Zaph wrote: » Not really that controversial imo. He was just one of a long line of talented, but vastly overhyped by the media, English players that has included the likes of Gazza and Beckham.
redout wrote: » Its hardly racist. I am sure if their is a top quality black manager then they are in demand ie: Rijkaard. There is probably a couple more but not that many. How many top quality black managers do you know ? Clubs aint going to hire a black guy just for the sake of it. They want quality and if the majority of them happen to be white then that cant be helped. Also the majority of the UK population is white so what do people expect.
ShoulderChip wrote: » ha you just don't get it, The argument is that black managers are not given the chance to become top quality managers, as they are not being hired. It is is as if it is not a possible career route for retiring Black FootballersWhat does the fact that the majority of the UK population is white have got to do with anything? the fact is the number of new managers that are black does not reflect the percentage of Football players which are black.
LuckyLloyd wrote: » Football desperately needs to address this problem. In the 16 years of the premiership, there have only been three black men appointed as managers. There is something wrong with that no matter how you look at it.
redout wrote: » I believe the best man should get the job. Why is it your saying black managers of quality are being discriminated against. Do you have proof of this ? Why is just them and not black players ? There is plenty of top young black players that are regularly snapped up the clubs. I dont get what your saying. Surely if a guy is good enough and the best candidate then he will get hired for the job regardless of race. The fact the majority of the UK population is white has a huge deal to play with it. Do you think there should be more black managers than white ? Demographics says no my friend, It is the same for every other job in that country. So I dont inderstand your reasoning behind that.
Boggles wrote: » :eek:
Do you think there should be more black managers than white ? Demographics says no my friend, It is the same for every other job in that country. So I dont inderstand your reasoning behind that
LuckyLloyd wrote: » This is really why I don't bother bringing up the subject. Your average football fan fails at at basic logic. The demographics of the professional football industry contrasts sharply with the demographics of the country as a whole. Simply put, the ratio of white : black in terms of professional football players is much closer than the ratio of white : black in terms of citizens of the UK. And then again, the ratio of white : black in terms of professional football managers falls more heavily towards the former than the ratio of white : black in terms of citizens of the UK. That being the case is a deeper issue than football is willing to face up to and admit. And it most definitely goes beyond a simple view of "best man gets the job - black managers obviously aren't the best men for the jobs".
ShoulderChip wrote: » What does the fact that the majority of the UK population is white have got to do with anything? the fact is the number of new managers that are black does not reflect the percentage of Football players which are black.
eagle eye wrote: » Its not all that surprising that you have not seen a successful black manager in the Premier league. Considering that only 5% of the British population is black and that most of them reside in England and less than 50% of the club managers in said league are English. So you should only see one black manager for every 20 English managers that are hired in the league and to find a successful one would be hard given that over the last couple of years no Englishman has managed to guide a club into the Champions League which I presume is the minimum required to be considered successful.
ditpoker wrote: » gotta disagree with the tone of this. I agree with the subject of it, i think minorities should be considered equally etc etc, but.. ... how many chinese managers are there? how many chinese players were there?... in the last 50 years, how many black players have there been? less than white. its only logical that there's only been 3... there will be more, but at some point there the following statements must be true... "there has only ever been one black manager..." "there has only ever been two black managers..." "there has only ever been three black managers..." "there has only ever been four black managers..." "there has only ever been five black managers..." "there has only ever been six black managers..." at the moment we are at three... there will be four, and then five... and then six... have to get past 3 to get to 4... the tone with which you've said it is like me saying "The USA has only ever had one black president ever... i think this should be addressed immediately..."
ditpoker wrote: » why arent there more black ceo's? why arent there more black chairmen? why arent there more black tennis players? why arent there more black formula one champions? if you ignore a general census stat such as population composition as at least a factor, you are very misguided. you cant dismiss population compostion as an issue... if you can... HOW DARE TRINIDAD AND TABAGO ONLY BRING ONE WHITE PLAYER TO THE LAST WORLD CUP!!!! RACISTS THE LOT OF THEM!!!
redout wrote: » Bollox brother. Show me the proof, actual proof and not theres only been 3. Then I might take what you have to say seriously. How many top class black managers can you name for me in Spain, Italy, Germany ? I cant think of many. So you reckon there is a europe wide conspiracy not to hire black managers ? Can you name me some succesful black managers bar Rijkaard ?
ShoulderChip wrote: » . You make a good point if and only if you include the word british in your first sentence before the word black. I don't see the need to make your argument in terms of british managers however.
eagle eye wrote: » Not British but English. The huge majority of the British black population reside in England. So English black is what I would be saying. And not British managers, but English Managers. My point being that there are currently only 9 in the Premier League and when you look at the age profile of those managers, well you have to remember that the game was predominantly white english when the average aged English manager was plying his trade. I don't know the exact average age of English managers in the Premier League but I'd imagine its close to 50 when you consider that Redknapp is 61 and Big Sam is 54.
ditpoker wrote: » ... sigh... ok, can yourself and lloyd please relalize that managers of today predominantly were either not successful mainstream footballers or were at their peak in the early 90's or late 80's or before that. The demographic of footballers was very much very much more white than black (i dont have figures not do i pretent to, you seem to make it out that you know thats its 50/50 now or something and therefore there should be 50/50 black/white managers). equally, cultural demographics suggest that black males live in less well off areas (again, this is an educated guess, if you wanna do a census check, be my guess), as such, the playing population of black footballers, in my opinion, as a general guess are less educated and less career driven that some white footballers. Alot of footballers (black and white) get thrown into youth acadamees in their teens and dont get a full education, and plan to be a "pro footballer" and retire in their thirties. My guess, and if im wrong im wrong, but my guess is that the majority of modern managers are well educated or come from educated backgrounds and are likely to be more career minded, be likely to be more willing to do coaching badges, training, etc, and as such, i would suggest that of the white/black players from the mid 80's to modern day, that the ratio of career minded white players with a drive to further their career and pursue management : career minded black players with a drive to further their career and pursue management is about equal to there only being 3 black managers thus far.
LuckyLloyd wrote: » Three black premiership managers: Ruud Gullit Jean Tigana Paul Ince Now think of all the premiership managerial appointments made over 16 years and the percentage of total hires that amounts to. Now think about the percentage of premiership appearances in 16 years that have been made by black players. And tell me there isn't an illogical disparity there.
ShoulderChip wrote: » That is a great point actually, except for where you say that I seem to make out that the ratio is 50/50 I do not at all, at all. I just said that the ratio appears to be slightly askew with the proportions of players, I did not factor in career aspirations as you have.
