cancan wrote: » Ok so cornbb I've yet to see a decent argument against SUV (personally, their ride/handling balance doesn't do it for me) but whatever floats your boat. What about the green brigade, who in reality see the list of the cars you want in the same light as the list of suv's you don't want. What you may be too blind to see at this point, is that the cars on your list, are just as bad as the suv's on your list. In many cases, because they are not as tall, they actually are longer, and take more space on the road. Just because you think the X5 4.4 is pointless, and the 5 series 4.4 is brilliant, doesn't matter a jot - the difference between them is very little. One pollutes a load, and one pollutes small bit more. After the anti suv thing is done to death, they'll be on to performance cars, then petrol cars, then race cars....you name it. And you'll be back here complaining that it's so unfair, that the car you want to buy costs too much. SUV's are based on the car equivalent floorpans, engines - the works. Probably 70% the same as the cars you like. Some people may have three kids, but they don't fit in the back of an R8. Heaven forbid, you might be in that position one day and lets see what you buy then. I left ireland for these very reasons - where i live now, I can buy and m5 for 67,000 euro - it's 144,000 in ireland (before the new taxes mind you!) Let the greens go on, and the only big bmw that'll be sold in ireland will be a 710d with 30hp. Ireland doesn't have a car industry it can force change on, nor a market big enough to make bugger all difference to the world environmental concerns. All this nonsense does is give the chattering classes something to be upset about, and sells a few papers. "Gas Guzzling SUV!" Since when do we call petrol gas - pulled straight from the us tabloids. Get the middle class upset about something - sell a few papers. The cars on your list are is getting killed just as much as the suv's with the new taxes. Hopefully all irish motoring enthusiasts will realise that an attack on one is an attack on all, before all cars are taxed out of existence, instead of bickering between themselves, and missing the point that they are collectively getting ridden by their own government. Motorists are the new smokers, and the anti sentiment from the public on SUV's encourages to raise taxes on all cars - how they must laugh when the middle class are so stoked up about something that they welcome new taxes!
prospect wrote: » How so? correction, some people hate them. .
prospect wrote: » No more so than any large family car, MPV or executive car. .
prospect wrote: » That issue would be with your driving ability/conifidence. .
prospect wrote: » Simply a result of the light angle being set wrong, same applies to many cars, and all those who insist driving with their fog lights on. .
prospect wrote: » No more so than any other car being driven in the same dangerous manner. .
prospect wrote: » So basically, you will not consider anything that proves you wrong..
Rhiannon14 wrote: » *steps out from far left* As a self-proclaimed greenie, I'm not going down the CO2 route, though I think you'd have to be mental to tank up one of those puppies in any European country. Can any SUV driver tell me how much a full tank would cost you? To my point, the only defense I've seen here that isn't rooted in complete ignorance is the simple, "I just like them." It is the WHY of this that I haven't seen successfully defended. Have consumers become so casual that they'll pick up the first car that seems to suit them without considering its impact on others? Cars are weapons! I wouldn't even step out in front of a Mini Now the question is how can you buy a small truck without realising that it's going to give you an advantage over others? Even if you like the aesthetic of a car, more needs to be considered before walking away with a truck with bull bars on the grill and Yosemite Sam "BACK OFF" mudflaps.
DonJose wrote: » Such hate! What do you drive and how much do you earn?
craichoe wrote: » Bad roads ? HAHAHAHAHAHAHHA ... Mate, go to Europe and drive around, they are FAR worse .. Drive through Antwerp and your teeth will have rattled out of your head. I think your coming up with the argument that was around 10 years ago. Irish roads are better than alot of European countries roads, except we have less motorway.
prospect wrote: » so where do you draw the line?
dodgyme wrote: » I hate SUVs and I think that people who drive them are scum. I would stop short of agreeing with the vandalism but i think SUV owners need to realise how much they are hated.
cancan wrote: Well spotted - this is thread number 342323 of "I hate SUV's" I am not reading through 8 pages of repeated mindless nonsence to come to the same conslusion I already hold.
RobAMerc wrote: » People would love to act like that towards drivers of expensive cars and they often do, but the difference is the green mob has given people an veil hide behind to SUV bash that doesn't make them look like the jealous little sh*ts they are.
cornbb wrote: » So you think people are pissed off with SUVs because they can't afford to buy them? If I envy a car that is leagues out of my price range then I will lust after it and congratulate those who drive it, not slag the sh*t out of it. Your jealousy argument makes no sense.
unkel wrote: » Ask yourself this question: which car does the average person like least / hate most: 1. €80k SUV 2. €120k saloon 3. €300k sports car The answer is not 2. It's not even 3.
MuffinsDa wrote: » There's a long list of cars I'm jealous of (their drivers): CLK and S Class Merc, 7 series BMWs, brand new lime green convertible Saabs (or any colour really), Audi A6 and A8s, Porsches, Maseratis, Bentleys, Chryslers, and many many more. But when I see them I admire them and don't hate them a bit. But I have never bean jealous of any SUV and never admired them. So the jealousy argument doesn't really hold...
cornbb wrote: » :rolleyes: Haven't bothered to read the thread, have we?
cancan wrote: » Good to see begrudery is alive and well. If you're poor, get over it.
BnA wrote: » Ahem. A diesel X-Trail (for example) will do 39 mpgs If you are going to ban this durty durty durty rain forest murderin' tank off the road... you might also consider banning the following.... Toyota Avensis (All their Petrol models) Ford Mondeos (All their Petrol Models) Peugeot 407's (All their Petrol Models)All Petrol Volvos
prospect wrote: » It is a pity there is no multi vehicle collision stats. However, as you may have predicted, I completely disagree. A modern SUV will come equiped with crumple zones. A much higher percentage of cars will not have these, as there is more old cars on the road than old SUV's (as SUVs are only a recent thing). I would rather be hit head on by a Kia Sportage than an old Merc something or other. However, If i was in a nissan micra, being hit by an SUV would be worse than being hit by an Almera. However, being hit by an almera would be worse than being hit by another micra, so where do you draw the line?
astraboy wrote: » Typical Irish begrudgery and ignorance! I actually hate the term SUV, its an imported U.S. phrase along with "Gas Guzzler" that does not apply to most of the cars and jeeps on Irelands roads. First of all, a "Gas Guzzler" in my book is a 5.3L chevy Subarbun, not a 2.2L Hundai Santa fe or a 3.0L BMW x5. The last 2 are also diesel and emitt less Co2 then older cars with underpowered 1.6L engines. People in Ireland pay far too much tax on our cars. If someone works hard and wishes to buy a nice car to cart their kids around in, or even just themselves, they pay through the nose for the "luxury". I wish the greenies would just F off, in fairness as one person said all we need to do is start building renewable energy power plants, even nuclear. The planet does not care if we reduce CO2 from the transport network or power generation, the latter being one of the main producers of CO2. It really disgusts me to see people giving out about "SUV's". Personally, I would perfer a 3 series over an X3 and a 5 series over an X5, but people have every right to enjoy their money their way. They may need to tow a boat, or a trailer or a horsebox or live up in the arse of nowhere where ground clearance and 4 wheel drive are very handy. So get off the high horses lads, unless ye all get to work in cars running off the grass in your lawn and you make all your own electricity from your own private wind farm you too are a polluter. A person owning a nice car is just your venting point, because maybe you can't afford it, because you can't deal with driving a 12 year old piece of **** churning out more CO2 then a land rover defender, because you don't like people rubbing your face in their affluence, or your jealous and completely ignorant of the facts surrounding 4x4's and their environmental impact and believe a prius is the most environmentally friendly thing in the world. Greenies, Get a life. To everyone driving an SUV, drive well and I have no problem with you. Fair play and don't let the tree huggers force guilt on you enjoying your hard earned $$$$.
astraboy wrote: » Typical Irish begrudgery and ignorance!
To everyone driving an SUV, drive well and I have no problem with you. Fair play and don't let the tree huggers force guilt on you enjoying your hard earned $$$$.
dodgyme wrote: » You really typify the ignorance of the SUV driver.
dodgyme wrote: » They are unnecessary to the point that people hate them.
dodgyme wrote: » They are generally unfriendly to the environment,.
dodgyme wrote: » they are intimidating to drive near .
dodgyme wrote: » and obstruct other drivers esp their lights,.
dodgyme wrote: » they are dangerous to other raod user such as cyclists and pedestrians .
dodgyme wrote: » and arguments like some cars are worst to the environment or bad drivers cause accidents is pointless tripe showing me you know why we hate them but cant admit we're right.
blackbox wrote: » Every car, tractor, truck and SUV should be banned - except the type I have.:rolleyes: Let's have a bit of tolerance here folks. I personally don't like SUVs - so I won't buy one (especially a Porsche Cayenne). I'd even stick my neck out and say that they have more than their fair share of discourteous drivers, but surely not all of them can be scumbags. Even though I may not like them, there are no sensible grounds for banning SUVs.
MuffinsDa wrote: » Because of height offset they cause more damage to other cars than a 2-car collision. They may or may not gain from that (i.e. they'll hit a *hard* engine instead of a *soft* and crumpled bumber - more damage to SUV + more damage to car), but the car usually suffers more while SUV doesn't gain more. This is the bit that I have problem with. Add to the lack of maneuverability and stability and the higher level of skills required for driving a large vehicle than a small one, and you'll hopefully see my point.
cornbb wrote: » I'm surprised no-one has pointed out the dangers posed by bull-bars in this thread. Would any SUV drivers care to justify why these are often fitted?
MuffinsDa wrote: » The statistics you gathered shows that most modern SUVs are not generally less safe for pedestrians that other cars, and that point is taken. However, one thing is not tested in EURONCAP is their effect on other cars. Because of height offset they cause more damage to other cars than a 2-car collision. They may or may not gain from that (i.e. they'll hit a *hard* engine instead of a *soft* and crumpled bumper - more damage to SUV + more damage to car), but the car usually suffers more while SUV doesn't gain more. This is the bit that I have problem with. Add that to the reduction in maneuverability and stability and the higher level of skills required for driving a large vehicle than a small one, and you'll hopefully see my point.
