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Dublin Bus and Google Maps Project

irlrobins

Hey all,

I'm a daily user of Dublin Bus but I usually only take the same three bus routes into and out of town. So while I know those routes backwards, when it comes to going to any location I'm not sure what bus to take.

The Dublin Bus website isn't great at giving the exact route of the bus. It might say the bus goes to A then B and then C but doesn't say how exactly it gets from A to B. So I'm not sure what stop to get off in order to bring me closest to my destination.

But now that Google Maps have launched their My Map service, this could change. I think it's possible to use this service to map out every Dublin Bus route and stops.

Now obviously due to my limited knowledge of other routes, I wouldn't be able to do this alone. So why not make it a (boards) community project?

Each person could contribute their route knowledge until all routes are covered. It would be possible for one person to do one half of a route and someone else continue it. So even if you didn't know the complete route you could contribute.

Obviously some project management would be required.

One login would have to be shared so there would have to be some level of trust that someone doesn't log in and feck it all up. So perhaps we would only issue the login to people that have been referred and vouched for.

We would also have to draw up a list of all routes and then assign them to individuals.

We would have to ensure that a colour scheme is used so that bus routes can be differentiated if they travel along the same roads.

But at the end of it, we should have a map of the Dublin Bus route that could be shared globally so that locals and tourists a like could make use of it.

And I'm sure other features could be added to the map. Photos and video can be linked so maybe tourist attractions and the like could be marked.

Anyway, as I said, it's a big project for just once person, so do people think that this is something that could/should be done?

I'm opening it up for discussion and ideas, be interesting to see if there is much interest in this.

R

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Dord

this sounds like a great project!
i'd be willing to help out. i could map the routes for 42A, 42B & 29A.

i think gmaps pedometer is a bit easier to use anyways, so i'll use that to map them.

markpb

irlrobins wrote:

With My Maps, adding a route is as simple as clicking along the required path to create the polyline. I'm not sure if the API offers the same functionality.

Sorry, crossed wires

I only meant using the API to display the data, not map it.

If we could use My Maps to plot the route, extract the data and then import into API or other than that would be handy. Will the KML file be suitable?

It appears they're both just XML files so either should be fine. Personally I find Gmaps easier to use but I don't have a preference. We could probably transform between the two of them if we wanted to anyway.

irlrobins

Well let's formulate/document the exact process of how and what each person needs to do. (You can tell I'm Management Consultant

)

No point in charging down a path and find problems further along.

markpb

irlrobins wrote:

Well let's formulate/document the exact process of how and what each person needs to do. (You can tell I'm Management Consultant )

If we can agree on a file format, I can adapt the existing site to read that file so we can test it. It shouldn't take long to do that when I get back to a proper net connection

I can also try to convert my existing routes (or at least the ones I'm sure are right). Any objections?

After that I guess if each person maps out the routes of their local buses, we can put them on a site somewhere and have other people check them to make sure they're okay?

I'd suggest leaving the locations of bus stops for the moment, they should be easy enough to add in later. At least I think they should.

irlrobins

Yes, I think the bus stops can be added at a later stage.

Format of data file is not important as long as a) it can be read by your site and b) everyone and anyone is able to produce such a data file easily.

So what's the best way of doing that? My Maps exported as KML or Gmap Pedometer?

Just counted the number of routes in total: 200+ :eek:

markpb

irlrobins wrote:

So what's the best way of doing that? My Maps exported as KML or Gmap Pedometer?

I think this one comes down to personal preference. Shout now or forever hold your peace

Just counted the number of routes in total: 200+ :eek:

That's without worrying about crazy routes like the 27B or 18 which run different routes and different start/end points at different times of the day *rolls eyes*

irlrobins

My Maps looks slightly easier in terms of exporting. Anyone else got a preference?

markpb

There is a third alternative, encoded polylines which are much smaller to store and transmit than a series of lat/lng co-ordinates. For example, instead of a 4.5k KML file or 8.6k GPX file, the entire 27B route can be stored in polylines as:

gf`eIbfie@`EsjAmLw_@jFcrApA{w@nJjDzXwB|XkDje@p]dZcWmDknA\mLhOtH}@pNh@pNjFzD_@lE}GeBzAkKSqN\oMbDr@`M}SSxQnKa@
{I`@KgQsFuArGci@`U{@rGr@NeEYsHfAcLtUo_@rDrKrLbSdMn\xKvTrTzV??`VjWnNxNjInBvArVpEvQvLlP~Wz]hK`OhOhRdCtAjF|q@

There is a simple Google utility (http://www.google.com/apis/maps/documentation/polylineutility.html) to let you mark points on a map. It's not quite as flashy as My Maps but it's easy enough to use. Single clink on a point, click the 'Add Point' button, rinse, repeat, etc and then copy and paste the text from the two text boxes below the map.

lostexpectation

I think main reason this would be possible to do now is because of mymaps, it was possible before but too much work for one person to do. now you don't have to pay to draw paths etc. (and not everyone has gps ped thingy or programming know how).

I think markpb is suggesting that the only way to get all the routes together would be for each person who's done a route or two to export the kml and then (somebody with the pro license) in goolgeearth program can put them all together in one map that could be shared, for a complete googleearth and googlemap version and be available for search in mymaps search.

or are you suggesting if people are searching for routes it would be easier to do them and find them all separately?

it is annoying that you can't import into mymaps, I asked about on the help forum, no reply yet. (there seems to be alot of things mymaps can't do),http://groups.google.com/group/Google-Maps-How-Do-I/browse_thread/thread/fa4867acf1218405

I think snappieT et al should only offer to do one route at a time, and finish it/post it here before starting on the next.

you could try to break things up again as I said by just doing one (main ) version of each route how many would that make it irlrobins?

I tried this http://intl.local.live.com/results.aspx?what=hotel&where=Dublin%2C+Dublin%2C+Ireland

I read that you could already do this on mircrosoft, but I look here and there^ http://mappoint.msn.com/

??

ah you have to sign up,Ill have to figure it out, well like you have to do with google (althought you don' t need an invite).

does anybody use this microsoft mapping to create maps?

anyway mymaps as google said a monkey could use it thats the point.

irlrobins

markpb wrote:

There is a third alternative

Too fiddly and it's not as easy to use as My Maps. I wouldn't consider it a runner.

irlrobins

lostexpectation wrote:

I think snappieT et al should only offer to do one route at a time, and finish it/post it here before starting on the next.

Yea, one route at a time is prob the way to go. Plot route X, export the KML file, email to whoever to populate the database and if all ok then move to route Y. Keeps the data files simple.

markpb

lostexpectation wrote:

I think markpb is suggesting that the only way to get all the routes together would be for each person who's done a route or two to export the kml and then (somebody with the pro license) in goolgeearth program can put them all together in one map that could be shared, for a complete googleearth and googlemap version and be available for search in mymaps search.

That's pretty much it. Once everyone has submitted their routes (in whatever format we agree on), we can combine that data in some useable format such as a Google Maps driven website, or humungus KML file for Google Earth users.

As far as I know, there's no way to import route data into My Maps so I think it's probably not much use after the fact.

I think snappieT et al should only offer to do one route at a time, and finish it/post it here before starting on the next.

I wouldn't object to people taking a few routes but probably not more than 5 or 6 each so we don't block each other if there are lots of enthusiastic helpers.

lostexpectation

http://maps.google.com/help/maps/userguide/index.html#results

I don't get how to use this I created a couple of things made me public gave em specific names but when search maps for them they don't come up, ony things that have been there for a while do.

However, when you post a Placemark on the Google Earth Community Forums, it will not automatically appear in everyone's Google Earth 3D Viewer. Your Placemark, along with other new or edited Placemarks, must be added to the Google Earth database in a separate process; this is done approximately every 4 to 8 weeks.

is this the same for mymaps ?

irlrobin- One login would have to be shared

see I still havn't figured out if this is necessary.... actually if it is the case that things won't be searchable for a couple of months then one account would make sense, so people can see eachothers work in mymaps.

could you post this thread to communting irlrobin, perhaps make a sticky?

irlrobins

46A From Dun Laoghaire

lostexpectation

irlrobins wrote:

46A From Dun Laoghaire

cool and the mymap link ?

irlrobins

There isn't one (yet).

I think markpb will plot that route on his map.

markpb

irlrobins wrote:

I think markpb will plot that route on his map.

Apologies, I started doing this last night but there's a small bug in it so it doesn't work just yet. Annoyingly I can't get SSH access from my new job but I'll update it tonight.

Also, it turns out the Google Maps API supports KML files natively so it was a doddle to implement. Good choice there irlrobins

lostexpectation

irlrobins wrote:

There isn't one (yet).

I think markpb will plot that route on his map.

then how did you make it?

irlrobins

I did it in Google MyMaps, but not as a public map.

lostexpectation

irlrobins wrote:

I did it in Google MyMaps, but not as a public map.

why not and why not put up the link? or do this? so everyone can see it use it...

http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/868062/an/0/page/0#868062

mymaps has turned out to be confusing and google arn't answering request for support at all?
http://groups.google.com/group/Google-Maps-How-Do-I/topics

irlrobins

The intention is to release one map with all routes on it. Releasing one route at a time is pointless. So people plot a route, upload the coordinates here and markpb will (hopefully) plot it on his map. That make sense?

markpb

irlrobins wrote:

The intention is to release one map with all routes on it. Releasing one route at a time is pointless. So people plot a route, upload the coordinates here and markpb will (hopefully) plot it on his map. That make sense?

And I will :-)

http://www.redbrick.dcu.ie/~markpb/dta/traffic/boards.ie.php?bus=46a
http://www.redbrick.dcu.ie/~markpb/dta/traffic/boards.ie.php?bus=20b
http://www.redbrick.dcu.ie/~markpb/dta/traffic/boards.ie.php?bus=27b
http://www.redbrick.dcu.ie/~markpb/dta/traffic/boards.ie.php?bus=46a,20b,27b

Obviously it's only a beta so all the routes are the same colour and we'll need to build a proper UI around it but it's a start. I haven't converted any other bus routes yet but if anyone else sends me KML files I'll put them up as soon as I can.

markpb

http://www.redbrick.dcu.ie/~markpb/dta/traffic/boards.ie.php?bus=17A

and

http://www.redbrick.dcu.ie/~markpb/dta/traffic/boards.ie.php?bus=11 (Northside only)

irlrobins

Nice one!

So come on people, get busy!!!!

lostexpectation

irlrobins wrote:

The intention is to release one map with all routes on it. Releasing one route at a time is pointless. So people plot a route, upload the coordinates here and markpb will (hopefully) plot it on his map. That make sense?

although I wish no harm to marpb he could get hit by a bus in the morning?

people may want to use just one route in other purpose or project I don't see the need to lock them behind an api on mark's webpage and preventing people from loading the routes into googleearth and uploading the kmz up on the google community, thats what is there for. I posted the 46a route in the exp&temp forum as example. It was also notify other Irish google earth users to project beyond boards and they may help add to it and prevent them repeating the work as I already said.

31 http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=experiment&Number=787116

25 http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=experiment&Number=788731

49a http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=experiment&Number=868387

17 http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=experiment&Number=868388

irlrobins

Well admittedly the primary aim of this project was to produce a map with the DB routes plotted on it that a user could select at will. It wasn't to be a library of KML files.

Having said that, I'm sure it's possible to be able to provide the data to anyone at a later stage, but that would be a secondary aim.

And if people attach their KML files here, then they are freely available to anyone who needs them, in much the same fashion as yours are.

markpb

Would it suit if I added a (password protected) page on the site that allowed people - you guys - to upload KML files for new routes or replace existing KML files if routes turn out to be incorrect? I can do that tonight and upload those routes that lostexpectation linked to.

If this goes well and get enough interest, we should probably consider hosting it somewhere else so that a few people can log in, make changes, look after it, etc. I'd have no objections to moving it elsewhere so it can be a proper group project, it's current incarnation is only a stop-gap measure to get us up and running.

lostexpectation

Well admittedly the primary aim of this project was to produce a map with the DB routes plotted on it that a user could select at will. It wasn't to be a library of KML files.

Having said that, I'm sure it's possible to be able to provide the data to anyone at a later stage, but that would be a secondary aim.

And if people attach their KML files here, then they are freely available to anyone who needs them, in much the same fashion as yours are.

I read your op again and it doesn't mention that at all, it mentions doing a collaborative project on mymaps, I don't mean to be disagreeable, but it was only when markpb came along was their suggestion of having to make an api, and now hes talking about password protection?

to produce a map with the DB routes plotted on it that a user could select at will

this can be done on googleearths and googlemaps

I thought the idea was to get the most people involved via the easy to use mymaps etc which is why you would post to things on google community/make them public to attract irish map makers, attaching txt files here creates a couple of steps to view it as a kmz as opposed to instantly on google bbs so people can see what were tying to do and join in otherwise it will never get finished.

markpb

lostexpectation wrote:

I thought the idea was to get the most people involved via the easy to use mymaps etc which is why you would post to things on google community/make them public to attract irish map makers, attaching txt files here creates a couple of steps to view it as a kmz as opposed to instantly on google bbs so people can see what were tying to do and join in otherwise it will never get finished.

I'm happy to go along with whatever you guys decide and re-map my routes if needs be.

At the moment though, I don't see how you want your idea to work. If we all use Google My Maps to map out whatever routes we know, we'll end up with a mismash of different routes on different people's accounts and no way to merge them all. If I map the 17A and you map the 41, there's no way to show those two together and see where they join. It's be great as a project because it's easy to get involved but almost useless when it's done.

lostexpectation

markpb wrote:

I'm happy to go along with whatever you guys decide and re-map my routes if needs be.

At the moment though, I don't see how you want your idea to work. If we all use Google My Maps to map out whatever routes we know, we'll end up with a mismash of different routes on different people's accounts and no way to merge them all. If I map the 17A and you map the 41, there's no way to show those two together and see where they join. It's be great as a project because it's easy to get involved but almost useless when it's done.

I think this is just confusion I might have added to it,

the suggestion was people could use mymaps to make the maps then save the kml to be put together elsewhere by someone with the licence, which is why irlrobin first posted, as I was trying to figure out above mymaps isn't good for putting them altogether and I wasn't suggesting that in my previous post, but you can do that in googleearth (or simply c+p the coords from the files) and make them available for people to download them off the google community and they can all viewable and clickable in googlearth and googlemaps (and mymaps). Im asking why only allow it be viewed on a web page behind an api and not on all 3 the api, googleearth and googlemaps.