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Why should I care about or help the poor and starving people of the world

JohnGalt

Seriously, why is it my problem

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rotinaj

TPD wrote: »

You pay for porn?!?

Yeah. Your ma dont do it for free;)

Macha

phenomenon wrote: »

Again this isn't my fault. I wish the EU didn't flood third world markets with our surplus produce but I'm powerless to make a change unless a referendum is held on the issue. The EU don't act in my name or represent me. Again I want to emphasize that I do sympathize with the world's poor and would happily give to a genuine charity but I'm not accepting the blame for their situation.

You're either part of the solution or part of the problem.

And what about ecological debt? What sort of ecological footprint do you have? Does your lifestyle require resources from other countries that Ireland's land area cannot provide? If so, you're part of the problem.

What exactly is your definition of a "genuine charity"?

Edit: Do you buy products that are so cheap that they cannot be produced without the violation of the rights of workers, ie Penneys?

brianthebard

phenomenon wrote: »

*sigh* I was waiting for somebody to bring this up...
Ireland never had any overseas colonies or slaves. Even if it did, today's generation can't be held responsible for something our ancestors did centuries ago. The whole "white guilt" argument has an antagonising effect imo. If I give money to Africa its out of sympathy, not guilt.

You clearly didn't even read my post, or don't understand the term neo-colonialism. Its not colonialism by political control, its much more insidious. Look it up before criticising.

tolosenc

Biggins wrote: »

Because "caring" separates us from the animals of this world...
Because "caring" reminds us that "there but for the grace of god, go I..."
Because "caring" acknowledges that we are just temporary tenants of this Earth, not owners...
Because "caring" makes us grateful for what we have, what others don't, reminds us of that difference and makes us more appreciative...
Because "caring" means you are a thoughtful, passionate, non-egotistical being that is willing to step forth and be counted...

Yes, Comrade.

phenomenon

taconnol wrote: »

You're either part of the solution or part of the problem.

And what about ecological debt? What sort of ecological footprint do you have? Does your lifestyle require resources from other countries that Ireland's land area cannot provide? If so, you're part of the problem.

What exactly is your definition of a "genuine charity"?

A genuine charity is one that makes sure the donated money goes to those in need and spent on food, clothes and shelter rather than to some loopy dictator who spends his countrie's budget on guns while his people starve.

I was born into a society that relies on electricity, industry and cars etc to function so of course I leave a carbon footprint and use up imported resources, just like you. You're as guilty as me on this one buddy. However, I'm not from a very affluent background and have only been on a plane once in my life so I'd imagine my carbon footprint is significantly lower than most others. On top of this I use public transport all the time as I don't have a car.

In fact its poor developing countries like China and India that are causing the most damage to the environment because they don't know how to handle waste properly yet.

Gummy Panda

d3mon24 wrote: »

Giving makes me feel a lot better.. Heres a usual credit Card statement for me..

Online Gambling 500
Porn 200
Barnardos 25
Useless other stuff 200

That 25 makes me feel a lot better about the rest

what the fcuk sort of porn are you looking at that costs 200?

Macha

phenomenon wrote: »

A genuine charity is one that makes sure the donated money goes to those in need and spent on food, clothes and shelter rather than to some loopy dictator who spends his countrie's budget on guns while his people starve.

Genuine charities do exist.

phenomenon wrote: »

I was born into a society that relies on electricity, industry and cars etc to function so of course I leave a carbon footprint and use up imported resources, just like you. You're as guilty as me on this one buddy. However, I'm not from a very affluent background and have only been on a plane once in my life so I'd imagine my carbon footprint is significantly lower than most others. On top of this I use public transport all the time as I don't have a car.

WoohoO! Admission of guilt! And yes I am as guilty as you - no avoiding it there. I was just making the point that actions here can impact elsewhere. The consumer does have a considerable amount of power.

phenomenon wrote: »

In fact its poor developing countries like China and India that are causing the most damage to the environment because they don't know how to handle waste properly yet.

Actually if it's taken at a per capita basis, Ireland does far more damage than either of these countries. It isn't correct to look on it in a country-by-country basis because these countries are then at a disadvantage by the simple fact that they are larger and have bigger populations. If each Chinese person had the same ecological footprint as the average Irish person, we would all be posting from our boat-houses.

RoosterIllusion

jordano wrote: »

What goes around comes around dude! You may need help some day.

Bull**** tbh.

TPD

d3mon24 wrote: »

Yeah. Your ma dont do it for free;)

So, you pay my ma to make porn, and then watch that? Seems quite an elaborate way of getting your rocks off, but whatever floats your boat.

Biggins

JohnGalt wrote: »

Seriously, why is it my problem

...if you really have to ask the question, no answer will be adequate for you to understand at this juncture of your life!

Piste

If you pay income tax you give to charity through the governments aid. No one "has" to care about or help anyone, dunno where the OP got that idea.

Macha

micmclo wrote: »

Rest easy OP

If you're a taxpayer the government is doing it for you:
The Government has allocated a record €914 million for Official Development Assistance (ODA) this year

€914 million is lot of money no question even if it's tiny fraction of GNP

When divided down per capita, it works out at less than €200 per person.
Wow. What a sacrifice, what charity.

By the way - the amount that we give is less than the 0.7% of GNP, as asked by the UN of every economically advanced country.

JohnGalt

Taking money from somebody by force and then passing it on to another country in the form of aid does not fit the definition of charity, and unless I evade tax (which I wouldn't mind doing) I can' avoid it. So quite obviously I am questioning why i should give to charity or help the poor or starving of the world through my own choice. I am am asking the question why should I care because it is often suggested that I should by various tv campaigns, charities, posters and billboards etc. The point that if everybody had my attitude the world would be a worse place holds no water whatsoever, firstly it is not the case, many people have completely different views than I do on this matter and they will continue to give and help out regardless of my attitude, so it is not really important, and secondly, yes the I am sure the world would be a worse place for the poor and starving if everybody decided not to bother with charity, but this doesn't mean it would be a worse place for me, it would probably be better in fact because I would not have to see another stupid Concern ad on TV. The point that it could just as easily be me is equally empty, as the fact is that it is not me who is starving and poor, I was not born in Ethiopia into poor family, I never will be, and I don't have to deal with that problem. I think one of the main reasons why people give to charity is a sense of guilt about the fact that they are living in an comfortable existence only through the absurdity of blind chance, while others are not so lucky. I should capitalise on this advantage to enjoy my life, not worry about others not born here and waste my resources trying to alleviate some senseless guilt.

Biggins

JohnGalt wrote: »

Taking money from somebody by force and then passing it on to another country in the form of aid does not fit the definition of charity, and unless I evade tax (which I wouldn't mind doing) I can' avoid it. So quite obviously I am questioning why i should give to charity or help the poor or starving of the world through my own choice. I am am asking the question why should I care because it is often suggested that I should by various tv campaigns, charities, posters and billboards etc. The point that if everybody had my attitude the world would be a worse place holds no water whatsoever, firstly it is not the case, many people have completely different views than I do on this matter and they will continue to give and help out regardless of my attitude, so it is not really important, and secondly, yes the I am sure the world would be a worse place for the poor and starving if everybody decided not to bother with charity, but this doesn't mean it would be a worse place for me, it would probably be better in fact because I would not have to see another stupid Concern ad on TV. The point that it could just as easily be me is equally empty, as the fact is that it is not me who is starving and poor, I was not born in Ethiopia into poor family, I never will be, and I don't have to deal with that problem. I think one of the main reasons why people give to charity is a sense of guilt about the fact that they are living in an comfortable existence only through the absurdity of blind chance, while others are not so lucky. I should capitalise on this advantage to enjoy my life, not worry about others not born here and waste my resources trying to alleviate some senseless guilt.

No more to be said then about yourself. The rest is obvious.

JohnGalt

Biggins wrote: »

No more to be said then about yourself. The rest is obvious.

Ominous..........

No really, what is that supposed to mean?

Macha

JohnGalt wrote: »

Taking money from somebody by force and then passing it on to another country in the form of aid does not fit the definition of charity, and unless I evade tax (which I wouldn't mind doing) I can' avoid it. So quite obviously I am questioning why i should give to charity or help the poor or starving of the world through my own choice. I am am asking the question why should I care because it is often suggested that I should by various tv campaigns, charities, posters and billboards etc. The point that if everybody had my attitude the world would be a worse place holds no water whatsoever, firstly it is not the case, many people have completely different views than I do on this matter and they will continue to give and help out regardless of my attitude, so it is not really important, and secondly, yes the I am sure the world would be a worse place for the poor and starving if everybody decided not to bother with charity, but this doesn't mean it would be a worse place for me, it would probably be better in fact because I would not have to see another stupid Concern ad on TV. The point that it could just as easily be me is equally empty, as the fact is that it is not me who is starving and poor, I was not born in Ethiopia into poor family, I never will be, and I don't have to deal with that problem. I think one of the main reasons why people give to charity is a sense of guilt about the fact that they are living in an comfortable existence only through the absurdity of blind chance, while others are not so lucky. I should capitalise on this advantage to enjoy my life, not worry about others not born here and waste my resources trying to alleviate some senseless guilt.

You can tell yourself the above arguments over and over but what it really comes down to is something that you are clearly lacking: compassion.

luckylucky

taconnol wrote: »

You can tell yourself the above arguments over and over but what it really comes down to is something that you are clearly lacking: compassion.

he's probably a 4x4 driver

Macha

luckylucky wrote: »

he's probably a 4x4 driver

LOL - I bet.

Actually, JohnGalt, according to Einstein, you're suffering from an optical delusion:

A human being is a part of the whole called by us universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feeling as something separated from the rest, a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty.

JohnGalt

taconnol wrote: »

LOL - I bet.

Actually, JohnGalt, according to Einstein, you're suffering from an optical delusion:

The only occasions on which I would be happy to have a difference of opinion with Einstein are when he moves outside empirical science and into philosophy, like he has done here.

MoominPapa

Sounds like someone has just discovered Ayn Rand

Macha

JohnGalt wrote: »

The only occasions on which I would be happy to have a difference of opinion with Einstein are when he moves outside empirical science and into philosophy, like he has done here.

How convenient.

EamonnKeane

taconnol wrote: »

You can tell yourself the above arguments over and over but what it really comes down to is something that you are clearly lacking: compassion.

But you feel compassion, then? Even though most of your wealth ultimately derives from the labour of desperately poor people the world over. Galt is performing charity, he's allowing all of us to feel self-righteous and clever. (And also trying to suck us into the Objectivist cult) People take altruism at face value, but is there any real reason why the suffering of cattle matters less than the suffering of humans, other than that we have decided that it does?

ScumLord

If somethings not done about all these poor starving people they'll be breaking into your house eating all your breakfast rolls.

gcgirl

I have no problem helping out crumlin childrens hospital or Svp cos i know thats its actually helping them and i think we have fair more worthy causes in ireland that need helping ! Look after our own !

Quazzie

I only ever give money to 1 charity and thats Crumlin hospital and thats only because they looked after me brilliantly when I was a kid and there after a serious accident and I never think twice about throwing a tenner at them every now and again.

Most of the rest and badly run and badly distributed money laundering scams

thelordofcheese

MoominPapa wrote: »

Sounds like someone has just discovered Ayn Rand

I am John Galt, and I'm here to ask you a question.
Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow?
'No!' says the man in Washington, 'It belongs to the poor.'
'No!' says the man in the Vatican, 'It belongs to God.'
'No!' says the man in Moscow, 'It belongs to everyone.'
I rejected those answers; instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose... Rapture, a city where the artist would not fear the censor, where the scientist would not be bound by petty morality, Where the great would not be constrained by the small! And with the sweat of your brow, Rapture can become your city as well.

MoominPapa

thelordofcheese wrote: »

I am John Galt, and I'm here to ask you a question.
Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow?
'No!' says the man in Washington, 'It belongs to the poor.'
'No!' says the man in the Vatican, 'It belongs to God.'
'No!' says the man in Moscow, 'It belongs to everyone.'
I rejected those answers; instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose... Rapture, a city where the artist would not fear the censor, where the scientist would not be bound by petty morality, Where the great would not be constrained by the small! And with the sweat of your brow, Rapture can become your city as well.

Sounds like someone else has just discovered Ayn Rand:pac:

stovelid

d3mon24 wrote: »

Porn 200

You spend 200 bills a month on pron? You need to attend a web-skills seminar.

thelordofcheese

MoominPapa wrote: »

Sounds like someone else has just discovered Ayn Rand:pac:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTnZu0mOSko

Learn to bioshock.

Degsy

brianthebard wrote: »

Because op to an extent,its your fault.maybe not directly,but eu and tnc interference and neo colonialism in the 3rd world is responsible for a lot of underdevelopment and poverty

Colonialism is the only reason any african country became prosperous.250 years ago they didnt know what the wheel was.
Giving aid to african countries is only serving to prop up corrupt regimes that are starving thier people whilst they live off the fat of the land.
Either invade and set the country right or leave them to thier own devices,africa is a money pit and no amount of guilt will change that.