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Where are the homeless?

cormie

After my friend bought me a roll tonight, I didn't really feel like having it, so after I dropped him home, I spent about 40 minutes driving through towns and other built up areas looking for a homeless person who might want it. Ok, so it was 3am, but at that time it's easy to find a homeless person in the capital city but not so easy elsewhere. I couldn't find anyone, which I suppose is a good thing? So are there many homeless people in your own local towns and if so where do they generally tend to spend the night?

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DublinWriter

thrill wrote:

They don't all end up homeless because of drink. Sometimes its the opposite way around. They turn to drink while they are homeless.

Great point and well made thrill.

What really angers me are the celtic cubs, who themselves are typically two salary payments away from the breadline and undercontribute to their pension funds (if they have any) and who'll bleat "oh roight, don't give them any money or they'll spend it all on forkin' drink, roysh?".

The hallmark of any society should be how it treats its poor, sick and elderly.

Right now we suck.

gurramok

If i was homeless, i'd either claim asylum in my own country to get those 3 meals a day and a cosy bed or commit a crime(prob steal) to get into prison for the same luxury.:D

Rabies

The Scientist wrote:

No, i'm thinking the same. Vagrants... who cares? besides the simon commmunity.

It is not that I don't care. I just wouldn't go out of my way to find a homeless person and give them the roll like cormie.

If I was going to give a donation or food or money, I would prefer to give it to a charity organisation instead of the person directly.

To be honest, if I ever found myself in the same situation with no possible way of getting back on the ladder. I would problem take a short stroll off a cliff.

MrJoeSoap

Rabies wrote:

It is not that I don't care. I just wouldn't go out of my way to find a homeless person and give them the roll like cormie.

Cormie did (or at least tried to do) a decent thing and you game on here fairly aggresively and started ranting about it, "Jesus Christ" etc...

If I was going to give a donation or food or money, I would prefer to give it to a charity organisation instead of the person directly.

It was a roll, at 3am. What should he have done, waited til morning and called down the SVdP with it? Cut out the middleman and just give it to a homeless person, problem solved.

Rabies

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Cormie did (or at least tried to do) a decent thing and you game on here fairly aggresively and started ranting about it, "Jesus Christ" etc...

Ya, sorry. Sometimes I type exactly what I think. Not that it would make a difference in any way. Not one for really censoring what I would type/say at times. Wasn't supposed to be an aggresive attack at cormie.

MrJoeSoap wrote:

It was a roll, at 3am. What should he have done, waited til morning and called down the SVdP with it? Cut out the middleman and just give it to a homeless person, problem solved.

Of course not. I was surprised at the length of time he spent looking for a homeless person.

Personally, I would have brought it home, thrown it in the fridge and had it the next day, or just dumped it.

MrJoeSoap

Rabies wrote:

Personally, I would have brought it home, thrown it in the fridge and had it the next day, or just dumped it.

Me too, probably.

cormie

Hehe, I'd never dump food. I've been brought up not to waste anything. My family before me struggled at times, from re-using teabags to sifting through the ashes of the fire to pick out bits of coal that still had a bit of burn left in them for the next light.

I ended up eating the roll myself after all that:p Was hungry by the time I got home.

With regards to giving to an establish Charity, I don't feel so encouraged to do that anymore. There's just too many of them and you can't be sure just how much goes to the cause. To be a registered charity, I think you only have to give away 15% of profits:(

Sparky

Fair play to ya cormie for trying to find someone to give the roll to.

I remember a friend of mine years back who ran a bakery. He got an order from esat at the time to bake 200 small cakes, but a week before the deadline they canceled. He had 90 cakes done and as a result he could not sell them on as 1. they were already paid for and 2. they had esats logo on them.

He decided to donate them to the homeless as it was food but his insurance crowd found out (after being tipped off) and stopped him from giving the cakes out incase "one of the homeless folk claim against you because of food poisoning etc"

He felt sh1tty about it, but to think that he could of helped a load of people but was stopped because of legalities.

In the end, yes he had to dump them and give some away to friends.

DilbertPartII

wyndham wrote:

They were probably all at home. Was fairly cold last night.

Cool. :cool:

[Deleted User]

Sparky-s wrote:

He decided to donate them to the homeless as it was food but his insurance crowd found out (after being tipped off) and stopped him from giving the cakes out incase "one of the homeless folk claim against you because of food poisoning etc"

So they were good enough for the ESAT staff, but not good enough for the homeless? :eek:

The whole concept of someone secretly tipping off an insurance company about a cake giveaway, and the insurance company stepping in and preventing the transaction, makes this the oddest thing I have read all week!

markk06

Deleted User wrote:

The whole concept of someone secretly tipping off an insurance company about a cake giveaway, and the insurance company stepping in and preventing the transaction, makes this the oddest thing I have read all week!

Thats common, it reflects the litigious society we live in. Basically everyone loses because of one greedy bum

RainyDay

Sparky-s wrote:

I remember a friend of mine years back who ran a bakery. He got an order from esat at the time to bake 200 small cakes, but a week before the deadline they canceled. He had 90 cakes done and as a result he could not sell them on as 1. they were already paid for and 2. they had esats logo on them.

He decided to donate them to the homeless as it was food but his insurance crowd found out (after being tipped off) and stopped him from giving the cakes out incase "one of the homeless folk claim against you because of food poisoning etc"

Urban myth - This makes no sense at all. Insurance companies can't stop you doing anything - the worst they can do is revoke cover. Who tipped off the insurance company and why?

branners69

Kingsize wrote:

I Think the good old British cops are a bit more willing to move beggars on...

The English government passed a law making begging illeagal and its strictly enforced over there!! Not too sure if begging is actually illegal over here??

I worked for a homeless magazine, Big Issue, in Manchester for a couple of years. Was a huge eye opener for me. I was amazed as to how easy some people slipped into being homeless. One guy was in his 50's and was a teacher in Liverpool. His wife ripped him off and his world fell apart. Started drinking, lost his job and his home and within 2 years was sleeping on the streets of Liverpool. Ex-pupils used to give him money. Thankfully when I met him I was teaching him computer skills and he had his life back on track.

Unfortunately over here the homeless dont receive half the help they would receive in the UK. So one of the reasons you dont find as many homeless here is because they are in the UK, mainly up North!!

markk06

RainyDay wrote:

Urban myth - This makes no sense at all. Insurance companies can't stop you doing anything - the worst they can do is revoke cover. Who tipped off the insurance company and why?

I can vouch for the story... I know one company(major company) that did the same.

aidan24326

The_Minister wrote:

This is the trainee economist in me talking, but you do realise that if you give them food, and other people give them money, then they will spend less of that money on food, and more on alcohol, as they need to buy less food. So in effect, by giving them food, you are raising the amount of alcohol that they can buy.

Well the country is in good hands if you're a future economist :rolleyes:

Stupid post tbf. You have food to spare, a homeless person may be hungry, you give it to them. Simple as. Like Cormie I have done this myself (though I never spent 40 mins looking, in Dublin it would never take that long)

A lad attempts a random small act of kindness and all some people can do is slag him for it. That says it all really.

And The_Minister, it is a bit unfair to imply that all homeless are alcos. Some surely are, some may even be there because of it, but who are you (or I) to judge anyone. Like smccarrick said, if I was homeless on the streets I'd probably drink myself into oblivion too.

The Scientist, your attitude stinks. You should be made to sleep rough (and hungry) on a few winter nights.

the_syco

admiralgar wrote:

there was an article on rte news the other night about the very sad plight of child homlessness, but according to the report it has been reduced somewhat over the last few years

If a kid turns 18, he's no longer a kid, but an adult. Still homeless, but no longer a child.

Beastieboy wrote:

As I understand it at least some homeless shelters aren't free and you have to pay a small amount to get in for the night.

Aye. Last time I checked, they had to pay 5 or 10, and the CC/Simon Community/etc paid the other €35.

Kintarō Hattori

From using boards for the last while and reading Cormie's posts I have to say he seems like an exceptional guy. He stands out from alot of people I know for real and certainly a vast chunk of boards users as a warm and humane person. I think I can safely say he's not stuck up an oppionated arse like so many other people.
I can't believe some of the replies and attitudes I've read and witnessed on this thread. Have people really lost their compassion so much? Cormie congrats for being a decent top notch bloke and for not losing faith despite the attitudes of some. I would most certainly be proud to call you a mate if I knew you outside of boards!

MrJoeSoap

eo980 wrote:

From using boards for the last while and reading Cormie's posts I have to say he seems like an exceptional guy. He stands out from alot of people I know for real and certainly a vast chunk of boards users as a warm and humane person. I think I can safely say he's not stuck up an oppionated arse like so many other people.
I can't believe some of the replies and attitudes I've read and witnessed on this thread. Have people really lost their compassion so much? Cormie congrats for being a decent top notch bloke and for not losing faith despite the attitudes of some. I would most certainly be proud to call you a mate if I knew you outside of boards!

Well said, and having played on Team Boards (and bummed a lift) with him I have to agree, a genuinely decent fella.

dRNk SAnTA

I thought there was an adequate amount of beds for the homeless in dublin these days. I recall some politician stating that anyhow. Is that untrue?

Maybe thats why there wasn't many people on the streets that night.

Sparky

RainyDay wrote:

Urban myth - This makes no sense at all. Insurance companies can't stop you doing anything - the worst they can do is revoke cover. Who tipped off the insurance company and why?

I'm not sure, but keep in mind that this was 4 years ago. I do rekon it may have been the massive pub that was trying to buy out his shop, but thats another story.
They pretty much made it out that he was not selling them to be covered. I even suggested trying to sell the cakes off at 1c each.
I think he wanted to keep his books straight too.

kevmy

I think the homeless problem is actually kind of overstated in Ireland. There are very few homeless people in any other city bar Dublin. There was a survey/census done on them in Galway a while back and it came out with something like 10-30 people who were offically homeless, others where in halfway houses that kinda thin as permenant residents. In Dublin its a bigger problem for sure but still its small enough for a city of its size. One of the richest countries in the world (America) has massive homeless problems tents and tents of them living alongside the roads. Most countries in Europe also have higher homeless populations.
Thats not saying the problem should be ignored just put into perspective. A lot of the people on the streets are drunks and junkies. Wheter they became so before or after they were on the streets is a moot point. They won't get off the streets and back into society proper without kicking the habit. In this regard the government has preformed poorly and not fulfilled its obligation. Money to help these poor unfortunates should come from the government and to a lesser extent the well known charities (if your afraid of giving money to "charities") such as SVdP and the Simon Community. IMO giving money directly to the homeless person is only going to give them food or water or a bed or drink or drugs for a day. It won't solve the problem, in fact it might hold back from giving them a long term solution.
I also think that its not as easy as some people say to fall into homelessness. If you have friends or family they should help you out. I belive that alot of homeless people have a psychiatric illness or an addiction which quickens there decsent and are aslo lonely and isolated before their fall (eg. immigrants, no family etc.)

Kintarō Hattori

kevmy wrote:

IMO giving money directly to the homeless person is only going to give them food or water or a bed or drink or drugs for a day. It won't solve the problem, in fact it might hold back from giving them a long term solution.

kevmy wrote:

I also think that its not as easy as some people say to fall into homelessness. If you have friends or family they should help you out.

I don't think you've thought this out properly.

kevmy

eo980 wrote:

I don't think you've thought this out properly.

I mean by giving them a place to stay so that they don't to sleep rough, giving them food, getting them into a treatment programme if thats whats needed. I don't mean by giving them handouts of money to buy drugs and leaving them at that. If you've a freind or family member in this situatuion some tough love might help them.

aidan24326

kevmy wrote:

I mean by giving them a place to stay so that they don't to sleep rough, giving them food, getting them into a treatment programme if thats whats needed. I don't mean by giving them handouts of money to buy drugs and leaving them at that. If you've a freind or family member in this situatuion some tough love might help them.

You are not considering the fact that some of these people may not have friends or family they can turn to. Or no-one that really cares.

I recall a few years ago the body of a man who'd drowned was found in the River Lee in Cork city. He was quite decomposed and had clearly been dead for some time. There was no evidence of foul play and it was considered a probable suicide, yet the man did not match anyone on the missing persons list and the gardai were having difficulty in even identifying him. It was thought that he was a vagrant who drowned himself, and no-one even took any notice that he was missing, or at least never reported him missing anyway.

kevmy

aidan24326 wrote:

You are not considering the fact that some of these people may not have friends or family they can turn to. Or no-one that really cares.

If you look at my original post I said IF they have family and friends. I understand that most of these people unfortunately have noone to care for them and it is sad. But the point I was trying to make is that it is not as easy to fall into vagrancy as some people make out in this forum. I don't belive the "it could happen to anyone" line of reasoning. If you have real friends and a good family even if you fall on hard times they will help you and stop your slide and hopefully turn it around.

thebaz

The_Minister wrote:

This is the trainee economist in me talking, but you do realise that if you give them food, and other people give them money, then they will spend less of that money on food, and more on alcohol, as they need to buy less food. So in effect, by giving them food, you are raising the amount of alcohol that they can buy.

It may make economic sense to give them no food , and they'll starve and thus save the tax payer some petty ecomic expense !!
The homeless are people, all different, some drink , some take drugs , some are young, some are homeless due to there own mistakes , and others simply born into it.
Those of us lucky enogh to have housing, should just be gratefull we have a roof over our heads for winter , and not make judgments on the less fortunate !

5starpool

thrill wrote:

I know of one guy who went to the streets because of the abuse he got at home. Violent abuse that is.
Two of my brothers stayed with him for a while and even slept out in the cold in Fitzgerald park (cork) to keep him company.
They said it was a horrible experience but they feared for their friend.

Out of curiousity, why did your brothers sleep out with him rather than take him in for a while?

Also, Dublin doesn't seem to have as many homeless as it did 2-3 years ago, and I was simply amazed last summer when I was in San Francisco by the number of homeless there, it was incredible.

If you are ever looking for a homeless guy again there is always one outside of the Fitzwilliam Card Club on Fitzwilliam street across from the ESB head office. He took up residence there about 18 months ago, probably due to the fact that he can get free sandwiches/tea/cigarettes from there. He will never accept money off anyone though, and I have seen him violently throw it at people if they insist he takes it.

cormie

hehe, thanks for the compliments above:)

Zambia

Ok well done to the OP your heart is definatly in the right place. I have met and talked to several Home less folk and personnally think there a blight on the city. Large gangs of homeless males are often seen at the top (St green) end of grafton st to name but one .

These are imposing for less numbered groups of people.

I have on two occasions had serious violent encounters with homeless people in this regard.

I think we set up think tanks for all sorts of useless crap why cant we have one to once and for all come up with a solution to this.

If anyone wants to help the homeless however i would suggest donating straight to the York street hostel , or simialiar. They are at the front end of this.