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On the dole and doing cash in hand work

weightlifter

This is my present situation. I am on the dole (204 per week), actively seeking work, and doing some cash in hand work.

In terms of the cash in hand work I can earn anything from 75 euro per week to 300 euro per week (maximum). I have 6-8 week stretches of cash in hand work, and I would say on average I earn 170 euro per week cash in hand (when I am actually doing cash in hand work). But there are stretches of 3-4 weeks where I have no work.

I would LOVE to get off the dole, even if it would mean getting less money per week. If I could be guaranteed 300 euro per week, I would take that. But my current situation is that the cash in hand work is just too unreliable. Some weeks 75 quid, sometimes 300, and sometimes unexpected stretches of no work. If I went off the dole, I would then have to go through the whole application again when out of work, and have the 8 weeks waiting with no income.

Is there any advice you might give me? Anything like a small business allowance I could apply for (if I declare my cash in hand earnings)?

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Alessandra

weightlifter wrote: »

Obviously??

I dont claim rent allowance, fuel allowance and I do not have a medical card.

Welll maybe you don't claim it but you are nonetheless entitled to it if you are in receipt of full social welfare payment(correct me if i am wrong).

marcsignal

weightlifter wrote: »

Ok cool, is that part-timers assistance?

unsure what they call it, other than 'casual dockets' they'll know what you mean anyway.

weightlifter wrote: »

Would i have to then make sure that the casual earnings I was getting were going through the right channels? - ie would I declare the income in a seperate issue to the tax man etc?

unsure about this too, although, 'casual work' could entail 'cutting grass for every old biddy in your neighbourhood', who are unlikely to be tax liable in such a case.

weightlifter

Alessandra wrote: »

Welll maybe you don't claim it but you are nonetheless entitled to it if you are in receipt of full social welfare payment(correct me if i am wrong).

Well yes, but its a conscius decision not to accept it. It would make life easier, but as I have said in the thread numerous times, I only really want to take from the state what I need to just get by. Thats why I have made this thread, to try and get the best info on how I can do this.

the_syco

marcsignal wrote: »

ask your welfare officer about support for starting your own business

Please note: you'll never get dole ever again if you work for yourself.

ayapatrick

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

Are you joking? It's gonna go down the shítter a lot faster with everyone seemingly thinking it's alright to rip as much money out of the system.

I'm guessing you all condone the bankers dodgy dealings and people like the Golden Circle screwing the tax payer? Or is it one law for some and one for another?

Get a grip.

the point i was making, if you need the money to survive, take it! as the op was saying, some weeks he has alot of cash in hand along with the dole, others he hasnt!

Who in fek unless the bucks in the "golden circles" will be happy with what they have done with them huge amounts of money!

on what?:p

Kiera

weightlifter wrote: »

Well yes, but its a conscius decision not to accept it. It would make life easier, but as I have said in the thread numerous times, I only really want to take from the state what I need to just get by. Thats why I have made this thread, to try and get the best info on how I can do this.

Would you not get the best info from the welfare office or are you looking for a way around getting money from both? If you cant afford to "get by" then you should cut down on your out goings!

[Deleted User]

ayapatrick wrote: »

the point i was making, if you need the money to survive, take it! as the op was saying, some weeks he has alot of cash in hand along with the dole, others he hasnt!

Who in fek unless the bucks in the "golden circles" will be happy with what they have done with them huge amounts of money!

on what?:p

Doesn't really sound like he needs it to survive though. That's the thing. He just wants more money.

Davei141

Somebody wanting more money? Man this place has gotten so crazy lately...

weightlifter

Kiera wrote: »

Personal abuse? Tut tut tut.

Look no matter what way you dress it up you are breaking the law. You said yourself your "trade" hasnt been hit yet so get you fcking finger out and get a job and stop sponging of the state! How dare you come on here boasting about how you're getting the dole and getting money into the hand. I couldnt give a flying fúck how much it is or how often you are getting it. You are still breaking the law and should be reported! If you were that bothered about it you would have gone to the welfare office yourself instead of asking people on the internet! You're just here in the hope people will pat you on the back and tell you not to report it!

You are being silly. I havent "boasted" about anything. And I have explicitly asked for the best information on declaring this earning... so that flies in the face of your accusation that I am looking for people to pat me on the back and justify what I am doing. I have also said that I am actively looking for work. I applied for a job just today and I have had couple of rejection letters in the last 7 days. I said I expect to get something in Sept. not because I am lazy and that is when I "want" work, but because the nature of my industry is that appointments are most commonly made in Aug or Sept.

If you dont give a flying fcuk then dont post in the thread but please dont twist what I am asking for here. I am not looking for justification, I am looking for very specific advice.

[Deleted User]

lol I'm just so...I dunno. I'm out of this thread.

I'm obviously a príck for abiding by the law.

Kiera

weightlifter wrote: »

You are being silly. I havent "boasted" about anything. And I have explicitly asked for the best information on declaring this earning... so that flies in the face of your accusation that I am looking for people to pat me on the back and justify what I am doing. I have also said that I am actively looking for work. I applied for a job just today and I have had couple of rejection letters in the last 7 days. I said I expect to get something in Sept. not because I am lazy and that is when I "want" work, but because the nature of my industry is that appointments are most commonly made in Aug or Sept.

If you dont give a flying fcuk then dont post in the thread but please dont twist what I am asking for here. I am not looking for justification, I am looking for very specific advice.

Nope, not buying it.

If this was the case why didnt you go to the welfare office in the first place to get all this info? Answer me that....

weightlifter

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

Doesn't really sound like he needs it to survive though. That's the thing. He just wants more money.

But in truth, I do. Look at the figures I have posted. 4 week stretches with 0 income. Many weeks with less than 100 quid. Occassional weeks with over 200 quid.

There are some weeks where i dont need it, yes. And that is why I am asking here... how can I not get it when I dont need it? But still get it when I need it?

I am acknowledging that what I am doing is not 100% correct, and I am looking for advice on how I can make it legit, not how I can get more money.

red_ice

a friend of mine works in the film industry and works at most 35 weeks a year getting about 1.5-2 grand a week. Its hard work, and he works hard at it, fair play... however

The weeks hes not working - hes on the dole. I've started a business lately and obviously things are a little hard to get moving. I feel a bit angry that im handing a chunk of my money to a guy who makes alot more than i do so he can take his gf out for pints while i sit in at weekends working. its not fair.

Another friend of mine is a carpenter by trade, gets a good few jobs (not in the last while) every week he claims aswell.

weightlifter

Kiera wrote: »

Would you not get the best info from the welfare office or are you looking for a way around getting money from both? If you cant afford to "get by" then you should cut down on your out goings!

That is precisely what I am asking here... who will give me the best advice? Welfare office, Citizens Info Bureau, Tax Office etc.

I can currently just about get by, my expenditure is very low, and as I have said already, I am looking for a way to get less money and to do my casual work with a dole supplement in weeks when necessary

Senna

I know you dont want to tell the SW straight out whats happening, but you should approach them and ask them what would happen if you were to earn a small amount over the next few weeks. They will be glad to help out someone who isn't there to milk the system and wants to do things right. It is possible to earn money some weeks/days and still get the dole when not working.

weightlifter

Kiera wrote: »

Nope, not buying it.

If this was the case why didnt you go to the welfare office in the first place to get all this info? Answer me that....

I will. As I have said previously I am partially afraid of losing the social welfare payment. I feel like right now, they would only be looking for an excuse to cut someone off and I cant afford for that to happen. I want to get my house in order and know as much as possible before I discuss it with them.

The casual work situation for me has kind of come from nowhere. At first I was just on the dole. Then you do a couple of jobs, and then via word of mouth some more come along. It is hard to know exactly when you have some decent casual work and when you dont.

Do you think it unreasonable that after i did a first job for 50 quid that I didnt go straight to the social welfare office? Now that I have had about 8 weeks of on and off casual income (and now that I can see that it will probably continue to be like that for another 8-10 weeks) I am making an effort to get info and do the right thing.

Also, the social welfare office isnt open at 11.40pm. Boards is.

red_ice

weightlifter wrote: »

But in truth, I do. Look at the figures I have posted. 4 week stretches with 0 income. Many weeks with less than 100 quid. Occassional weeks with over 200 quid.

try 2 months. then see how i feel. Try putting some money aside and budgeting so that your money lasts.

weightlifter wrote: »

There are some weeks where i dont need it, yes. And that is why I am asking here... how can I not get it when I dont need it? But still get it when I need it?

So, if you dont make over 300 a week the government should just give you the money for your efforts? Thats hilarious. you lower your prices, put more care and time into the job your doing. Then when people see that you've done a good job, the word passes on and you get more work. Thats how i do it. Its called making an honest living. I've gone 3 months with no income at all, most recently i did a 2 month stint. I still felt that i was able to avoid going on the scratcher.

weightlifter wrote: »

I am acknowledging that what I am doing is not 100% correct, and I am looking for advice on how I can make it legit, not how I can get more money.

Its not right at all. Its not slightly wrong. Its the total opposite. That money you get in hand, put that into some book keeping, and start paying taxes like everyone else.

weightlifter

Senna wrote: »

I know you dont want to tell the SW straight out whats happening, but you should approach them and ask them what would happen if you were to earn a small amount over the next few weeks. They will be glad to help out someone who isn't there to milk the system and wants to do things right. It is possible to earn money some weeks/days and still get the dole when not working.

Thanks, I think this is now what I am going to do.

Snowie

I beleave its called casual work, allowence... but not 100% shore my dad class's under that some what.....

seedot

Don't mind them weightlifter - the toryboys seem to be out in force

If you were unemployed for more than 2 years you could go the back to work route:
Back to Work Enterprise
where your dole is tapered offover 4 years while you try and start a business (although, despite the claims above you are allowed to revert to a jobseekers allowance claim - its just not easy).

Casual sounds like a good route - Sundays don't count and you can do 3 days out of 6 - part time sets it the same every week, casual means you fill out dockets.
Details on jobseekers benefitt. There is a thing there called subsidiary employment -if this was just a part time job that you used to do before when you were working you may be able to continue doing it even while claiming a full payment - as this may qualify as subsidiary employment.

Regardless of the welfare situation, you should also ensure compliance with tax. Technically you are self employed and should make a return - if you register as self employed for 2009 you should pay preliminary tax in October 09 (first year can be different but probably better not too leave too long)
Revenue self assessment website. Its compliance with this that is the biggest pain about small subsidiary employments - you need to make sure you keep records and put aside some of your income to send to the tax man when its due - hard if you're scrabbling week to week.

Might seem like a pain learning all the paperwork - but if you have a bit of unwanted free time at the moment you could look at this as learning an extra (v. valuable) skill.

HTH, keep well

C.

weightlifter

seedot wrote: »

Don't mind them weightlifter - the toryboys seem to be out in force

If you were unemployed for more than 2 years you could go the back to work route:
Back to Work Enterprise
where your dole is tapered offover 4 years while you try and start a business (although, despite the claims above you are allowed to revert to a jobseekers allowance claim - its just not easy).

Casual sounds like a good route - Sundays don't count and you can do 3 days out of 6 - part time sets it the same every week, casual means you fill out dockets.
Details on jobseekers benefitt. There is a thing there called subsidiary employment -if this was just a part time job that you used to do before when you were working you may be able to continue doing it even while claiming a full payment - as this may qualify as subsidiary employment.

Regardless of the welfare situation, you should also ensure compliance with tax. Technically you are self employed and should make a return - if you register as self employed for 2009 you should pay preliminary tax in October 09 (first year can be different but probably better not too leave too long)
Revenue self assessment website. Its compliance with this that is the biggest pain about small subsidiary employments - you need to make sure you keep records and put aside some of your income to send to the tax man when its due - hard if you're scrabbling week to week.

Might seem like a pain learning all the paperwork - but if you have a bit of unwanted free time at the moment you could look at this as learning an extra (v. valuable) skill.

HTH, keep well

C.

Awesome advice. This is exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. Thanks.

Tony Broke

Senna wrote: »

I know you dont want to tell the SW straight out whats happening, but you should approach them and ask them what would happen if you were to earn a small amount over the next few weeks. They will be glad to help out someone who isn't there to milk the system and wants to do things right. It is possible to earn money some weeks/days and still get the dole when not working.

Have you been in there lately?

They dont give a ****, most of them in there take great pleasure in watching you grovel.The minute you say you have an other income, they will screw you, that's their job :pac:

Dont tell them **** OP until you have something permanent, as they will hound you down!!

glaston

The situation weightlifter finds himself in isnt uncommon.

I have a close family member who pays out dole money as part of their job in a small village post office. Over half the people signing on are working in some capacity but nerer declare it. One guy is working full time and has always been on the dole, staff in the welfare dont seem too bothered about taking action. He struggles to find the time to turn up and when he does its always in his work wear.

Everybody is getting their knickers in a knot about greedy bankers/developers etc but welfare fraud has been prevalent in this country for years. I have never heard of anybody getting their payment cut off.

We live in a poorly managed socialist society, that aint going to change anytime soon.

brianthebard

K-9 wrote: »

The black economy was huge in the 80's. Mechanics, bar work etc. etc. etc. I t was acceptable then with the huge tax rates.

Considering income tax is low here, time to pay your tax.

How much tax do you pay on 300 p/m again?

I don't see anything wrong with your situation atm op, you are on the dole because you can't find a source of reliable employment. You shouldn't out of well meaning but misguided ethics believe that you have to just survive on that 200 if the opportunity for occasional cash comes your way. If you were earning a months pay in a week then I might feel different but you aren't, so don't let people here make you feel guilty. If you are capable of finding cash in hand work then obviously you are capable of getting out of the house and working, and will most likely do so as soon as the opportunity for real work presents itself.

thethedev

Why are people on boards.ie such goody-two-shoes?

galwayrush

thethedev wrote: »

Why are people on boards.ie such goody-two-shoes?

I'm not.:D

redarmy

thethedev wrote: »

Why are people on boards.ie such goody-two-shoes?

its nice to be nice

big b

I had to put the lads who work for me on a 3 day week. They claimed SW for the other 2 days.
On the weeks we were a bit busier & they worked 4 days, the office girl filled out their SW form accordingly & their SW for that week was adjusted.
Similarly, there were a few weeks lately where we only had 2 days work for them. Again, Sw forms reflected this, as did their payments.

Not quite the same circumstances as the OP, but I can assure him that the SW staff were helpful & treated them with respect.

You'll get advice on here to do the right thing & declare your earnings, same as you'll get others who think there's more kudos in telling you to cheat.

That decision is yours alone.

K-9

brianthebard wrote: »

How much tax do you pay on 300 p/m again?

You'd better correct that post. I'm lost.