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Why is DIT so bastardly?

experiMental

there I was, in the beginning of the year, during the induction week, when I was told that I wouldn't have to worry about advanced business and marketing concepts, since I was a product design student....

then on Monday, BAM! I was given past exam papers, and the questions were the same standard as those for marketing students.

We were then told that a minimum of 4 pages should be required to write per 1 question, in 25 minutes. Even worse, the lecturer finished off by saying that marks for marketing among product design students were high last year.

I asked some second years, and they told me that many have done brutally in marketing exams last year.

I have never felt more cheated in life.

Is this normal throughout DIT? Or is it just a case with my course only?

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6th

I got screwed in a similar way back when I studied Fine Art ....... I mean I chose Art to avoid real subjects!

Frankiestylee

Depends on whether your course is a taught one or not. Hmmm... maybe that's the wrong term. I can't remember, but if your course is one that's meant to be fully taught to you, then they should only be able to exam you on what you've done in class. If on the other hand it's one where you have to go off and read a considerable amount to fill in your own knowledge, well, then they obviously weren't meant to cover it in class.
If you did a marketing element in your course then you should expect to get examined on it, simple as that really... especially since past exams exist to prove the point.

enner43

Yeah that sounds about right. I dont know what it is with DIT. I find that they seem to make things up as they go along.

strychnine

experiMental wrote: »

there I was, in the beginning of the year, during the induction week, when I was told that I wouldn't have to worry about advanced business and marketing concepts, since I was a product design student....

We were then told that a minimum of 4 pages should be required to write per 1 question, in 25 minutes.

Theres no point in designing products that are not going to sell, so of course marketing and business is an integral part of product design. If you can understand your market then your in a better position to design products to suit them.

In relation to the 4 pages in 25 minutes, its college not junior infants.

experiMental

strychnine wrote: »

Theres no point in designing products that are not going to sell, so of course marketing and business is an integral part of product design. If you can understand your market then your in a better position to design products to suit them.

In relation to the 4 pages in 25 minutes, its college not junior infants.

My counter-argument is, that there are so little natural resources on our planet left, that we can no longer afford to design products just to satisfy markets and the needs of companies to make money. Products should be designed out of necessity. Technology is moving on, so product designers' task is to make it easier for people to use and to concentrate on sustainable design.

I certainly agree that in the long run, business and marketing knowledge would help me, but when I have to get my head around structural engineering and electrotechnology, I wouldn't have much time to do a full blown marketing plan. I'm sure there will be marketing experts who will be better at doing that job than me.

Some people are more better at writing, some are not. However, trying to find a person who will be good at writing 4 proper page essay in 25 minutes, good at three dimensional design and also engineering is just plain unreasonable.

barbiegirl

Get over yourself!! If you wanted a course where the focus was one dimensional you should hot have picked DIT. DIT works on the basis of covering all the aspects and knowledge required to allow you a decent career in your chosen profession, and in your case that does include marketing!!!

So head down, get the work done and enjoy the social life, it all ends too soon and then you need all that you were taught to earn a wage. I know been there and done that.

experiMental

I'm not complaining about the course content at all, I'm just finding that a few people who have a good head for design or engineering are falling behind because they are struggling with marketing or the other way around. This is not allowing those people to have decent social lives and get on with themselves

strychnine

experiMental wrote: »

My counter-argument is, that there are so little natural resources on our planet left, that we can no longer afford to design products just to satisfy markets and the needs of companies to make money. Products should be designed out of necessity. Technology is moving on, so product designers' task is to make it easier for people to use and to concentrate on sustainable design.

Of course in an ideal world people would design products that were sustainable and would efficienly use our planets resources. It goes without saying that we dont live in an ideal world. This kind 'sustainable development' philosophy probably washes in the likes of trinity or ucd, but DIT is not really like that. DIT generally teaches industry oriented courses, where the purpose is to teach people to work and ultimately be successful in industry.

experiMental

strychnine wrote: »

This kind 'sustainable development' philosophy probably washes in the likes of trinity or ucd, but DIT is not really like that. DIT generally teaches industry oriented courses, where the purpose is to teach people to work and ultimately be successful in industry.

Oh my, you must be hating UCD and Trinity with a vengeance. Sometimes, DIT produced even better idealists, innovators and researchers than Trinity or UCD ever did, so it's all down to the student to decide what path to take after graduation.

But isn't it right that unreasonable expectations are not encouraging students to learn, they are actually causing unnecessary stress, bitterness and panic?

Frankiestylee

I think DIT are probably trying to balance out the course's workload, so you don't get all your technical classes clumped together, nor do you get an unrealistic first year.

Plus thinking about sustainable products etc is the way forward, plus it'll be where all the money is at, so I'd totally expect DIT to teach such an aspect if they're so workplace savy.

strychnine

Frankiestylee wrote: »

I think DIT are probably trying to balance out the course's workload, so you don't get all your technical classes clumped together, nor do you get an unrealistic first year.

Plus thinking about sustainable products etc is the way forward, plus it'll be where all the money is at, so I'd totally expect DIT to teach such an aspect if they're so workplace savy.

Sustainable yes, but also profitable. For example, do you think Toyota designed the prius out of concern for the environment or because they saw a new market of green loving car loving people out there.

Frankiestylee

strychnine wrote: »

Sustainable yes, but also profitable. For example, do you think Toyota designed the prius out of concern for the environment or because they saw a new market of green loving car loving people out there.

Yeah exactly... you've just contradicted your own point there mate, but thanks for agreeing with the rest of us.

prod_igy

piece of advice from a 4th year product designer........1st year is a bitch, and will seem like it has SFA to do with the course. I for one, despised marketing and economics, and dont even get me started on timmins and electrotechnology. Yes, marketing may seem tough, but wait till later on in the course and it will eventually become relevant. Your probably thinking why are you doing all these modules that have nothing to do with designing the next iPod and so on, but 1st years modules are just laying the groundwork for 2nd years ones, and so on up until 4th year. Even in 3rd year, your givin a 'mini-thesis', a sort of whole year practice project to get you accustomed to the processes in doing a thesis. Fear not however, this 3rd year project is done in groups of 3. The course really kicks in in 3rd year, when its more hands on design.

experiMental

thanks, prod igy, very reassuring

I know that marketing is essential for good product design, but I just don't have the head for it when it's given to us at such an advanced level.

On another note, will we be given an actual work placement in 3rd year?

prod_igy

ye i was the same....actually failed it i tink in the summer back then, and just about scraped by in the autumn repeats!:D

well we didn't when we wer 3rd years last year, but because the course is only new, they are adding, combining and removing modules through experience with the previous years. so when you are a 3rd year, you will be doing modules that we only started in 4th year. there has been no mention to us about work placement bein added so i wouldnt say so, but dont take my word on that!

just out of curiosity, what are your subjects? and are you semesterised?

strychnine

experiMental wrote: »

My counter-argument is, that there are so little natural resources on our planet left, that we can no longer afford to design products just to satisfy markets and the needs of companies to make money. Products should be designed out of necessity.

My point is that this kind of idealist view is not one that is in keeping with the thinking that goes on in industry. DIT will teach industry oriented courses. In the real world sustainable development comes a distant second to simply making a profitable product.

experiMental

prod_igy wrote: »

just out of curiosity, what are your subjects? and are you semesterised?

my subjects for the first semester:
1.) applied science
2.) electrotechnology
3.) Computer applications
4.) marketing
5.) communications
6.) creative design fundamentals 1
7.) economics

next semester: I'm prepared for absolutely anything :X

prod_igy

cool, looks like the subjects havent changed atall since i was a 1st year, although we wernt semesterised then. well good look with your exams anyway experiMental, and enjoy the rest of the course, don't worry it will be worth it!

experiMental

Just out of curiosity, how many people are in your year?

prod_igy

not sure of the exact fiigure, but i think 35......with 17 in one group and 18 in another. What about you?

experiMental

We had 40 people registered, although only 24 regularly turned up to lectures and handed up their assignments. Our group were given quite a b0llocking during class rep meetings. We were told that we had one of the worst attendance records of any first year course in Bolton Street, and also that we were a bunch of messers.

It's not going to be easy getting through the next semester with that kind of a stigma.

prod_igy

haha, brilliant. Don't listen when the lecturers give out saying the other group is doing much better work than your group and are better overall (spalding and mick ring do this alot!). They're just playing ye off aganst eachother. Our group were told alot of times we werent doing as much as other group etc, but then the other group said they were told the same thing. Same applies for them saying the year before did more work also.

experiMental

perhaps it's a way of increasing the standard of student's work.

In spite of that, I looked at this year's graduate work and I was mildly disappointed.

prod_igy

ye i know, but u should understand that the whatever product you decide to do for your final year project, it has to work. Your not gonna get many brand new, innovative, groundbreaking products. They're mostly gonna be redesigns of existing products. Youre not gonna see many of those really mad out there concepts that you might get in NCAD, because there ones wouldnt work from an engineers point of view. For ours on the other hand, you have to say how it works, what size screws are used, dimensions, how its manufactured, how its asembeld, how the motor/circuit board does this and that. You also have to do an exact 3d model of it up on solidworks and then make a lifesize model of your product etc. Its alot of work, much more than just drawing a few concepts that look really cool.

experiMental

brilliantly said.

However, my ultimate goal for my degree is to combine the concept greatness of NCAD-type work and the engineering detailing that you've mentioned in your previous post. Something like that has been done a lot of times before, so if that is possible, I see no reason why me and other students on our course shouldn't go for it.