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Your Views On The BNP

hacx

I was reading over the BNP (British Nationalist Party) website earlier, when I came across their policy on The North.

In the long run, we wish to end the conflict in Ireland by welcoming Eire as well as Ulster as equal partners in a federation of the nations of the British Isles

Now, I know I should take everything the BNP says with a grain of salt, but seriously, WTF?

That said, They have some decent plans but their immigration policy (Basically closing Britain's borders and ejecting any/all Muslims - The seem to dislike them especially, there's no mention of a "Hindu takeover of Britain") leaves much to be desired. Reading over the whole website, they're somewhat like Libertas.

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Vamoose Killers

hacx wrote: »

That's more of a National identity than a racial one. I mean, any aul person can celebrate St.Patricks day, no need to be Irish for that. I mean, their being a bit retarded classing followers of the Islamic faith a race. There's Indian Muslims, African Muslims, Arab Muslims. I mean, ****. there's even English muslims (Converts, mostly).

Better tell them jews:(

Capt'n Midnight

Latchy wrote:

Aren't we lucky they were ?

(Which has nothing to do with the The Presence of red Indians on Omaha beach )

Of course not, AFAIK there weren't any native americans in the 13th division of the SS.

dlofnep

dan719 wrote: »

I lol'ed. SF are a mixture of nationalism, communism/marxism, who are dependent on a 'hatred of the brits' to encourage support amongst an ill-informed and bigoted sector of the population.

Sometimes, I can't get over the extreme ignorance displayed on this forum. But nevertheless, I'll offer a rebuttal to your childish remarks.

Firstly - SF is not dependant on "hatred of the brits" to encourage support. SF as a party does not hate the "Brits", which I can only assume you are trying to refer to the British people. An english man in our local SF office is one of our strongest supporters - Surely, if SF demonstrated hatred towards the Brits - he would be gone long ago?

But the fact of the matter is - SF doesn't. It naturally has political indifference with the British Government, but that in no way is correlated with your attempts to portray them as "hating the Brits".

For you to label all SF supporters as ill-informed and bigoted is quite ironic; but moreover is ignorant. People support SF for a number of issues, "one" is they still question the national issue, while other parties are passive on it - but they also fight for worker's rights, and the vast majority of SF activists are involved in unions, fighting for worker's rights. On a local level, councillors are working for housing, job-creation and then some.

So for you to spit out that vile nonsense is absolutely stupid.

dan719 wrote: »

The existance of SF and the DUP is the embodiment of secterianism,

It's not, and SF are working hard, along with their youth wing on cross-community projects to curb sectarianism. Anywhere on this planet that you go, that has two separate identities who have polar opposite political and cultural views - you are going to have friction. But controlling that friction through cross-community work displays the willing to go past it, and not embody sectarianism as you would want people to believe.

Simple fact is, you are ignorant and are completely unaware of the work that SF have done on the issue in recent times and if you got your head out from your arse, you'd realise that.

Degsy

Beanstalk wrote: »

These so-called ghettos are not a result of immigration as much as they are a result of poor immigrant opportunity and poor government provision

No,the problem is criminality and racism within the gehttos no matter whose fault they are.
I have a friend who's father is kashmiri and who's mother is irish.
They settled in Hounslow and were subjected to racist bullying from pakistani and bangladeshi gangs because his mother was "a whitey".
Eventually they had to leave and they moved to ireland.
In places like Bradford you can get quite happily kicked to death for being white and racist beatings are so commonplace the police dont bother to enter these areas...anytime they do,the inhabitants riot and burn the place to the ground.
This is pretty much the same as the north african ghettos in france,and the mexican and black ghettos in the US.

dlofnep

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Nationalists=Nationalists. So really they're fairly similar at the root of it all.

No they are not. It's like comparing American Republicanism to Irish Republicanism. Irish Nationalism is not in anyway, shape or form relating to the BNP's form of nationalism, which involved sending all the immigrants home.

How skewed do you have to get in order to post that sort of nonsense? Nationalism exists in the north by product of environment, where the civil and cultural freedoms of one society were given complete freedom, while the other was the complete opposite.

Latchy

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Of course not, AFAIK there weren't any native americans in the 13th division of the SS.

Although there were German units masquerading as GI's during the battle of the Bulge .

Fratton Fred

Degsy wrote: »

No,the problem is criminality and racism within the gehttos no matter whose fault they are.
I have a friend who's father is kashmiri and who's mother is irish.
They settled in Hounslow and were subjected to racist bullying from pakistani and bangladeshi gangs because his mother was "a whitey".
Eventually they had to leave and they moved to ireland.
In places like Bradford you can get quite happily kicked to death for being white and racist beatings are so commonplace the police dont bother to enter these areas...anytime they do,the inhabitants riot and burn the place to the ground.
This is pretty much the same as the north african ghettos in france,and the mexican and black ghettos in the US.

Get this, Poles, Latvians etc are regularly beaten up in Slough, because they "Took arrr jaaabs".

The aggressors are nearly always of Asian decent.

Degsy

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Of course not, AFAIK there weren't any native americans in the 13th division of the SS.

There were however indians from india in the Waffen SS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Legion

dlofnep

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Get this, Poles, Latvians etc are regularly beaten up in Slough, because they "Took arrr jaaabs".

The aggressors are nearly always of Asian decent.

Figures to back up this claim, along with the demographics of the said area?

sunnyjim

I'll admit that I've been guilty for most of my life of tarring anyone associated with Sinn Fein as a 'shinner' - lately I'm trying to find out what exactly they stand for, so bear with me.

"Brits out" refers to removal of British rule in Ireland. Not the actual British people. Why I even have to explain this to you, is beyond me.

But the IRA have bombed the English mainland. At a time (I think) when SF were the political wing of the IRA.

Degsy

dlofnep wrote: »

Figures to back up this claim, along with the demographics of the said area?

Racist attacks on whites dont make the news..its considered racist to report them.

Rebelheart

O'Coonassa wrote: »

So that makes it OK? I don't think so. Just beacsue the apes can't take the lessons of Darwin on board, check out their propensity to geno-cide and from whence it springs, it doesn't mean you have to join in with them.

No, but it makes your extraordinary sense of moral superiority on this issue all the more hollow. You clearly need the feeling of self-righteousness that your quotidian rants on this issue evidently give you. What failures (or accident of birth??) in your life are you making up for? Beware of the zealot no matter what his guise.

So, you think you know what you are against. Have you got to the stage of defining what you are for? And at least try and think of something that is practical and can be sold to the people.

We've done our political theory in uni. Now it's the real world. Political maturity is calling.

Beanstalk

Degsy wrote: »

No,the problem is criminality and racism within the gehttos no matter whose fault they are.

Yeah but where did this problem originate from? Voters in the UK should be looking at the effectiveness of government policies in providing adequate provision for immigrants into the country. These policies should be improved not gotten rid of. Ghettos are formed through social and economic pressure upon immigrants entering a new society, they just don't materialise out of nowhere. If racism exists in ghettos, you don't attempt to erradicate it with more racism, which is essentially what the BNP are about.

The BNP target the presence of people as the problem, not policies.

O'Coonassa

Rebelheart wrote: »

No, but it makes your extraordinary sense of moral superiority on this issue all the more hollow. You clearly need the feeling of self-righteousness that your quotidian rants on this issue evidently give you. What failures in your life are you making up for? Beware of the zealot no matter what his guise.

So, you think you know what you are against. Have you got to the stage of defining what you are for? And at least try and think of something that is practical and can be sold to the people.

We've done our political theory in uni. Now it's the real world. Political maturity is calling.

lol Does it involve ad hominem attacks? I don't think so...

Baboons are funny but I don't feel at all morally superior to them, that would be silly wouldn't it?

dlofnep

sunnyjim wrote: »

But the IRA have bombed the English mainland. At a time (I think) when SF were the political wing of the IRA.

They did attack the English mainland - and while some of the targets involving civilians were terrible choices made by the leadership of the IRA - it was a political attack, not a display of hatred towards the British people.

SF does not hate the British people. If you don't believe me, go to your local SF office. Masquerade as a supporter for a few weeks and listen to what is said. You'll quickly come to the conclusion that their beef is with the British Government, and not the British people.

I have never heard, in my time of supporting SF anything that would lead me to believe that they hate the British people. Like I have already stated, one of our strongest supporters is English and canvasses hard for SF. Why would he, if he felt like SF hated him? You need to ask yourself these questions.

It's political, not personal.

Dartz

The west is a democracy.

Some people may be absolute ****s, but they have the right to be absolute ****s. Ignoring the BNP and banning it won't make it go away. Let these people speak. Let them sound off like the nutters they are.

And with their true lunacy made public, let the rest of us laugh and ridicule the ****ers freely. Because that's our right too.

O'Coonassa

dlofnep wrote: »

No they are not. It's like comparing American Republicanism to Irish Republicanism.

Well they're both bastardisations of actual libertarian Republicanism so there's a comparison there to be made in that a movement that was anti-State religions has come to be populated by bible bashers and kissers of the Popes ring.

dlofnep wrote: »

Irish Nationalism is not in anyway, shape or form relating to the BNP's form of nationalism, which involved sending all the immigrants home.

Nationalism is nationalism. At the core, what underpins it is always the same. Now I'll grant that the Shinners are fairly fair minded when it comes to immigration, and doubtless it gets them crucial votes from such communities. However, when you interview Shinner supporters in the pub they don't generally share such an egalitarian outlook. They believe in things like punishment attacks and Irish jobs for Irish workers. I'm not saying that they're all like that mind you, just that the average voter is like that.

dlofnep wrote: »

How skewed do you have to get in order to post that sort of nonsense? Nationalism exists in the north by product of environment, where the civil and cultural freedoms of one society were given complete freedom, while the other was the complete opposite.

Nationalism exists everywhere because of the Enlightenment. However in this day and age and since Hitler it is coming to be regarded as a bad thing.

dlofnep

O'Coonassa wrote: »

They believe in things like punishment attacks and Irish jobs for Irish workers.

Eh, no they don't.

Caoimhín

BNP? Shower of [EMAIL="w@nkers"]w@nkers[/EMAIL].

asdasd

Nationalism is nationalism. At the core, what underpins it is always the same.

So what is your opinion on

1) Palestinian Nationalism - the idea of those crazy Palestines that they need their own place.
2) The idea of Native Americans that they need their own reservations.
3) Aboriginal claims to Australia.
4) The Morrocon displacement of the Pied Noirs, largely celebrated as a anti-colonial delight by your intellectual forebears.

Nationalism exists everywhere because of the Enlightenment. However in this day and age and since Hitler it is coming to be regarded as a bad thing.

How did the Enlightenment affect Japan, or China in the centuries prior to Enlightenment? Did they have time machines? Nationalism - the tribal instinct of humanity is innate. Anybosy who thinks that people were not nationalist prior to the Enlightenment has never read any folk historian from any period in history whatsoever.

However in this day and age and since Hitler it is coming to be regarded as a bad thing.

This thread is about the BNP, not immigration or nationalism per say, so I suppose we cant call Godwins law on that one.

RaverRo808

dlofnep wrote: »

They did attack the English mainland - and while some of the targets involving civilians were terrible choices made by the leadership of the IRA - it was a political attack, not a display of hatred towards the British people.

SF does not hate the British people. If you don't believe me, go to your local SF office. Masquerade as a supporter for a few weeks and listen to what is said. You'll quickly come to the conclusion that their beef is with the British Government, and not the British people.

I have never heard, in my time of supporting SF anything that would lead me to believe that they hate the British people. Like I have already stated, one of our strongest supporters is English and canvasses hard for SF. Why would he, if he felt like SF hated him? You need to ask yourself these questions.

It's political, not personal.

Your dead right,Sinn Fein have no problem with Britain or its people,sure areant their wages paid by the British Government,and areant they given thousands in allowances towards travels expenses,property allowances and all sorts of hands by her majesties government,and sure areant they helping as best they can to administer British rule in Ireland,by backing and supporting the PSNI/RUC,dropping recognition of POW status,and selling out every fundemental republican principle imaginable,yeah Sinn Fein and the British government are good partners in occupying the six counties

kyp_durron

I don't mind them. It's unlikely they will ever get elected and like, y'know, free speech, man. Too much hate coming from you people calling them ****, they feed on your anger, it makes them stronger. ARRGG.

dlofnep

Jaysus, Ruairi Ó Bradaigh would be proud of you RaverRo.

markesmith

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/apr/20/bnp-handbook-european-elections

Interesting article on the BNP's internal report that characterises themselves as "oddballs and liars", as well as "Walter Mitty characters".

Also, it says that many BNP members are bad spellers.

It'd seem to me that, based on the spelling angle, boards.ie would be fertile recruiting grounds.

Rebelheart

O'Coonassa wrote: »

Well they're both bastardisations of actual libertarian Republicanism so there's a comparison there to be made in that a movement that was anti-State religions has come to be populated by bible bashers and kissers of the Popes ring.

Nationalism is nationalism. At the core, what underpins it is always the same. Now I'll grant that the Shinners are fairly fair minded when it comes to immigration, and doubtless it gets them crucial votes from such communities. However, when you interview Shinner supporters in the pub they don't generally share such an egalitarian outlook. They believe in things like punishment attacks and Irish jobs for Irish workers. I'm not saying that they're all like that mind you, just that the average voter is like that.

Nationalism exists everywhere because of the Enlightenment. However in this day and age and since Hitler it is coming to be regarded as a bad thing.

Although even if *they* (all Sinn Féin supporters, it seems) did believe in "Irish jobs for Irish workers" that would hardly be unique to Sinn Féin supporters in the current environment. Shhhh.

Your failure to make basic well-known distinctions between the Sinn Féin support base in the cities and the support base in rural areas such as west Tyrone but instead make a generalisation about all their supporters speaks for an abject inability to understand nuances within that party.

Have you even finished the 1st Year Nations and Nationalism course? Your ideas are all extraordinarily undergraduate, as if you've just discovered a few basics, but haven't discovered enough to, for instance, avoid making an inane generalisation like all nationalism is the same. When you get to final year you will hopefully hear of liberal nationalism and of the many liberal theorists who advocate nationalism as a means to promote social justice. More reading, in other words.

Again, you have still failed to tell us what you are in favour of. Why? Is it some sort of Joseph Carens "remove all borders" philosophy? Where do you draw your boundaries to exclude people? We can be certain you have them, thus making your sanctimony here all the more repelling. We know what you think you're against: what do you think you are in favour of?

General Zod

dlofnep wrote: »

Jaysus, Ruairi Ó Bradaigh would be proud of you RaverRo.

Doubt he'd know who that is without googling it.

As for the BNP? Feck 'em. It's quite funny to see how they've changed their opinion on the Irish, nowadays they want our support, back in the 70's they wanted to take any benefits an Irish person could recieve in Britain away from them, and the money saved would be given to "our friends in the north, the brave Ulster Loyalists".

RaverRo808

dlofnep wrote: »

Jaysus, Ruairi Ó Bradaigh would be proud of you RaverRo.

Id have more time for O'Bradaigh and RSF then I would for Gerry Adams or Martin McGuniness mate,even if he is abit of a dinosuar

RaverRo808

General Zod wrote: »

Doubt he'd know who that is without googling it.

As for the BNP? Feck 'em. It's quite funny to see how they've changed their opinion on the Irish, nowadays they want our support, back in the 70's they wanted to take any benefits an Irish person could recieve in Britain away from them, and the money saved would be given to "our friends in the north, the brave Ulster Loyalists".

Your opinion means f*ck all to me,I know more then you think I know,what do you know about ROB?

markesmith

You get an awful lot of "Sinn Fein are a bunch of fools" on this site, and it's a pretty narrow-minded view. Papers like the Indo have dumbed-down the Sinn Fein issue so much, and I guess that makes it easier for non-questioning people. Really, some of the lads on here should read up a bit more before shooting from the hip.

And the BNP can suck an exhaust pipe. In Britain they've basically eliminated the ability to sensibly debate issues pertaining to immigration.

General Zod

Really? You castigate Adams and McGuinness for taking a salary as elected MP's, yet O'Bradaigh was willing to do the same.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruair%C3%AD_%C3%93_Br%C3%A1daigh

In the 1966 United Kingdom general election, he ran as an Independent Republican candidate in the Fermanagh and South Tyrone constituency, polling 10,370 votes, or 19.1% of the valid poll. He failed to be elected