue transmitter of choice was Arfon.
Arfon's no good to me - I already have Freesat. I'm waiting to see if Llanddona lights up at DSO - maybe

Yes, that's why I think Preseli would probably be too far in that location.

Dates for the diary: 21 October(Phase 1) and 18 November (Phase 2) which are the switchover dates for Llandona AND Arfon. ( Arfon is part of the Llandona group.). This will also be very interesting. After 18th November its DTT only from those stations. Arfon is only a 3PSB DTT service whereas LLandona has the full Freeview service. Both will carry HD probably next year.

bothyhead

Has the signal quality deteriorated for anyone else this evening? I've been getting 100% the past few days and it's now hovering at 50% or below.

Verso

Has the signal quality deteriorated for anyone else this evening? I've been getting 100% the past few days and it's now hovering at 50% or below.

Yes, me too, all day (North Wexford).

fat-tony

mrdtv wrote: »

Yes, that's why I think Preseli would probably be too far in that location.

Dates for the diary: 21 October(Phase 1) and 18 November (Phase 2) which are the switchover dates for Llandona AND Arfon. ( Arfon is part of the Llandona group.). This will also be very interesting. After 18th November its DTT only from those stations. Arfon is only a 3PSB DTT service whereas LLandona has the full Freeview service. Both will carry HD probably next year.

Tried Preseli again today. Nothing found on any of the muxes. Moved the aerial towards Llanddona and peaked it for the best signal on CH60 (ITV analogue) - pretty lousy reception. Subsequently ran a scan on the digital muxes and picked up the EPG for Mux C on CH64. SS and SQ too low for picture reception. I'm leaving it for the next couple of months until the signal levels are increased.

mrdtv

fat-tony wrote: »

Tried Preseli again today. Nothing found on any of the muxes. Moved the aerial towards Llanddona and peaked it for the best signal on CH60 (ITV analogue) - pretty lousy reception. Subsequently ran a scan on the digital muxes and picked up the EPG for Mux C on CH64. SS and SQ too low for picture reception. I'm leaving it for the next couple of months until the signal levels are increased.

You are probably too far from Preseli for reliable reception. Your existing aerial system is not for those kind of distances. IIRC Llandona has never been very good for coverage in Ireland or indeed Wales ( a few years ago Classic FM rejected the use of Llandona for West Wales coverage in favour of Arfon because of its much higher AGL and far superior coverage.) It won't be long now before Arfon and Llandona start converting which will be very interesting indeed, although Blaen-Plwyf doesn't convert till February/March.

A reminder for Preseli DTT viewers: you must retune on Wednesday after 1300 to retain all services because of the reorganisation to make room for DVB-T2 HD.

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0016/40552/National_re-tune_briefing.pdf

Ger Roe

mrdtv wrote: »

You don't say where you are: previously did you get Preseli or Arfon analogue very well? I would skip the grid and get a modern high gain Yagi or log: further down the coast Preseli seems to be doing very well. If you already have FTA satellite I would sit tight , observe what's going on, find out what the neighbours are doing (eg try the box there!), and wait till Arfon comes on. Then you can make an informed choice and decide what to invest in.

Hi MrDTV -

I am in Kilpedder, with a clear rooftop view to the sea and using a grid with a masthead amp (previous install, originally used for analogue from Arfon - now changed polarity and turned towards Preseli).

I was still watching last night. Strong un-broken reception of the BBC's and generally reliable on Five, Virgin + 1 etc (some breakup at times).

I should be able to get my hands on a SLX 48 element antenna over the weekend. If it's available I will see about trying it out.

mrdtv

Ger Roe wrote: »

Hi MrDTV -

I am in Kilpedder, with a clear rooftop view to the sea and using a grid with a masthead amp (previous install, originally used for analogue from Arfon - now changed polarity and turned towards Preseli).

I was still watching last night. Strong un-broken reception of the BBC's and generally reliable on Five, Virgin + 1 etc (some breakup at times).

I should be able to get my hands on a SLX 48 element antenna over the weekend. If it's available I will see about trying it out.

Very interesting. Note that Preseli Arqiva A and SDN muxes went up in power this morning to 10kW and you have to retune today as its Freeview UK retuning day. You are about 120 miles from Preseli, 70 from Llandona and 65 from Arfon. Three weeks today the conversion of Arfon and Llandona to high power DTT transmissions begins. I recommend a wideband aerial because of the different aerial groups in use and the later possibility of Blaen-Plwyf. I think Arfon may be the best bet in your locality although its Freeview-lite unlike Preseli, Llandona or Blaen-Plwyf. Keep the posts coming...

prioryc

mrdtv wrote: »

Very interesting. Note that Preseli Arqiva A and SDN muxes went up in power this morning to 10kW and you have to retune today as its Freeview UK retuning day. You are about 120 miles from Preseli, 70 from Llandona and 65 from Arfon. Three weeks today the conversion of Arfon and Llandona to high power DTT transmissions begins. I recommend a wideband aerial because of the different aerial groups in use and the later possibility of Blaen-Plwyf. I think Arfon may be the best bet in your locality although its Freeview-lite unlike Preseli, Llandona or Blaen-Plwyf. Keep the posts coming...

just done my first retune & Quest ( showing t.j hooker)is indeed live & working today also better signal off arqb(sky3,dave,sky news) all channels working & very good to excellent signal on all stations

mrdtv

prioryc wrote: »

just done my first retune & Quest ( showing t.j hooker)is indeed live & working today also better signal off arqb(sky3,dave,sky news) all channels working & very good to excellent signal on all stations

Yes, but one of the Preseli muxes isn't being upped in power till 24 March 2010 in order not to interfere with analogue Tv in the Bristol Channel area. What kind of aerial are you using and do your neighbours know its available? I think there'll be no more retuning on Preseli till Freeview HD is rolled out: an announcement is expected shortly, it''ll be live before the World Cup.

Once again SE Ireland will participate in TV history: first to receive TV well before RTE launched in 1961, and first to get operational terrestrial HDTV. Unlike Northern Ireland which has to wait till 2012/3!

[Deleted User]

Just to add,I'm away at the moment and won't be back untill next week so I can't comment on the presely changes at home.
I do know that whenever presely was very strong the sky mux obliterated mt leinster on 45 so it would not surprise me that increasing the power by a factor of five makes reception of it the norm

I think co channelling presely and mt leinster was a huge mistake on the part of the planners.

Incidently are there any on screen announcements on arfon yet?

The slightest increase in westward mobility of blaenplwyf is going to make it a very real probability in East wicklow and a better option than arfon.
I get fair to bad analogue from it on a b group in arklow even as it is.

mrdtv

Deleted User wrote: »

Just to add,I'm away at the moment and won't be back untill next week so I can't comment on the presely changes at home.
I do know that whenever presely was very strong the sky mux obliterated mt leinster on 45 so it would not surprise me that increasing the power by a factor of five makes reception of it the norm

I think co channelling presely and mt leinster was a huge mistake on the part of the planners.

Incidently are there any on screen announcements on arfon yet?

The slightest increase in westward mobility of blaenplwyf is going to make it a very real probability in East wicklow and a better option than arfon.
I get fair to bad analogue from it on a b group in arklow even as it is.

Agree re cochannelling: it may be academic if only a limited Irish DTT service takes off. Arfon will be switched over commencing three weeks today with the launch of BBC PSB-1 at 2kw and the station has a HAAT of 600m or thereabouts. Blaen-Plwyf won't convert till 24 March 2010 but the fact that its digital power is twice what you would expect for an analogue conversion is very interesting and, of course, it has Group A propagation characteristics.

macmansion

Hello again.

Just getting back to say I took the advice to get a cheap freeview box and hooking it up to work alongside existing Sky and Irish analogue and it worked out great here in Wexford. Lots of channels and excellent reception.

Thanks again to mrdtv, marclt & others for demystifying the whole situation.

Just as a side issue - in the past couple of months the analogue reception for RTE (especially RTE1) has gotten quite poor, while TV3 and TG4 have remained good as always. Retuning the TVs doesn't seem to help. I guess this has nothing to do with the ditigal switchover, but curious am I alone in this.

[Deleted User]

Hi,
Your RTE reception problems have nothing to do with the presely uk digital switch over.
You might want to check your vhf aerial.

It's great to hear ,that freeview is working well with you-spread the word! and direct anyone with questions to this thread if they want.

Verso

Hi all,

Just a further comment on Freeview in North Wexford.

I upgraded from my elderly Group B aerial and cable to a Philex Wideband 48 element aerial with a Labgear 9 - 26db variable gain masthead amplifier and in general am very pleased with the reception from Preseli.

My TV is an LG set with an MPEG 2 tuner. I also purchased a cheap Alba Freeview STB for use with another TV.

The signal strength to date from both receivers varies normally between 68% and 75% for BBC and 61% and 71% for ITV. Film 4 sometimes fades out and to date I have not received Sky 3.

I may well be able to get more improved reception by adjusting the direction of the aerial but in all the general reception and stations is very good.

As neither of my receivers indicate Quality I cannot advise on this.

prioryc

Verso wrote: »

Hi all,

Just a further comment on Freeview in North Wexford.

I upgraded from my elderly Group B aerial and cable to a Philex Wideband 48 element aerial with a Labgear 9 - 26db variable gain masthead amplifier and in general am very pleased with the reception from Preseli.

My TV is an LG set with an MPEG 2 tuner. I also purchased a cheap Alba Freeview STB for use with another TV.

The signal strength to date from both receivers varies normally between 68% and 75% for BBC and 61% and 71% for ITV. Film 4 sometimes fades out and to date I have not received Sky 3.

I may well be able to get more improved reception by adjusting the direction of the aerial but in all the general reception and stations is very good.

As neither of my receivers indicate Quality I cannot advise on this.

much the same result as i get currently ...sky3 better but still not watchable in most conditions

bothyhead

macmansion wrote: »

Hello again.
Just as a side issue - in the past couple of months the analogue reception for RTE (especially RTE1) has gotten quite poor, while TV3 and TG4 have remained good as always. Retuning the TVs doesn't seem to help. I guess this has nothing to do with the ditigal switchover, but curious am I alone in this.

Yes, I am experiencing the exact same thing.

RTE1 = Poorish (mainly snowy reception, but still watchable)
RTE2 = Not as bad as RTE1, but still poor (I sometimes see Venetian blinds interference)
TV3 and TV4 = crystal clear, as good as UK DTT

bothyhead

Verso wrote: »

Hi all,

The signal strength to date from both receivers varies normally between 68% and 75% for BBC and 61% and 71% for ITV. Film 4 sometimes fades out and to date I have not received Sky 3.

Yeah, I'm in the same boat. The MUX transmitting Film 4 is still on low power until March 2010, where upon it will be increase to 10KW.

Sky 3 is being broadcast on CH 45. Channel 45 is also being broadcast from Mount Leinster (RTE Digital trials). These two signals are interfering with one another, which results in Sky3 not being viewable. The solution is to disconnect your TV3/TG4 aerial! - yeah right

Satdog

In response to RTE reception I live just south of Wexford town and I have to say my RTE1 and RTE2 have vastly improved since Welsh analogue was switched off!!

prioryc

bothyhead wrote: »

Yes, I am experiencing the exact same thing.

RTE1 = Poorish (mainly snowy reception, but still watchable)
RTE2 = Not as bad as RTE1, but still poor (I sometimes see Venetian blinds interference)
TV3 and TV4 = crystal clear, as good as UK DTT

Exactly the same reception here as yourself no change from uk switch off
RTE1,2=ghosting
TV3/TG4:Perfect

[Deleted User]

Satdog wrote: »

In response to RTE reception I live just south of Wexford town and I have to say my RTE1 and RTE2 have vastly improved since Welsh analogue was switched off!!

Thats probably because welsh analogue strength was overloading your distribution amp.

Satdog

Deleted User wrote: »

Thats probably because welsh analogue strength was overloading your distribution amp.

Thanks for that. Only amp connected is a masthead. Current set up is a VHF aerial to Mount Leinster for RTE 1&2 and a standard contract UHF aerial to Preseli - this I presume is picking up my TG4 and TV3 also from Mount Leinster. I'm also picking up the DTT BBC MUX from Preseli. I'll have to upgrade cable and get a new aerial for the rest of the Welsh DTT.

[Deleted User]

If you have the BBC A mux -you should be also getting the itv mux at least if not the others aswell.
Do a complete factory reset and then set up the tv again doing an digital tune and see what happens.

Satdog

Deleted User wrote: »

If you have the BBC A mux -you should be also getting the itv mux at least if not the others aswell.
Do a complete factory reset and then set up the tv again doing an digital tune and see what happens.

BBCs have been coming in since the switchover whereas ITVs have been unreliable - stable some days but also a lot of break-up hence I want to up grade cable first and then maybe a new aerial.

Verso

Thanks prioryc and bothyhead for your comments.

From what you say my aerial would appear not to be too much out.

I can live with not receiving Sky 3 and will keep an eye on the BBC and ITV reception which to date is quite good.

[Deleted User]

Installed another digital tv on presely for someone (who asked me as they were clueless) in the north wexford area today with 3 of the neighbours looking on in amazement-all want one now.

All channels working very well as usual today in the heavy rain at this new location with strength at 70% and signal quality at 100% and thats with a single chimney height rooftop group B thats been there about 15 years or so.

mrdtv

Deleted User wrote: »

Installed another digital tv on presely for someone (who asked me as they were clueless) in the north wexford area today with 3 of the neighbours looking on in amazement-all want one now.

All channels working very well as usual today in the heavy rain at this new location with strength at 70% and signal quality at 100% and thats with a single chimney height rooftop group B thats been there about 15 years or so.

You betcha they will:, word of mouth is key.

Just out: the installers bible for the coming Lllandona/Arfon switchover in two weeks time. It gives the changes in powers, analogue closures etc.

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/40652/Installer_Newsletter_Llanddona__1_month_out_FINAL.pdf

bothyhead

bothyhead wrote: »

RTE1 = Poorish (mainly snowy reception, but still watchable)

Is this really crap for anyone else tonight? (tue). It's nearly as bad as UK analogue was, on a very poor night, in the bad old days

Satdog

Deleted User wrote: »

Installed another digital tv on presely for someone (who asked me as they were clueless) in the north wexford area today with 3 of the neighbours looking on in amazement-all want one now.

All channels working very well as usual today in the heavy rain at this new location with strength at 70% and signal quality at 100% and thats with a single chimney height rooftop group B thats been there about 15 years or so.

What kind of aerial is in use - hardly a standard contract job?

[Deleted User]

Its an old almost grid type aerial actually-you know the really thin ones.
In many parts of wexford presely just blasts in.