muffler wrote: » Despite the perceived notion that it will have no relevance people should really inspect the draft plan and offer their opinions and submissions - yes it does make a difference (sometimes anyhow) so please dont sit back and leave it to someone else. Its a bit like voting in an election in a way - people tend to think that their vote wont make any difference - can you imagine what would happen if every single person adopted that approach.
magnumlady wrote: » So if we wanted to say that we wanted an Argos, would we have to submit a map of the area that we wanted it in? I don't mind where it goes to be honest.
tuppence wrote: » Totally agree, wise words. (Shockingly agreeing with you Muffler :eek:). We cant go round complaining about things if we havent at least tried to do something about it. hey is this where we can complain about the like of O Connell street and lack of developmet as public amenity , lack of Toliets, lack of parking, lack of free public festivals and regular markets, lack of disabled friendly transport.....Argos is but one aspect but its an important one on the shape/development and potential sprawl of the town wasnt it?
muffler wrote: » . As I said it is important that people make their views be known. If they dont the planners assume that everyone is happy with their proposals and hey presto you have things happening (or not happening) that you were not aware of or in agreement with.
il gatto wrote: » Having witnessed such a planning consultation in the past, I would suggest one is urinating in a heading diametrically opposed to the wind. Your views are heard, noted even, then ignored, because they're the planners and they know best. The Co. Co. know what your views are re:Argos. They're the same as the vast majority of Sligo people. If they had any intention of doing what those people wanted, they could have done it several years ago. This is a lip service to make people feel included and they can refer back to it when challenged about inclusiveness. If Argos are allowed to come to a site they want, the planning office will say it's because of this consultation. If they're not allowed, this consultation will never be spoken of again. It'll only serve what purpose the Co. Co. finds suitable but it won't do any good to participate unless you're an "interested perty" i.e. in a particular party or a businessman of some local standing. It may sound cynical, but from numerous past expierences, that's the way the system works in Sligo. May do elewhere too, but I wouldn't know apart from hearsay.
tuppence wrote: » Its not all a big conspiracy theory is it? Some of it might (might) be about some qualified people doing a job, abideing by planning restrictions, which may even be there to protect inhabitants of our county/country and of our environement. There are restrictions that they have to abide to for a reason, eg the retail guidelines, or restrictions I presume to protect green belt sites and our heritage whatever. Its about been able to monitor the job they are doing about the long term vision of Sligo as well as us having an impact to it. Its also a way of informing ourselves surely. We can'nt relax things for a short term gain, cos its fashionable to have Argos here at the moment and tomorrow then what Ikea. If we do we need to see the impact. What kinda place would/could that make Sligo to live in? What kind of legacy might that leave to our kids to our visitors if we create a urban spawl etc. Its the main sanctioned avenue of feeding back and whatever way you look at it, at least if you input to it they have to keep a record and it has to be transperent. The more people make submissions the more they have to take heed I would have thought, the less it can be tokenistic. (Phew glad Il gatto decided not to go for mod, twould be crucifixon for me :eek:)
il gatto wrote: » Without being too simplistic, explain what reason they used to justify what difference having Argos would have made to Sligo and it's environs. In the broader scheme of things, being able to buy a toy/saucepan/armchir from Argos outside of the town's prescribed boundry for such things , or buying it from Toy City, Homebase or whoever makes absolutely no difference to anybody. the fact is the "interested" parties took fright at Argos and ignored the threat of the other retailers. They concentrated their pull on Argos, hence it was banned. It's a rotten system, absolutely and totally. The Co. Co. know people's thoughts on alot of such issues, and they hide behind doing what's best for us. Argos moving into Unit 4 instead of Land of Leather would not have negatively impacted on anyone's life. The green space was built on. There was no reason for it to be done other than placate the people who matter more in Sligo. It's not a conspiracy theory. It's just the way things work. The amount of representations will make it less tokenistic, only if those representations don't thread on some business person's or politicians toes. Otherwise, they'll be ignored.
il gatto wrote: » Do you believe there's any will in the Co. Co. to bring about proper public transport, affordable housing or public spaces in any meaningful way? Argos is just a symptom of a deep rooted apathy amongst our local polititions and civil servants. The fact that a single retailer is singled out like that is bizarre. More random is the decision to not allow a major grocery store to locate on the outskirts of town. I've yet to see another town that has outlawed this. Are we so very far advanced in Sligo? Have Sligo planners discovered something planners all over the world have not? As an indulgence, I'll give an example of Sligo planning. The field which borders my fathers land has been granted planning permission for 10 two storey houses. My fathers land is in a scenic area, deemed a buffer zone, where no developement will take place. Except for some neighbours, who sold sites with planning, planning granted as "gap filling". Therefore the guy over the hedge can build a small housing estate, and on the other side the neighbours can perpetuate ribbon developement along our roads, while at the same time, I can't build on my family's land, even though the house would be invisable from the road and would be far less obstrusive than the 10 houses next door. There's no point coming up with these draconian measures which seemingly apply only to certain people, and allowing rampant developement elsewhere. I won't waste my time on these people, so they can look for representations from elsewhere.
magnumlady wrote: » But the shops in Carraroe are already selling non bulky items: Toys, curtains, plants, packets of nails..........the list is endless. So how is it OK for them, but not for Argos who also sell bulky goods and smaller items. One rule for one and one for another. When you do your weeks shopping in the supermarket it turns into a bulky item as well because of the amount of shopping you have. It makes more sense for a supermarket to be in Carraroe then the hassle of trying to drive into town, trying to find a parking space and possibly ending up in Connaughton Road and having to try and push a trolley all the way up there. I'm waiting for the day when the trolleys will be dumped all over the place. In fact this is already the case judging by the few I've seen in the river.
magnumlady wrote: » Even if they put a supermarket in Carraroe there would still be ones in town to cater for people that don't have cars. The majority of people don't live in the centre of town anyway and have to find some kind of transport to get their shopping. Maybe one day Sligo might have internet grocery shopping.
tuppence wrote: » So what are you going to do, make bad decesion making worse by letting shops sell stuff other than warehouse and bulky type stuff (my interpratation) in Carraroe cos of inconsistencies in the past. Maybe they were pulled up on the directive. (If not just by retailers with vested interest that’s not necessarily the viability of the centre) You can’t have a free for all surely, that will certainly change the way Sligo has a potential to be. (Lonely planet seemed to think it’s got something going for it) You want to keep a vibrnat centre and this woudl nt be the way to d it imo anyway. The development at the waterfront is good; pedestrenisation of O Connell Street was a good idea for the public (not for the traffic mind) but needs to be finished. Yes the infrastructure isn’t there either for buggies, wheelchairs etc and accessibility on the streets yet but it can be and it can be pushed now perhaps. (Disability legislation hopefully will ensure that road and pavement work on the centre can be accommodating for all). Now they need to be doing more of the same with the recreational areas. What’s wrong with having for whatever reson an indigenous mixed base of shops as a start? At least its not a carbon copy of towns all round Ireland at the moment taken over by same brand shops. Maybe because of sequential planning or entrenched views or something there my still be a chance to make Sligo a planned town.(opphs) Accountability has to start somewhere. It may well be that Berties political career may meet an end by his own sword. That would be a good symbol for a fresh start. Anyway there is talk that the Greens pushing to reform local government. I would like to think tokenistic consultations might be a thing of the past. Until then if you haven’t got into the plan you certainly don’t have a chance on prioritising what you want getting done. (Hope)
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