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Biodiesel

JA12

I've started this thread because I'm finding it almost impossible to find places that sell bio-diesel to the public.

If you know of anywhere that does, in Ireland, please add it to this thread and give directions - because they are usually hidden out of the way at the back of some estate somewhere...

J.

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JA12

Royal Biofuels in Athboy sell biodiesel at 95c pl

2nd right on the Oldcastle road out of Athboy N154

I've attached a map - the green Star marks the spot.

J.

Cuauhtemoc

There's a place in Kilkenny that sells it too. When heading to Kilkenny on the Dublin road after you pass Paulstown it's somewhere on the right hand side. Can't remember exactly where(i'll check next time i'm down there) but they have a sign up for Biodiesel. Was about 80c a litre a couple of months ago.

pablo21

Newmans in Tyrrellspass manufacture and sell it also.

Nukem

Great Gas South of Charleville in Co.Cork has it

Jackie laughlin

Can an ordinary diesel car burn bio-diesel without modification? In other words, can I get a fill next time I pass through Kilkenny?

pablo21

I know a few people that used it and I think there may have been mention of changing filters or at least changing your filters more regularly? A by product of the use of it is a kind of transparent gel that appears to require more frequent fuel line servicing.

maniac101

JA12 wrote:

I've started this thread because I'm finding it almost impossible to find places that sell bio-diesel to the public.

If you know of anywhere that does, in Ireland, please add it to this thread and give directions - because they are usually hidden out of the way at the back of some estate somewhere...

J.

JA12, I fear that the list is going to be pretty short when you consider the thousands of forecourts in the country. The main reason for this is the Governments botched Mineral Oil Tax Relief scheme, which awarded excise relief to just 16 companies for restricted quantities of biofuels. Some of these companies have no production operations in Ireland at all, (while others actually import their raw materials). Meanwhile, companies already producing biodiesel in Ireland (from Irish crops) who haven't got excise relief can't compete on the forecourts with conventional fossil diesel. Instead, they sell their product to captive fleets, such as Cork City Council, who are prepared to pay the premium for the 'greener' fuel. This is why there are so few places selling to the public.

I think that your list of biodiesel retail outlets won't get much longer in the medium term either, as in future most biodiesel produced in Ireland is likely to be blended with conventional diesel. I suspect that oil companies trading in Ireland will soon be required by law to blend a portion of biofuels in their product. A 5% blend for instance, which is common in the UK, would require an amount of biofuel that is completely beyond the country's ability to produce biodiesel, and indeed well beyond its capability to grow biocrops.

JA12

maniac101 wrote:

JA12, I fear that the list is going to be pretty short when you consider the thousands of forecourts in the country....

That's why I started it, because they are so few and far between. I'm sure I'm not the only one that wants to know exactly where those few are!

J.

JA12

Jackie laughlin wrote:

Can an ordinary diesel car burn bio-diesel without modification? In other words, can I get a fill next time I pass through Kilkenny?

Absolutely.

I replied to this yesterday, but the board crashed - or at least the network did.

Here's the information I was given about Bio-diesel.

WHAT IS BIODIESEL?
Biodiesel is diesel fuel produced from Vegetable oils.

IS BIODIESEL THE SAME AS RAW VEGETABLE OIL?
NO! Biodiesel is an EU registered fuel produced to a strict specification (EN14214).

DO I NEED TO MODIFY MY VEHICLE ENGINE?
NO! EN14214 Biodiesel can run in any diesel engine WITHOUT MODIFICATION.

CAN I MIX BIODIESEL WITH PETROLEUM DIESEL?
Biodiesel can be blended at any level with petroleum diesel.

WILL THE PERFORMANCE OF MY VEHICLE BE THE SAME?
YES! Biodiesel shows the same mileage and horsepower as that run on petroleum diesel.

IS BIODIESEL BETTER FOR THE ENVIRONMENT?
YES! Biodiesel is non-toxic, biodegradable and reduces CO2 emissions by 70%

WILL THERE BE A SMELL FROM MY CAR?
NO! It is an odourless fuel.

More Info

Actually, it is not quite "odourless", the exhaust smells the same as the oil in a heated up frying pan. Not unpleasant.

There is one aspect of switching to biodiesel you need to remember, is that biodiesel will clean out your fuel system. This means that with old(er) cars that have been running on petroleum diesel will have a lot of grunge in their tanks, this will be flushed through by the biodiesel and you will probably find yourself replacing/cleaning your fuel filter more often until the grunge has gone.

If your vehicle is very old (over 15 years) and your fuel pipes are made of rubber you will need to change these to modern polythene pipes before using Bio-Diesel (all modern diesel vehicles have polythene pipes fitted as standard).

New cars should be phased in to the new fuel, fill the tank with petroleum diesel, run a couple of hundred miles and top up with biodiesel, do this for 4-5 topups, after that, you should be running on 100% biodiesel.

Biodiesel is produced from pure vegetable oil, soya, sunflower, hemp, etc through a staged process.

1. the oil is filtered to remove impurities
2. 2 chemicals are added to the oil to separate the glycerine
3. the oil is allowed to stand for 24+ hours to allow the glycerine to settle
4. the glycerine is drained off (sold to soap companies)
5. the oil goes through a further process to remove the chemicals
6. the oil is now biodiesel and the biodiesel is clarified
7. the biodiesel is sold to the customers !!!

You can do this process yourself, the kits are sold (online) in the UK, the kits available can process volumes of 50ltrs and up, and if you have a handy barn and a supply of vegetable oil, then why not (there's the added advantage that you could probably avoid the 37% excise tax this way as well) ?

biodieselwarehouse.co.uk/

Remember that any information on these websites on Tax is applicable to the UK not Ireland.

Hope this helps.

J.

maniac101

JA12 wrote:

That's why I started it, because they are so few and far between. I'm sure I'm not the only one that wants to know exactly where those few are!

J.

Fair enough. Four companies have received excise relief for production of biodiesel specifically. Biodiesel sold at retail outlets in Ireland will likely emanate from these companies, for reasons explained above. The four are:

- Irish Food Processors Ltd., Ardee, Co Louth
- Conoco Phillips Whitegate Refinery Ltd., Whitegate, Co Cork
- Biodiesel Production Ireland, Clonskeagh, Dublin 4
- Green Biofuels Ireland Ltd., Blackstoops, Enniscorthy, Co Wexford

You could try contacting them to find out which retailers they supply. This would give you the complete list.

JA12 wrote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackie laughlin
Can an ordinary diesel car burn bio-diesel without modification? In other words, can I get a fill next time I pass through Kilkenny?

Absolutely.

Just one word of warning here! For newer cars check with your dealer regarding warranty before using 100% biodiesel. Some manufacturers won't stand over the warranty if you use pure biodiesel. Citroen, I believe, recommend a maximum B30 blend. Problems have been recorded in areas other than fuel pipes. The seals in some Bosch fuel pumps for instance have been known to leak after prolonged use of 100% biodiesel.

JA12

maniac101 wrote:

Fair enough. Four companies have received excise relief for production of biodiesel specifically. Biodiesel sold at retail outlets in Ireland will likely emanate from these companies, for reasons explained above. The four are:

- Irish Food Processors Ltd., Ardee, Co Louth
- Conoco Phillips Whitegate Refinery Ltd., Whitegate, Co Cork
- Biodiesel Production Ireland, Clonskeagh, Dublin 4
- Green Biofuels Ireland Ltd., Blackstoops, Enniscorthy, Co Wexford

You could try contacting them to find out which retailers they supply. This would give you the complete list.
QUOTE]

The list you quote are bulk volume manufacturers and mostly sell to volume users.

There are other producers that do not receive excise relief that still produce it for sale directly to the public, Royal Biofuels, Athboy is one of these, they make their own and sell on site, directly to the public.

I'm hoping that there are more of these small producers around and it is these that would be of great interest to the readers, I'm sure.

J.

maniac101

JA12 wrote:

There are other producers that do not receive excise relief that still produce it for sale directly to the public, Royal Biofuels, Athboy is one of these, they make their own and sell on site, directly to the public.

What does a litre of biodiesel cost at Royal Biofuels?

JA12

maniac101 wrote:

What does a litre of biodiesel cost at Royal Biofuels?

95cpl

Raw materials + 37% Excise Duty + VAT

J.

JA12

I've been sending emails to John Gormley, as he is the most senior Green in the Government, as well as being Minister for the Enviroment.

John Gormley

(minister@environ.ie if that doesn't work...)

Might I suggest that some more emails got sent that way, it might make more of a difference if more people than just myself got on this bandwagon

maniac101

JA12 wrote:

I've been sending emails to John Gormley, as he is the most senior Green in the Government, as well as being Minister for the Enviroment.

John Gormley

(minister@environ.ie if that doesn't work...)

Might I suggest that some more emails got sent that way, it might make more of a difference if more people than just myself got on this bandwagon

J.

I'd suggest redirecting your emails to Eamon Ryan at the Department of Communication Energy & Natural Resources, as he's the man with greater responsibility in the area.

If your concerns are environmental ones, you could consider converting your engine to use PPO. It's more environmentally sustainable than biodiesel. There is a list of PPO retailers, but it too is quite short. Its here.

From an environmental point of view, it would be best if biodiesel produced here was blended with conventional diesel by the large oil distributors, as this would make it accessible to all motorists, and not just to the few who happen to be living close to the small operations like the one you refer to. It would also eliminate the potential engine problems associated with 100% biodiesel. I suspect that this will be the approach that Minister Ryan will ultimately promote.

JA12

maniac101 wrote:

I'd suggest redirecting your emails to Eamon Ryan at the Department of Communication Energy & Natural Resources, as he's the man with greater responsibility in the area.

Thanks for that, this I will certainly do.

The more "voters" that raise these issues, the more visiblity they will have in the Dail.

J.

JA12

maniac101 wrote:

If your concerns are environmental ones, you could consider converting your engine to use PPO. It's more environmentally sustainable than biodiesel. There is a list of PPO retailers, but it too is quite short.

My concerns are more to do with cost and the strangle hold the petroleum industry has on Ireland, than environmental, although that is a very nice side effect.

I'm thinking about PPO, but as I've only had the car for 2 weeks, I'm going to leave it a while longer before I start modding it to take PPO (I'm still cringing from the cost of the car!).

There are no PPO suppliers anywhere near me, so I'd have to source my own, or buy gallons of cooking oil in plastic bottles...

J.

Jackie laughlin

Thank you for the help with this.

I'm a recent and reluctant convert to the dangers of global warming. I saw this thread and thought that here was another little bit that I could do. I've also become very wary of some "solutions" and particularly of the Green Party, who frankly use global warming as a slogan but really are not much concerned. Now, what am I on about? Well, Maniac says above that a 5% contribution of biodiesel would require more land than we have. If this is accurate, then production of biodiesel should stop!

maniac101

Jackie laughlin wrote:

Well, Maniac says above that a 5% contribution of biodiesel would require more land than we have. If this is accurate, then production of biodiesel should stop!

I'm not sure I'd agree with you there. I believe that Ireland should fully exploit its potential to grow biocrops (but not at the expense of our ability to grow food), since home-grown biofuel is far more sustainable than fossil fuel. This potential (on land formerly used for sugarbeet and on set-aside land) is not being fully exploited at the moment, due to ineffective Government policy in my view. With current technologies, we've little hope of meeting the EU Biofuels Directive's target of 10% biofuels for transport by 2020 by using only home-grown crops grown on available arable land. Meeting this target, and indeed meeting the 5.75% target for 2010 will involve the importation of considerable amounts biofuels or biocrops. You'll notice that the shrewd biofuels producers in Ireland are locating their new plants close to shipping ports and not close to farms! Importing biofuels and biocrops is not environmentally sustainable. This has been highlighted by others in other threads on the topic.

I know that the OP was keen to keep this thread for listing biodiesel retailers, so apologies to JA12 for veering off topic here!

Jackie laughlin

Maniac,
Thank you.

My apologies too for going off topic.

It seems that what we need is an environmentally sound target which we could try to meet locally.

I'll stop now and leave the thread for its intended purpose.

Demonique

Jackie laughlin wrote:

Well, Maniac says above that a 5% contribution of biodiesel would require more land than we have. If this is accurate, then production of biodiesel should stop!

More land is used to grow food to feed livestock than is used to grow food for humans, if the world stopped stuffing its face with meat then there'd be enough land to feed the world's population AND produce biofuel

Eshaness

Getting back to the original issue- sourcing PPO or Bio-Diesel,
living in the northside of Dublin and finding it almost impossible to buy PPO as don't have a forklift to move or space to store 1,000 litre containers. Went to Athboy twice in last 2 weeks with my boot full of gerrycans- only to find that they sold out before lunchtime both days.

The time it took me to get there all of it was sold.
If anyone knows anywhere that sells PPO retail in or near Dublin I would be extremely grateful to find a regular reliable source!

AnotherYou

So basically what people seem to be saying is they'd be happier exhausting the reserves of fossil fuels and THEN looking for the alternate options?

We import fuel at present from some of the farest reaches on the globe. Anyone convinced there isn't enough land for this to be sustainable is only looking at this with one eye open.

Here's the problems, We can't get it anywhere. And where we can get it they're taxing the **** out of it?

Is anyone realising that this is a fuel with 70% less carbon monoxide emissions? And this is early days, these systems will be refined and improved as time goes on just like unleaded petrol has been.

Are we ****ing mental? I'm all for caution in the face of a "to-good-to-be-true" type of technology. But people are just shooting this down before its off the ground?

Simple question folks, Do you like how much Deisel is costing? Cuz its not going to get cheaper, and if it does it wont for long.

How about the ice caps and all that other **** thats so easy to forget?

Christ man, Lets try some optimism.

AnotherYou

Okay, rant over.

Sorry for the double posts.

Where can I buy a 1000 litre container of this stuff in dublin?

BendiBus

Eshaness wrote: »

Went to Athboy twice in last 2 weeks with my boot full of gerrycans

Even if you'd been able to get your hands on some biodiesel, I have to ask is it worth it to travel that distance? How much fossil fuel was used in the return trip? You'd need to recoup this just to break even. Even then it would have been of more value to the environment to have left the fuel to be used by locals as they don't have to travel to get the fuel.

Eshaness

Been told that the Great Gas petrol station in Mountrath has now started stocking PPO- but haven't been down that way recently to check it out. No idea what they are charging though. Next time I've to go down the N7 for work will check it out and bring a few gerry cans to stock up.

mmac

If you want biodiesel there is a place in slane if you turn towards kells at the castle it sells biodiesel in the first farmyard on the right they seem to have alot of it because they collect waste cooking oil. Runs well for me.
got a card of them www.slaneoils.com

D'Peoples Voice

The list of biofuel suppliers to the Irish market

D'Peoples Voice

We're even exporting it at this stage!

[URL=
http://www.newrossstandard.ie/news/huge-biodiesel-shipment-is-first-to-leave-new-ross-1679353.html]Huge biodiesel shipment is first to leave New Ross[/URL]

By Esther HAYDEN

Wednesday March 18 2009

A MASSIVE shipment of biodiesel, worth in the region of EUR 1 million, left New Ross port at the weekend.

Sunday marked the first time ever a tanker has been used to export biodiesel from the Marshmeadows based Green Biofuels Ireland (GBI).

The massive shipment of 2,000 tonnes set sail on the morning tide for Amsterdam. The shipment of second-generation biodiesel was loaded onto the 'MT Puccini' tanker at the plant the previous day.

The fuel is manufactured from used cooking oil and tallow, much of which is sourced locally, providing a big boost to the local economy.

When it arrives in Amsterdam, the biodiesel will then be sold to a number of different oil companies in the EU.

Production at the Marshmeadows facility commended in September 2008 with the majority of export sales being to the UK by road tanker.

The facility, which cost EUR 23 million to construct, has the potential to bring EUR 30 million into the local economy when operating at full steam. The plant employs 20 highly skilled staff members, who live locally and keep the plant operating 24 hours a day.

- Esther HAYDEN

Richie15

What's PPO?