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Garda Reserve Experiences

Bradidup

Dose anyone know that if you get in as a reserve are you posted to another part of the city?
I got an e mail from them wondering if i was still interested in an interview. I sent it off two weeks ago. I was told by a cop that the turn over rate is high.

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CO19

supra888 wrote: »

just read that whole thread on the GR and thought to myself why bother..
i'm a 35 year old sane bloke ( not power hungry hitler type or any of that sh1t )that was considering applying to become a reservist to do something constructive with my free time ,but while i could handle abuse from drunks etc why should i sign up to be treated with distain from people i am trying to help (full time members )...

Just go for it.

Bren1609

Marcus.Aurelius wrote: »

No, I don't think so. The attitude that allowed the reserve to even be contemplated is beneath contempt. They're a sorry excuse for full-timers and I feel sorry for them being caught in the crossfire between rank and file Gardaí and thoroughly incompetent ministers and senior officers.
We should be fully equipped and well trained, these reservists are a sorry compromise.

I think some of the comments on this thread reflect everything that is wrong with AGS. Just imagine any other organsisation that had free manpower and they complained about it.

I find it staggering that there are people on this thread who cannot find one positive thing about the GR. Not to mention this concept has been rolled out in various other countries and here we have the same old rinky dink Gardai complaining about the GR and if it wasnt the GR it would be something else or until something new came along.

Words and statements being used like "Hinderince" and "getting in the way". The exact same thing was said when recruits and women first started in AGS. There are older GR in my station that are coming up on their two year probationery period and they are far more competent than some full timers.

I have two question for any full timers reading this:
1. Which would you consider more valuable. A GR with 5 years experience or a full timer with 1 years experience?

2. Can you give me 3 TANGIBLE reasons as to why the Garda Reserve is not a good thing? These reasons have to be directly in relation to the GR. Reasons like "We don't have pepper spary because we got the GR instead" don't count as these are management issues and nothing to do with the GR.

Fyr.Fytr

supra888 wrote: »

just read that whole thread on the GR and thought to myself why bother..
i'm a 35 year old sane bloke ( not power hungry hitler type or any of that sh1t )that was considering applying to become a reservist to do something constructive with my free time ,but while i could handle abuse from drunks etc why should i sign up to be treated with distain from people i am trying to help (full time members )...

I felt the same and i did the same, then after talking to a few more i figured it was more people angry with the system and not the individual reserves, as you can see by my sig i took the plunge and just playing the waiting game now

civdef

Which would you consider more valuable. A GR with 5 years experience or a full timer with 1 years experience?

This is the sort of question which leads to ill-feeling.
Which of them will have more experience in terms of hours on duty? How about training? Maybe powers?

Bren1609

civdef wrote: »

This is the sort of question which leads to ill-feeling.
Which of them will have more experience in terms of hours on duty? How about training? Maybe powers?

No more ill feeling than some of the previous posts aimed at the GR's. The point is that in time there will be GR's that have more experience than full time members.

McCrack

Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Guys try to remember that every single person becomes a 'peace officer' if and when they are assisting Gardai. If thats a reserve, security guard or binman is not the issue. The issue is they are helping you deal with the violent drunks killing eachother outside McDonalds.

Thats alone means you should at least show some respect towards them. Its not their fault the whole thing was handled wrong.

In an ideal world yes.

A 'Peace Officer' is not everybody and anybody who assists a member.
A 'Peace Officer' is defined by s19 of POA1994 and amended by s185 of the CJA2006 to be a Garda, Prison Officer, Army, Fire Brigade and Ambulance Officer only.

gordotempo

McCrack wrote: »

In an ideal world yes.

A 'Peace Officer' is not everybody and anybody who assists a member.
A 'Peace Officer' is defined by s19 of POA1994 and amended by s185 of the CJA2006 to be a Garda, Prison Officer, Army, Fire Brigade and Ambulance Officer only.

A Garda Geserve is a member of An Garda Siochana with the rank of Garda Reserve. Therefore A Garda Reserve is a peace officer. It's in black and white look it up.

McCrack

gordotempo wrote: »

A Garda Geserve is a member of An Garda Siochana with the rank of Garda Reserve. Therefore A Garda Reserve is a peace officer. It's in black and white look it up.

My original point was that it is incorrect to say ANYBODY who comes to the assistance of a Garda is deemed a 'Peace Officer' and all the 'priviligaes' that that entails.

Whether a GR is is a Garda for the purposes of being a 'Peace Officer' is neither here nor there. For the record I'd be very interested to know actually. Could you point me specifically to these black and white sources you claim it is written in?

TheNog

McCrack wrote: »

My original point was that it is incorrect to say ANYBODY who comes to the assistance of a Garda is deemed a 'Peace Officer' and all the 'priviligaes' that that entails.

Whether a GR is is a Garda for the purposes of being a 'Peace Officer' is neither here nor there. For the record I'd be very interested to know actually. Could you point me specifically to these black and white sources you claim it is written in?

A civialain is not deemed a peace officer in law but there is provisions for that person to use the most serious power of a Garda and that is the power to arrest another person as conferred under Section 4 of the Criminal Law Act 1997.

http://acts.oireachtas.ie/zza14y1997.1.html#zza14y1997s4

CO19

TheNog wrote: »

A civialain is not deemed a peace officer in law but there is provisions for that person to use the most serious power of a Garda and that is the power to arrest another person as conferred under Section 4 of the Criminal Law Act 1997.

http://acts.oireachtas.ie/zza14y1997.1.html#zza14y1997s4

Ah but you can't beat a good oul whipping

...section 12-1

gordotempo

McCrack wrote: »

For the record I'd be very interested to know actually. Could you point me specifically to these black and white sources you claim it is written in?

Garda Siochana Act 2005. Check out S3. Interpretation. Have a look at what S.15 says:(3) Subject to subsection (5), a reserve member has, while on duty,the same powers, immunities, privileges and duties as a personappointed under section 14 to the rank of garda.So the powers are there they just haven't been rolled out yet.Here is the link. http://www.oireachtas.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=4359&CatID=87

Bren1609

Marcus, In you first post you said that you had no experience dealing with reserves.

Marcus.Aurelius wrote: »

They're described as immature, volatile and agressive and a bit stuck up. Some members are fed up to the back teeth with them.

But it could well be different in other places. I've no personal experience of working with them, I'm still plugging away in Traffic

Then in one of your next posts you said this:

Marcus.Aurelius wrote: »

I hate the reserve idea, and the attitude displayed by many of them, just power/status hungry and aggressive tools without a shred of feeling for their fellow man

I curious to know how you formed this opinion considering that by your own admission you had no personal experiences of working with reserves???

the locust

McCrack wrote: »

In an ideal world yes.

A 'Peace Officer' is not everybody and anybody who assists a member.
A 'Peace Officer' is defined by s19 of POA1994 and amended by s185 of the CJA2006 to be a Garda, Prison Officer, Army, Fire Brigade and Ambulance Officer only.

I was told Student Gardai are now covered as 'peace officers' under the legislation as well as GR... "members of An Garda Siochana"

Marcus.Aurelius

Bren1609 wrote: »

Marcus, In you first post you said that you had no experience dealing with reserves.

I have no working experience with reservists

I curious to know how you formed this opinion considering that by your own admission you had no personal experiences of working with reserves???

I trust the opinions of my friends and have had drinks with several GRs.

Marcus.Aurelius

Bren1609 wrote: »

I have two question for any full timers reading this:
1. Which would you consider more valuable. A GR with 5 years experience or a full timer with 1 years experience?

2. Can you give me 3 TANGIBLE reasons as to why the Garda Reserve is not a good thing? These reasons have to be directly in relation to the GR. Reasons like "We don't have pepper spary because we got the GR instead" don't count as these are management issues and nothing to do with the GR.

1. A full-time member is infinitely more useful, irrespective of experience, he has more than just an emotional link to the job, it is his everything, his mortgage, his lifestyle, his home and his legacy.

2. (a) Government clearly views them as an acceptable alternative to fully-trained and responsible members of a national police force, which they are quite clearly not

(b) Babysitting GRs just wastes more valuable time and resources, I wouldn't trust them on public order

(c) The quality of the candidates has been in my colleague's experience, rather lacklustre and emotionally unreliable.

(d) Policing is not a part-time job, it's a state of mind as much as it is a career.

EDIT: Your naive assertion that the reservists are not to blame for the lack of improved facilities is ridiculous. It was a rather cynical smokescreen to defer attention from the more serious issues at hand in AGS. The GR scheme is a pathetic stop-gap effort, nothing more. And if you really think that senior management give a flying ****, you are sadly mistaken. They ain't promoted for their ability to change things, they are "yes" men. Always have been, always will be. They only change the things that suit them, i.e. things that do not change the reality of the job.

Bren1609

In effect what your saying is that if there was no GR, AGS would have all the equipment and resources that they need. Remind me who is being naive???

the locust

Bren1609 wrote: »

In effect what your saying is that if there was no GR, AGS would have all the equipment and resources that they need. Remind me who is being naive???

Dont know how you got that flippant statement from what he said!?

But yeah if there were no GR.... obviously the budget money would be spent on something, most likely better equipment i.e. tetra, pepper spray, vehicles and better training/cpd would it not???

gilly0512

the locust wrote: »

Dont know how you got that flippant statement from what he said!?

But yeah if there were no GR.... obviously the budget money would be spent on something, most likely better equipment i.e. tetra, pepper spray, vehicles and better training/cpd would it not???

Even if the Garda Reserve was dropped tomorrow, I doubt you would see any great improvement in Garda equipment. We all know that every government department is crying out for more money, be it health, education, justice etc, so that is something that will never change, no government department is ever satisfied with its budget, and always wants more. At the end of the day the government has set up a Garda Reserve, to the delight of some people and disgust of others, but for some strange reason has decided that Garda Reserves should have the same powers as a lollipop lady. Therefore at the very least they should give it a chance to work properly by giving reserves proper powers, and only then can the Garda Reserves be properly judged.

Marcus.Aurelius

I never said all our equipment woes would end if the GR was done away with. I said they're being accepted as an alternative to decent funding and expenditure on useful policing requirements and equipment.

Read my post thoroughly before you hop on your offendi-horse.

Bren1609

the locust wrote: »

But yeah if there were no GR.... obviously the budget money would be spent on something, most likely better equipment i.e. tetra, pepper spray, vehicles and better training/cpd would it not???

Well no it wouldnt. As you probably already know AGS has been crying out for equipment, training etc for years even before the GR. The GR budget is approx €1m per annum which is miniscule in comparison to the overall budget of €1.6 billion.

Fact is, The Garda Reserve is now a reality and there are approx 300 Reserve members working with your members around the country. You should also remember that the Reserve is operating as a recruiting ground for future full-time Gardaí. Some Reserve members have already gone on to become full-time recruits, including myself, and will one day become your fellow members.

Marcus.Aurelius

Their existance is something I have accepted, I accept they don't cost much. But when you consider the manpower hours lost in babysitting them as well as the training costs etc., I imagine it costs a bit more than that per annum.

Their perceived success could lead to increased use of them rather than actively improving the quality of the service.

deadwood

Bren1609 wrote: »

You should also remember that the Reserve is operating as a recruiting ground for future full-time Gardaí. Some Reserve members have already gone on to become full-time recruits, including myself, and will one day become your fellow members.

That's one of my objections to the Reserve. In theory, I support it but it is being used to bulk up numbers which is unfair to Reserves, Full-timers and the public, who pay for the lot.

My main gripe is that the Reserve IS NOT meant to be a recruiting tool. It is meant to allow people who might otherwise not have any real involvement in their community to give something back. It is meant to be done in the spirit of volunteerism. If you want to join the guards, join. If you want to become a reserve, do that.

Unfortunately, applicants to the force will now be asked why they haven't joined the Reserves.

I think i'm repeating myself from a previous post, but I think it's unfair to assume every Reservist is in it with a view to joining the force full time.

Fair play to any person who joins to do something for their community. They'll have my support if I ever meet one - 300, really?!

boardsbandit200

"They'll have my support if I ever meet one - 300, really?!"

Woa woa woa didn't you ever see the film 300- they kicked ass against hundreds of thousands

deadwood

boardsbandit200 wrote: »

"They'll have my support if I ever meet one - 300, really?!"

Woa woa woa didn't you ever see the film 300- they kicked ass against hundreds of thousands

I didn't realise cake decorations were such trouble makers.

Now, stay on topic (another minority gang) or i'll get given out to again!;)

boardsbandit200

I wish People would get off the garda reserves backs- it is challenging enough without getting roasted from "traffic" people no less- who have an unbelievable slice of the budget rite now and give out about maybe a couple of million (at most) that the reserve gets what harm do they do?

the reserves can only get better- can learn from mistakes and time will iron out any minor "bumps". Most of them just want to help out and are not power hungry at all, in fact i've talked to many reserve who say they joined because they are concerned about what way their community is turning for their kids.

Crime gets worse in this country every year- it is the people themselves who can help lower crime so whats the harm in having a "liason" between the community and the gardai- if that liason is the reserve then so be it.

If neighbours know that a garda reserve lives beside them or close to them- i ask you will it make them feel more secure?

gilly0512

Marcus.Aurelius wrote: »

I never said all our equipment woes would end if the GR was done away with. I said they're being accepted as an alternative to decent funding and expenditure on useful policing requirements and equipment.

Read my post thoroughly before you hop on your offendi-horse.

Marcus I am sorry that you think I am getting on my high horse, as I certainly didn't mean to give that impression. My gripe as is yours is with the Minister for Justice/Garda management, as like you I also belive that the Gardai should have the very best of equipment etc, but I also firmly believe that since they have gone to all the trouble of setting up a Garda Reserve, that it should be given a chance to actually make a difference, by giving us more powers and more autonomy.

Dinter

I’ve thought a lot before posting this as I don’t want to come across as Garda bashing etc. However this is just a collection of my opinions which are, probably unfortunately, not edited.

The Gardai on here who dismiss the GR as a waste of time due to their “powerlessness” or the fact they’ve to be “babysat” should really look at the message they are sending across. Perhaps, in fact, it’s time for a refresher course on Customer Service.

Your job is to only enforce the law when the Law needs enforcing. The rest of the time you are meant to be guardians of the peace in the interests of the public. You are public servants whose very presence should instil respect but more than that security.

I know it’s great when you’re talking up your job to your mates to go on about how interesting and exciting it is. Foot chases, car chases, catching baddies and cleaning up the streets but whilst that’s what’s portrayed that’s not actually what happens.

For every chase there’s 30 perfectly reasonable conversations with the public that don’t involve any skills beyond what a reserve has from his day-to-day life. For every arrest there’s 100 nods to civilians to reassure them by a simple police presence. Do the contemptuous Gardai on here think there’s any particular skill to wearing a uniform or being seen walking the streets?

While the Reserve might cry out for more powers to somehow save the world and feel unnecessary without them it’s not your role. You are not to replace the Gardai but to support them. In fact forget about AGS altogether. You support and reassure the public. That is your role and one that because you fill a uniform you do reasonably well.

This business of being babysat should not even arise. Only the worst kind of Garda think they are somehow in desperate conflict with Joe public 24 hours a day. We hear stuff like “if I’m in a fight I’ll have to look after the reservist”. The answer to that is no you won’t. Look after yourself first obviously. Also will a fight occur easier when a person sees there is two near indistinguishable Gardai instead of one? How many shifts have you had where you’ve done nothing except patrol around with no hint of violence etc. Seriously get a grip. Anyone who’s willing to fight a reservist would be willing to fight a full timer but perhaps wouldn’t be willing to fight two people.

To full time members I say the following. The danger here is that the Reserve was set up as a Public Relations stunt. However it was not the PR stunt that full time members think it was when they’re justifying their dislike and mistrust of volunteers. The Reserve is a PR exercise on behalf of AGS as an organisation. It is a way for the public to get a glimpse at the workings of a closed and in some areas discredited organisation. They could then provide the best of PR. Accurate, incisive and creditable stories about the difficulties and hardship full timers operate under.

It must be plain to many Gardai that in a lot of areas they are despised. In my opinion irrationally but that’s not to say without reason ridiculous as we might find them. The “bad apple” defence doesn’t work because as a force that is now in some way under siege the audience for such a defence is vastly diminished. Gardai are now seen as solely representing AGS.

However they than get a group of eager, vibrant, enthusiastic people who for the most part seek nothing more than to help the public. In return for which they are abused and dismissed on here, in public and in the media. The Gardai complain about being vilified but for the most part care nothing for the fact that their colleagues (because they are colleagues) get it worse. How long before AGS wrecks the confidence of their volunteers and suddenly reaps the whirlwind of a disgruntled and demoralised group of civilians with intimate knowledge of the workings of AGS?

So we disband the Reserve. Does nobody foresee public criticism of that? AGS might say it’s because of wasted man hours or whatever oul shoite they like but let us be honest. The meeja and, through them the public, will see AGS as desperately covering themselves from public scrutiny. It could be a PR disaster and shock to public confidence on the scale of the blue flu.

metman

Dinter wrote: »

Do the contemptuous Gardai on here think there’s any particular skill to wearing a uniform or being seen walking the streets?

Its not just about being a uniform carrier though is it? The reason police training is lengthy and diverse is quite simply because when you put on the uniform and 'walk the streets' you are expected to be able to deal with any eventuality that arises, be it a lost child or a terrorist attack. More than that you are duty bound to deal with it.

While you might think there's no skill in wearing a uniform, I'd suggest that the general public rightly has a high expectation that those walking down the street in police uniform, are equipped with the skills, training and experience to respond to a call for help, whatever that call may be. In so far as that call might encompass anything you can imagine, then I'd say actually wearing the uniform and walking the beat does require a considerable measure of skill.

Dinter

metman wrote: »

Its not just about being a uniform carrier though is it? The reason police training is lengthy and diverse is quite simply because when you put on the uniform and 'walk the streets' you are expected to be able to deal with any eventuality that arises, be it a lost child or a terrorist attack. More than that you are duty bound to deal with it.

Which is why Reserve patrol with a full time member.

They should take their lead from him.

egan007

gilly2308 wrote: »

...Therefore if the Garda Reserve is to survive, the powers that be have to start giving Reserves more responsibilities and powers, say after two years they get Public Order, third year they get section 23, and so on, with Reserves getting more powers as they progress. By giving Reserves more powers, will allow us to stand on our own two feet, to be held accountable for our actions, and only then can it be seen if the Garda Reserve is truely working or not, as it is most definitely not working in its present format.

Why don't you just become a Guard if it's powers you are after?
What did you expect, the state would bestow power outside the law?