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Another General Election???

banshee_bones

So the leader of the labour party is calling for a general election, and predicts it would be a Fianna Fail Labour coalition.

What do you think?

Given all the animosity with regard to our current government do you really think that Fianna Fail would be re-elected???

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Ostrom

banshee_bones wrote: »

So the leader of the labour party is calling for a general election, and predicts it would be a Fianna Fail Labour coalition.

What do you think?

Given all the animosity with regard to our current government do you really think that Fianna Fail would be re-elected???

If it were the right time, I would love nothing more than to see them both out.

The last thing I want to see at a time like this is another cabinet reshuffle (certain outstanding members aside, I mean an across-board).

They may not be worth a shíte long term, but they know their departments by now - which is far more favourable considering the circumstances, than an inexperienced opposition

Tech3

I think having bruton in as finance minister would be more important than anything else. Brian Lenihan doesnt seem to have a clue. With him around we will never get out of this recession and just end up more in debt.

A labour-fine gael coalition would be my choice with gilmore as taoiseach as mentioned in an earlier post. Although recently labour have pushed themselves away from rumors that there would be a coalition with FG. I think FG cant go alone against FF in the next election as with the still vast amount of followers FF have they would still be well in contention. It doesnt matter how bad they have managed this country there is always the same idiots out there that will vote for them.

drkpower

banshee_bones wrote: »

So the leader of the labour party is calling for a general election, and predicts it would be a Fianna Fail Labour coalition.

What do you think?

Given all the animosity with regard to our current government do you really think that Fianna Fail would be re-elected???

Didnt he say he wants FF out? No?

banshee_bones

tech2 wrote: »

I think having bruton in as finance minister would be more important than anything else. Brian Lenihan doesnt seem to have a clue. With him around we will never get out of this recession and just end up more in debt.

yeah i can see that happening myself!

themadchef

Lookit, it doesnt matter who's holding the countrys wallet if it's empty!

The're all a pack of greedy, self righteous wannabes.

This country is going on a crash diet. I did lol though when i heard we're experiencing a baby boom because so many builders are out of work

:D

Nothing will change regardless of who we vote for. We are just changing the people, it's the system that's the problem.

mikemac

tech2 wrote: »

I think having bruton in as finance minister would be more important than anything else.

+1
The most capable TD out of the 166. Or is that 164, two areas in Dublin are due by-elections.

heybaby wrote: »

The only viable government in a decidedly impoverished political landscape is a fine gael labour coalistion with gilmore as taoiseach.

If FG take far more seats then Labour then why would FG bend over as let Gilmore be Taoiseach. Possibly some arrangement has been done in the past and I could name a few town mayors which are shared among parties, but not the position of Taoiseach. Gilmore could be Tanaiste. (sorry, dunno how to type a fada on a mac)

Damo9090 wrote: »

Well if FG and Enda are running this country I'm out of here till they are gone!

Yeah, I've read that statement some many times from keyboard warriers. In fact, as another example, someone far more famous that you or me called Alec Balwin proclaimed he would leave America if George Bush got reelected. Oh yeah, how did that work out? :rolleyes:

shanel23

Sorry did'nt ead the rest of the thread but - oh yeah vote FG !

Mr Ed

I think a general election would be a good thing for the country. It will give the elected government a fresh mandate to govern the country during what is going to be one hell of a roller coaster ride

PrivateEye

Nothing will change regardless of who we vote for. We are just changing the people, it's the system that's the problem.

No matter who you vote for, the government get in.

Every major party has been in government now (Sinn Fein up the road in Norn Iron) and they've all dished out the exact same rubbish. Some constituencies record 40+% unattendance on the day of local/e.u/dail elections. Look at the turnout in areas like Dublin North, says it all.

Personally, I think if you have a problem with the system you should still go down the polling station. 'None of the above' or whatever takes your fancy, in fact in some countries thats an option itself!

Pay Freeze=Vote Freeze for FF, and as for the FG 'alternative', I don't think people will swallow it, especially if FG try feed its supporters the Lisbon Treaty once more...

****BUT it will be hilarious watching the Green Party get wiped off the map.

thebman

People that say there is no alternative should abstain from voting or just have their vote taken off them.

If your not willing to even consider the alternative then this isn't really democracy is it?

Same people are probably voting no to Lisbon because the EU isn't democratic enough for them

PrivateEye

People that say there is no alternative should abstain from voting or just have their vote taken off them.

I do.
I go to the centre, and abstain from the process.
I go to the polling station because I think if you don't get out of bed and at least make it clear you disagree politically with the structure of that system, you've no right to protest/organise against it. What I don't understand is people going 'FF are really sh!te so I'll give it to Joe Bloggs from FG' and then doing the same in reverse in 4/8/10 years.

I vote in referendums, because thats the people making a decision themselves (well, it should be :rolleyes: Least we forget...) I don't vote for unrecallable people who don't have to stick to any mandate whatsoever and can willingly play soap-opera in the Dáil (you take your Bev Flynn in, you kick her out, in out in out....) and make stupid amounts of money off the back of our taxes.

I voted for a bloke at a community meeting once, and a union meeting too, thats democratic. They're recallable, not making insane amounts of money of it and not in it for private gain.

As for taking my vote AWAY, because I favour direct democracy? Best of luck with that. What if I ever want to use it tactically? I.E when French libertarian socialists voted for 'the person who wasn't Le Pen' to keep Le Pen off the presidency? Its my right to a vote in this country.

If your not willing to even consider the alternative then this isn't really democracy is it?

Fine Gael/Labour?

Thought we had that a few years ago.Then IT got hammered and FF came back?

If by the alternative you mean Sinn Féin, no thanks

They basically tip-exed their way through their own manifesto last time round looking for votes, and ended up with one LESS T.D.

The reason its so shocking when somebody like Tony Gregory dies, is because people find it hard to believe sombody would go into the Dáil with the interests of others truly in his heart, take the average industrial wage and not seek mad money in expenses either. Good people get involved in parlimentary politics then too, but they're the exception and everyone knows it.

Lockstep

OP: I'm guessing your referring to this

Nowhere do I see any mention of Gilmore wanting to enter government with Fianna Fail.

I've heard Gilmore speak a few times and he has always talked of the importance of Labour creating it's own identity and not being the b!tch of FF or FG.

drkpower

PrivateEye wrote: »

I do.
I go to the centre, and abstain from the process.
I go to the polling station because I think if you don't get out of bed and at least make it clear you disagree politically with the structure of that system, you've no right to protest/organise against it. What I don't understand is people going 'FF are really sh!te so I'll give it to Joe Bloggs from FG' and then doing the same in reverse in 4/8/10 years.

If you vote for noone, you have no impact on the process.
Even if you dont particularly like any of the candidates in your constituency, would it not be better to vote in order of the people you dislike least....?! Its not ideal but at least your vote has some impact??

Assomeone said, democracy is the least worst system of government...

PrivateEye

drkpower,

I can see where you're coming at it from, its a well made point, but it just tackles the idea that people who oppose/campaign against voting are in some way all apolitical or lazy.

And I would agree 110% about the idea of the parliment being 'the most democratic form of government'. People who campaign for libertarian ideas often go missing in places like Cuba and Iran, I'd pick this any day

As for the least worst, again I know what you mean. I would never vote for the least worst bar somebody truly horrible was on the verge of election, i.e Le Pen in France. Historically the example of Anarchists in Spain supporting the government in the 1930s to help stop the rise of fascists is another example. I really don't think it makes that much difference in Ireland, but in the event of the likes of the Immigration Control Platform or the Christian Sol. Party ever seriously contending a seat in my area, I would vote- yep.

drkpower

Private Eye,

I agree with your points (if not your political philosophy....!)

But is there not also an argument for voting for FG/Labour in order to remove a Government which has not performed even if you dont believe FG/Lab are any good either.

At least it will contribute to one good outcome - that a non-performing government will reap what they sow!! Surely that would be of some benefit!!

Of course, if you think FG/Lab will screw the place up even more, then maybe thats not such a good idea.....

banshee_bones

kickoutthejams wrote: »

OP: I'm guessing your referring to this

yes! thats it, too lazy to go get the link coz saw it on tv.

Villain

Leave FF in for the sh1t times ahead, they need a good reality check and they have created the mess with their developer friends so let them work their way out of it.

Oh but do remember what Geroge Bernard Shaw said:

Demoracy is a device to ensure you are governed no better than you deserve

Yes you (the majority) voted FF in again

PrivateEye

But is there not also an argument for voting for FG/Labour in order to remove a Government which has not performed even if you dont believe FG/Lab are any good either.

Again, I can see where you're coming from on that.

In the current context, theres merit in that point tbh, that the thrashing of FF at the polls could be seen as a message to the political establishment as a whole, rather than an endorsment of FG?

I could not see any changes at all occuring in the long term though, so the thing of kicking FF now (which they deserve!) would involve another absolute tool of a man becoming Taoiseach, and us repeating the process again in a few years.

Its completely idealist and silly to claim people should never vote, like i said tactically theres a place and time. (I'd argue McCain-Obama, as there was mega changes in policy at stake and an international burden to) but Dumb and Dumber Dáil politics.....me no know. If people think FG look good now, as northern SF voters about water-tax, or southern Green voters about...well...the whole feckin' manifesto! We'd no doubt be havng the same internet threads about FG being behind the recession if they were the current ruling party.

Snowie

Ireland needs one thing.......

a complete restructure of management in all sectors..IE health, public transport council's the lot the hole lot.
The Irish mentality in general needs a serous shake up and people are still turning a blind eye to it...

How many threads a week are being opened about the countries and Our politics in general its a complete and utter sham.... Yet people on here still say FF those number are diminishing rapidly....

What this country needs to do is find people with vision we don't have it the government can barley see past there own noise's and that's whats killing it, they lack the idea's on how to make the country stable because they don't know how.....

Take FF, oh my dads dad and his father voted for them!
yeah so its family tradition, or maybe it's down to one thing where all missing BALL'S? to go against what there "family once would do"

It's a risk it's a huge risk... To trust a new government a believe in them... with political past it's not exactly Cosha....

Could a different party do better joined or unjoined ?

personally id rather give them the chance the watch F f**kin f make another heams of it...

Its time for change and not at a better time because if they can turn this country round even a small bit it'll be giving the Irish public in general a small gilmour of hope.

Sully

Cant see Labour taking the government on its own for a very long time at least. If anybody has a chance of topping it, its FG or FF. But, I cant see that happening.. Not sure the people will want a one party government.

I think if Gilmore did suggest a Labour/FF coalition he has turned off a lot of voters. FF would run rings around them just like the greens anyway. I mean, a LOT of people are peeved with FF and he goes and suggests joining forces? Cant see him being mad enough to suggest it tbh!

Its time that FF left. Clearly there in the position far to long and are doing more harm then good. Its time they left completely, not partly. I wouldn't mind seeing a FG/Labour coalition but id prefer Labour were not the leaders of the pack. While people dislike Enda - hes only one out of a fair decent party. They might all moan and groan but a lot of the time they make sense. Thats what you do as opposition anyway. You hear it more now as FF are just making a hayms of everything. There fixes backfire.

Im disappointed with the Greens and SF just dont appear on the radar for me.

At the end of the day - it IS time for change. Our change can come in the form of two and I think both FG and Labour are a safe bet. We cant keep FF in for christs sake. There IS a reliable change and it IS time we gave them a chance to see if they can fix the broken.

OPENROAD

Sully wrote: »

. I wouldn't mind seeing a FG/Labour coalition but id prefer Labour were not the leaders of the pack.

Due to our PR System it seems we are stuck with coalition governments so the only alternative to current government seems to be FG/Lab, though maybe FG/independents. Certainly wouldn't want to see Labour getting the Finance portfolio.

banshee_bones

would a FG/Labour coalition really be the worst thing in the world!?!!

Wouldnt mind seeing how they would handle things at the moment

Alessandra

At this stage I feel we need a National Government. There doesn't seem to be a decent leader between the 2 major parties FF and FG. Labour are the only party showing any purpose and leadership potential but they would never get enough support on their own. By pooling the brain power they would surely get a half-decent government to bring us through these times.

We have never needed more decisive leadership than in these past few months. It is apparent that Cowen is out of his depth. Our tanaiste is very weak and I fail to see her do anything other than "talk up" Brian Cowens leadership skills. Lenihan is a disaster and his budget will be forever remembered as one of the worst in the history of the state. If we do not curtail spending it is almost inevitable that there will be dire consequences ahead. There will be nothing left! Almost everyday we are told that they have unerestimated the extent of the deficit. I know it's crazy but I have been thinking someone as shrewd as Beverly Flynn would be a powerful figure to have as tanaiste. She is for all her sins a strong and confident person with intellect.

I don't know how long the current situation can go along. Cowen has almost dropped off the radar in the time we need our Taoiseach most. It would nearly make me suggest that they reinstate Bertie!:eek:

K-9

Villain wrote: »

Leave FF in for the sh1t times ahead, they need a good reality check and they have created the mess with their developer friends so let them work their way out of it.

Oh but do remember what Geroge Bernard Shaw said:

Yes you (the majority) voted FF in again

Nope, 41% did.

That's PR................LOL

Give me the first past the post system!

OH WAIT!

K-9

FF/Lab would pander to the Unions.

We already have that system!

Scarinae

The problem with democracy is that idiots also have the vote. If you're going to vote for a party because your parents and grandparents always voted for them, rather than because you have actually thought about the issues, then you shouldn't be entitled to a vote

[Deleted User]

It is going to sound pretty weird but Ireland needs a new progressive political party.

Lockstep

banshee_bones wrote: »

yes! thats it, too lazy to go get the link coz saw it on tv.

RIght, well if you expect people to believe your point that Gilmore expects a FF/Lab coalition you might want to bring up the evidence.

thebman

Deleted User wrote: »

It is going to sound pretty weird but Ireland needs a new progressive political party.

I don't think that sounds weird. Nobody will vote for anyone but the incompetent fools because they assume nobody could do a better job than them. That would cause a problem for any new political party.

0ubliette

Damo9090 wrote: »

Do you honestly Enda and FG can do better? All they know how to do is moan and disagree with what others say!

And this is the mentality that has kept FF in power and ****ing us over for so long.

"Ah i couldnt vote for Enda Kenny, hes no personality at all!"

You're electing a taoiseach, not a bloody entertainer.

For gods sake, ive heard of men in prison eventually turning gay from being bummed in the gob for so long, i assume thats the mentality here, 'ah well the current govt has been shafting me up the swiss roll for so long, i might aswell stick with them in case the next fella has a bigger langer!' :rolleyes: