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Tail Docking

SunnyP

My Boxer has never had his tail docked, he is bringle and his tail is amazing everyone admires it although it does cause some debate.

My vet has informed me that they will not be docking anymore boxer tails.

Do you agree with tail docking?
Has anyone else out there got a boxer with a tail?

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stevoman

while we are on the issue here i think it a fair to say that sometimes it is nessesary to dock a tail and once done properly and there is a valid reason for it!

funny though tail docking can create such debate in human society, but how many doctors has anyone heard of that wont circumcis a penis, espeically in jewish cirles!!! - sometimes is has to be done but other times ,like docking, its cosmetic!

whitser

also taking pups from their mother to a vets were there'll be sickness/germs etc... in the air is not a good idea. just so he can do something thats easily done at home.

Morganna

VEGETA has made a valid point by showing an injured tail .I have seen dogs having to have their tails amputated by the vet at an older age and they suffer greatly .Its better for them to be done at an early age even though i think its barbaric

Morganna

AngelicRaindrop wrote: »

I have to agree in some way with whitser. at the minute as far as i can see if vets refuse to do it the breeders will just do it themselves. our boxer (that was gotten from a rescue) had an awful job done on his.

this is going to happen on some level because of breed standards for showing. so is it not better for it to be done by a vet under an anesthetic with pain relief after than someone doing it with a stanley knife and a bucket of boiling water?

The tails have to be done at three days so they wouldnt get anesthetic even if the vet did it.I dont like tail docking but then i would say it is better done at three dayd rather than some eejit doing it when dog is older and believe me i have come acrosss some dogs that where done at an older age can you imagine the pain at that age.

whitser

working dogs tails arent cut to a stump,your are quite capable if reading the dogs tail movements. tails are only cut enough,basically 50%-75%,left on to stop damage when working.
i've bred about 3 litters of springers over the years,and docked the tails myself,i've also docked tails for other litters. when done properly its very quick and when you clean them and keep them clean there's no infection etc...
tail docking like everything is fine when done properly.
rather the pup suffer a quick pinch then a working dog suffer ever time he's worked.
my mates spring bitch's tail wasnt cut short enough and she bleeds from the tip every time she hunts and also just from it hitting of the back of her legs. so there is a practical reason for it.

Vegeta

Ah the old tail docking debate.........again

kerrysgold

It is cruel and unnecessary, it is taking away the dogs ability to show what it is thinking/feeling and I'm sure it must make it difficult for them to communicate with other dogs as well. You can tell so much from a dogs tail.
from a looks point of view, I think they look great as nature intended them to be! I didn't realise rotties had such a gorgeous curly tail like that, makes them look even more lovely.

BlackCat2008

Personally I don't believe a dogs appearance should be altered unless it's for medical reasons or damage. My own dog will be having her dew claws removed when she has to go under for something else, both me and the vet agree that this is best for her in the long run as she's hard to handle when it comes to trimming them and they've already caused her a few infections by growing back in to the skin they grow really fast and sometimes it's not until she lets a yelp after jumping around the you realise that the nail has broken the skin again.

I also work with a sniffer dog in the bush she's a spaniel with what looks to have had a badly docked half tail and she has as much a chance of ripping her paws, legs, ears, face and body on barbed wire or torn bushes as she would if she had a full tail, problem is she's so fast on her feet she's hard to keep out of trouble when she gets going but I really couldn't give a yah or nah for the working dog but I would say no in general to stop it because it is cruel and unnecessary for the average dog and still done with out the vet.

I vote to leave the tail alone and let them wag to their little hearts desire.

whitser

Guineapigrescue wrote: »

I've been in vets where pups have been brought in for tails to be docked and I could heard them crying (not a normal puppy cry an Im in pain cry) from the room they were doing it in.

It's totally pointless, the reason that some get them docked is because they are afraid the dogs tail will get caught or damaged in the undergrowth which is rubbish their ears could get damaged their eyes could get scratched doesn't mean their eyes need taking out or their ears removed. It's a poor excuse, esp. as there are some breeds that work in the field and have very long tails and aren't docked.

It's the most pointless thing ever.

your talking gick. the tip of the tail is very soft and prone to been damged when working in heavy cover...i've seen with my own eyes.
its for that exact reason that vets in england will dock working dogs and not pets.

whitser

well i've seen springers that had un docked or docked short enough tails and their tails will be very badly torn after a days work. i've also seen dogs that wag their tails so much that they bleed from hitting off their legs.
if its ok to leave tails on working dogs why will vets dock tails of working dogs in england,when they wont dock pets?

Jules

Yes i have, actually being a veterinary nurse i see a lot of things. We have a fair amount of clients that have working dogs and a lot of them have full tails. As long as they are looked after every day they are just fine. I have a lot of respect for people who have working dogs who actually take care of their dogs.. properly.

whitser

Jules wrote: »

Whitser that is bull. It is not essential for working dogs to have their tails docked. And it is not a simple and quick procedure. It is extrememly painful and totally unwarrented.

have you ever seen a spaniel or terrier thats spent a day working in thick cover? well i can tell you a un-docked wagging tail will suffer greatly. thats why in england its not illegal to have working breeds docked and most vets will dock for working breeds

The Sweeper

The arse-wiggling antics of docked-tail dogs are actually a bit sad. A tail is a huge part of a dog's communication and body language. They wag when they're happy, they stiffen their tails and often hold them erect when they're annoyed or aggressive, they lower them when submissive, they will hold them completely between their legs against their bellies when very frightened or completely submissive. There's a contented middle ground, an excited brisk wag when greeting another dog - a tail is a dog's conversation.

When you dock a dog's tail, you are effectively removing it's main form of communication. It has to vastly overcompensate to convey meaning to other dogs and to humans. You'll find docked-tail dogs wiggle their entire butts when they're happy - because they don't have a tail. They'll also pull their bottoms under them when they're submissive or frightened - again because they don't have a tail.

Docked-tail dogs can have huge problems socialising with other dogs because they find it so difficult to convey what's going on, with no tail to do it for them.

I won't say "It's like taking your child to the doctor and having their tongue amputated", because that's a bit of a ridiculous comparison, but the end result has a similar effect - you're volunteering your pet for an operation that seriously interferes with their ability to communicate.

I don't see how that's a good thing.

markos79

peasant wrote: »

Complete and utter rubbish !!

...of course they have nerves in their tails, or do you think they get implanted at a later stage?

(At that stage everything (including bloodvessels) is of course rather small and therefore easier to sever (and with less mess) than in a fully grown animal ...but everything's there alright)

relax peasant i was only stating what ive been told.

Sigma Force

I've been in vets where pups have been brought in for tails to be docked and I could heard them crying (not a normal puppy cry an Im in pain cry) from the room they were doing it in.

It's totally pointless, the reason that some get them docked is because they are afraid the dogs tail will get caught or damaged in the undergrowth which is rubbish their ears could get damaged their eyes could get scratched doesn't mean their eyes need taking out or their ears removed. It's a poor excuse, esp. as there are some breeds that work in the field and have very long tails and aren't docked.

It's the most pointless thing ever.

Jules

Would also like to point out that the Kennel Club are changing their views on docking and are also changing breed standards.

peasant

markos79 wrote: »

they have no nerves in their tails when they are less than 12 weeks old

Complete and utter rubbish !!

...of course they have nerves in their tails, or do you think they get implanted at a later stage?

(At that stage everything (including bloodvessels) is of course rather small and therefore easier to sever (and with less mess) than in a fully grown animal ...but everything's there alright)

markos79

i have two boxers and both have their tails docked the breeder i bought them from said it was done by his vet and said the boxers cant feel it when its done because they have no nerves in their tails when they are less than 12 weeks old so i was happy with that and i do prefere their tails docked also one of my boxers has had problems with his dew claw because he likes to dig up my back garden on a daily basis,he must of caught it on something and had to have it removed but it has grown back now ,if i knew they could have them removed as puppies i would of got it done as it would of saved my boxer from being in pain.

Honey-ec

manukahoney wrote: »

Ear cropping; thats so cruel.

The only down side of boxers not having tails docked anymore is that their whole bum wont wobble when they're excited.

But thats obviously a stupid reason. I'd imagine a boxer would entertain itself with its tail if it had one; mine certainly would anyway, shes such a clown!!

Ah yes, the oul infamous Boxer kidney-bean...

Mine chase their stumps anyway, so the docking didn't achieve much...

Madame Razz

Ear cropping; thats so cruel.

The only down side of boxers not having tails docked anymore is that their whole bum wont wobble when they're excited.

But thats obviously a stupid reason. I'd imagine a boxer would entertain itself with its tail if it had one; mine certainly would anyway, shes such a clown!!

Honey-ec

lightening wrote: »

I think they look way better with the tails docked!! :eek:

I guess that is just programing and my mind telling me a (for example) Doberman should look like this.... I suppose it is cruel though, there is no need for it. Hunting dogs would be more at an advantage with the tail than without the tail.

It is programming to a large degree, imo. The first time I saw a Doberman with natural ears, I thought it was weird looking, but now that you don't see them cropped at all anymore, the floppy look is now the norm, and I think a cropped Dobie would just look wrong.

I'm on a Boxer forum that's based in the US, where ear cropping is very much still the norm, and it has caused some very heated debate!

I do think that it's only a matter of a few years before tail docking follows ear cropping and is outlawed here.

lightening

I think they look way better with the tails docked!! :eek:

I guess that is just programing and my mind telling me a (for example) Doberman should look like this.... I suppose it is cruel though, there is no need for it. Hunting dogs would be more at an advantage with the tail than without the tail.

AngelicRaindrop

I have to agree in some way with whitser. at the minute as far as i can see if vets refuse to do it the breeders will just do it themselves. our boxer (that was gotten from a rescue) had an awful job done on his.

this is going to happen on some level because of breed standards for showing. so is it not better for it to be done by a vet under an anesthetic with pain relief after than someone doing it with a stanley knife and a bucket of boiling water?

Jules

Whitser that is bull. It is not essential for working dogs to have their tails docked. And it is not a simple and quick procedure. It is extrememly painful and totally unwarrented.

whitser

see nothing with tail docking,especially on working dogs like spaniels os terriers its actually essential. when its done properly at the right age its a quick and simple procedure.

SunnyP

Themadhouse wrote: »

Can i ask, why would someone get the hind dew claw removed?

When I first started breeding boxers I was told that the dew claw is removed as boxers commonly tear the claw when digging and playing etc so to avoid pain in later life this is removed when they are puppies.

Its recommended that the dew claw be removed in the first two weeks of puppy life although the claw can sometimes grow back.

It is worth noting though that a boxers dew claw doesnt touch the ground so it does need to be trimmed on occasion as it wont wear down naturally

All my boxers have their dew claws and they are very active dogs having their dew claws has never caused them any problems so I dont see the need to put them through having it removed.

Madame Razz

SunnyP wrote: »

Has anyone else out there got a boxer with a tail?

My boxer has a docked tail, but her father had a long tail, he was bred from two champions but was very ill as a young pup so they never docked his tail. As a result he couldn't be shown so he was sold quite cheaply.

Lovely dog tho, and the long tail doesn't look that strange at all!!

orchidsrpretty

Tail docking in the Uk is illegal. More and more vets in Ireland are refusing to do it also. I think the only people you will find who are still docking tails are the breeders themselves.

arybvtcw0eolkf

I was talking to a mate who'd just got a new Boxer puppy and had to travel from Dublin to Navan to have its tail docked because no Dublin vets will do them these days.

To answer the OP's Q. No, I wouldn't have a dogs tail docked.

gino85

i heard that a dude went to a vet to get the dogs tail removed but the vet wouldnt do it so the dude thought he would do it himself, poor puppy bled to death because he wanted the dog to have a ''certain'' look

2 of our dogs have had thier tails docked but we didnt do it to them, they were like that when we got them, our 3rd dog which was from a litter one of our dogs had still has her tail and we have no intentions to get it removed