humanji wrote: » Ok people, I know this is going to fall on deaf ears, but 28% of the population voted no. And a portion of that admitted to not voting on what was actually in the treaty. How is following the will of an ill-informed minority democratic? Think about it. If nobody except for 2 people actually managed to vote last time, and they voted yes because they thought it was about ice-cream, would you honestly want to honour that vote? Why not actually read the treaty (it's honestly not that hard, I managed it FFS, and I'm thick as pig shìt!) and deciding what's best for you? What's the worst that can happen? Sure if the treaty is really that bad for everyone, it'll be a no vote again. One day out of your life isn't going to make that much of a difference.
micmclo wrote: » well yes, both sides had voters hijacking Lisbon 1 for their own views on Irish political parties. I never posted it was only the No side doing this
niceirishfella wrote: » And why do you have such interest in our discussions on this treaty debate from your UK base?
walshb wrote: » a certain way, just because the govt is being dictated to by the EU Had some other countries had the vote, the feeling is that a lot would also have voted NO!
micmclo wrote: » Long thread so maybe it was posted already. Voting no to show your disgust with the government is ridiculous. Plus the main opposition parties campaigned for a Yes vote so you're achieving nothing. Vote on the issues and if you don't understand the damn thing, then ask here or the boards EU forum or the referendum commission or anyone you want. But if you want to kick the government then use the local elections and don't hijack this referendum
Keith186 wrote: » Hands up who wants bureaucrats in charge that aren't answerable to the public? That's what you'll get with a yes vote.
Biggins wrote: » What your going to get also is a lot of folk voting "NO" because they will realise that if Ireland votes again that way, the chances of Cowan staying in power after that will be extreamly slim. I'm NOT saying thats the right thing to do but being honest, thats the way some minds will look at the situation. I mention this because those that are sure the "Yes" this time will get their way, they better not place any money bets on it! There's still a chance it could go either way...
embee wrote: » In all honesty, I think that, if we are asked to vote again on the Lisbon Treaty I'll just abstain. The people have said no. The EU aren't going to make sweeping changes to Lisbon because it may involve having to get it ratified again in all of the other member states. We've said no. Unless it changes hugely, what's the point in voting on it again? I know that Nice was turned around because of an initial low voter turnout, but that wasn't the case with Lisbon. I just am not comfortable with being railroaded into voting yes because the current Government wants us too, so I will abstain.
Darragh29 wrote: » Yes voters on the last occasion were probably responsible for more people voting no than anything else. They came across as ignorant, superior, BMW driving, Terenure living, idiots who just didn't want their little gravy train interfered with, telling anyone who was voting no that they should stay in bed and stay out of the debate as it was obviously above their level of intellect...
dead air wrote: » That's ridiculous. This may be your personal view but can you really say the Irish people voted No for the sake of one-upmanship? I believe, and I think most people would agree, that Irish people voted No for genuine fears over Irish neutrality, abortion, tax isssues and losing a commissioner.
dead air wrote: » I believe, and I think most people would agree, that Irish people voted No for genuine fears over Irish neutrality, abortion, tax isssues and losing a commissioner.
ShooterSF wrote: » The quote in question was OTT. But, on the other hand you unconsciously yourself play the "low intellect no voter" card he reffered. I didnt vote No over non issues that you listed, most of which had nothing to do with the treaty. I think a lot of other No voters didnt either.
OPENROAD wrote: » I also believe people voted no because they were concerned by the expansion of the EU and influx of immigrants ( not my views/concern)
Darragh29 wrote: » Well abstaining is just fawning off the decision to other people who will vote. I've never abstained for any election ever, one thing I always do is vote.
embee wrote: » I've always voted too, but if they push us into another referendum on the same issue, then I'll abstain. Its a personal decision, I can't imagine many people will, but it's my own choice. The people have said no. This isn't like Nice, where a poor turnout was turned around when we voted a second time. I read the Treaty before I voted, it isn't that I was ill-informed, and for the Government to turn around and tell us that the majority vote isn't acceptable smacks of pure arrogance.
Darragh29 wrote: » Yes but I also felt that yes voters on the radio and generally all over the media were making out that anyone who was voting no basically either didn't know what they were talking about or else were all left wing loony's. I was as educated on Lisbon as any yes voter, but it didn't sit right with me. The following comments:“Public opinion will be led to adopt, without knowing it, the proposals that we dare not present to them directly … All the earlier proposals will be in the new text, but will be hidden and disguised in some way.” - Former French President V.Giscard D’Estaing, Le Monde, 14 June 2007. That were associated with the yes side, made me extremely cynical of a treaty that it would appear, based on the above, was made inordinately complicated specifically so that it could not be specifically interpreted in any particular way. The carry on from the yes side on the last occasion made me more determined to vote no and I have no problem admitting that. How dare any person tell me if I don't agree with them, then I have no business voting at all...
dead air wrote: » I agree with you on some of that. There are definitely elements of the Yes campaigners that were very condensing.
OPENROAD wrote: » I can see Lisbon 2 being passed easily, not necessary due to anything new in/out of the treaty or guarantees rather because of the downturn in the economy and peoples view that it is better to have the EU on side with us.
anonymous_joe wrote: » It's a pity voting isn't a legal requirement in this country, so that we could have viable results in referanda and votes. :
tedstriker wrote: » ...If it is a complex issue, which it is, then stop being so lazy to not learn. Take time to understand the issues properly then make a choice. If that choice is YES or NO then that is great because at least you will understand what you are voting for.
