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Dell!!!!!!!!!

Linoge

Ok, About last May my laptop (Inspiron 5150) went on the blink. Just stopped booting for no reason. No overheating, no obvious hardware problem. Long story, but yes its been sitting there unused ever since.

Now I find out that there is actually well documented cases of the same fault and very much looks like Dell were at fault.

http://forums.us.dell.com/supportforums/board/message?board.id=insp_general&message.id=166703&view=by_date_ascending&page=1

Needless to say I am slightly annoyed:mad:

Has anyone else had this problem with any Dell? Has anyone had any experience with Dell outside of their warranty?

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Charlie

WexCan wrote:

With all warranty periods you get 1-2 weeks grace period. It's a generally accepted thing on the floor.

When the customer buys a 90 day warranty that overrides the 1 year warranty as stated in the Ts and Cs.

As it has already been said , consumer right cannot be contracted out of. A consumer CANNOT SIGN THEM AWAY. The issue at hand is what the court would deem an acceptable period of time that a consumer could expect their new laptop not to need a repair for, and as I have already stated I doubt the court would consider 90 days that such period.

Boggles

charlie mchugh wrote:

As it has already been said , consumer right cannot be contracted out of. A consumer CANNOT SIGN THEM AWAY. The issue at hand is what the court would deem an acceptable period of time that a consumer could expect their new laptop not to need a repair for, and as I have already stated I doubt the court would consider 90 days that such period.

So it is up to a judge to decide. Is there no law that states that electrical equipment should last for a certain amount of time, I always thought 12 months?

WexCan

charlie mchugh wrote:

As it has already been said , consumer right cannot be contracted out of. A consumer CANNOT SIGN THEM AWAY. The issue at hand is what the court would deem an acceptable period of time that a consumer could expect their new laptop not to need a repair for, and as I have already stated I doubt the court would consider 90 days that such period.

Where does it say that they can't? The retailer has entered into a contract with the buyer that gives a fixed warranty period. The law gives no fixed warranty period, as far as I can see...

Charlie

Section 10 subsection 3 staes: "Goods are of merchantable quality if they are as fit for the purpose or purposes for which goods of that kind are commonly bought and as durable as it is reasonable to expect having regard to any description applied to them, the price (if relevant) and all the other relevant circumstances, and any reference in this Act to unmerchantable goods shall be construed accordingly"

See where it states that the goods should be durable, and that this is based on a ubjective test asto what the nature of the good is and the price paid for it. This has been interpreted by the judiciary as a time period which a person can expect there goods to be free of any problems. It has been commonly held that in respect of electronic household goods, that period is at least 12 and upto 36 months.

i71jskz5xu42pb

WexCan wrote:

Where does it say that they can't?

Jeez, have you never heard the expression "Your statutory rights are not affected"?
From the statute:

Rights under a guarantee shall not in any way exclude or limit the rights of the buyer at common law ....

Even the Dell T&C's that were quoted recognise this in the "implied warranties are excluded to the fullest permitted extent" i.e. they recognise that there is a limit on the exclusion.

There relevant law has already been pointed out to you. There's a reasonable expectation clause there. A reasonable person (and I'm excluding you from this group) might say that if you pay €2000 for a laptop it'll work for longer than 12/18 months (even if it is a Dell).

HelterSkelter wrote:

He doesn't need a solicitor, he can go to the small claims court for €9 (correction €15).

and only if the laptop cost less than €2,000

WexCan

So can anyone then explain to me the point of having a warranty option in the first place? Sure if anyone can run off to court within 3 years and put in a claim, why have a warranty service?

[edit] BTW, I don't appreciate being called unreasonable, I'm making valid arguments as much as you are. No need to add personal jibes into it.

Charlie

WexCan wrote:

So can anyone then explain to me the point of having a warranty option in the first place? Sure if anyone can run off to court within 3 years and put in a claim, why have a warranty service?

[edit] BTW, I don't appreciate being called unreasonable, I'm making valid arguments as much as you are. No need to add personal jibes into it.

This was my entire pooint if you look at my first post. This so called "free" 90 warranty is rubbish. To a greater extent so is the 1 year waranty thta you have to pay for. Warranties are useful for other goods, such as a mobile phone or a hard disk mp3 player. The cheaper the product and the greater the general acceeptence is that a good dosen't have much of life span, the more useful a purchased extended warranty is.

WexCan

Ok I see where you're coming from, but that doesn't answer the legal side of it. I'd love to know for definite myself, could solve a lot of arguments with customers.

hobie

As a long time Dell user I've always encouraged buddies to buy the 3 year warranty ..... it costs peanuts (on a typical desktop say less than a pint per week) ....... Dell pay for collection and return delivery by courier .... in the one return I've had they even sent me suitable packaging materials prior to collection :eek: .....

I've quoted my views from time to time on Forums and always been blown out of the water

...... "replacement parts are so cheap to buy it's not worth paying for a 3 year warranty"..... "Pc's are so reliable it's not worth paying !!!!" etc etc ....

But I've always payed the 100.00 odd euro's for the 3 year warranty and am quite happy to do so ...

i71jskz5xu42pb

WexCan wrote:

but that doesn't answer the legal side of it. I'd love to know for definite myself, could solve a lot of arguments with customers.

This is why I think you're being unreasonable. Each time some of the relevant legislation has been mentioned and linked to you seem to disregard it. The sale of goods and supply of services act is the legislation and it is linked to in its raw form and in consumer friendly formats above. What part of it do you not understand? I'm not trying to be glib here - I really don't know what part of it is not clear to you?

WexCan wrote:

So can anyone then explain to me the point of having a warranty option in the first place? Sure if anyone can run off to court within 3 years and put in a claim, why have a warranty service?

Nobody said that *anybody* can put in a claim - there needs to be a reasonable expectation that the product should have lasted longer. Warranties are also useful for on site service, global service, accidental damage or simply to avoid having to deal with the hassle and time of going though the courts.

WexCan

Relevant legislation that doesn't say much, IMO. At least not anything definite.

A lot of PCs last for years. I have a system from 1998 under my desk as a file server. The idealists would say that PCs should all last this long - this is where the law gets muddy. Who is in a place to objectively say how long something should last?

i71jskz5xu42pb

WexCan wrote:

Who is in a place to objectively say how long something should last?

Nobody - who said it had to be totally objective? The legal system is somewhat subjective by its nature. The phase "reasonable doubt" is one that gets trotted out at lot - that's subjective to the jury or judge that makes the decision as to what they consider reasonable.

And in this case a judge will take a view on a reasonable expectation as to how long the product should have lasted given the price.

If you're expecting a list of products with an expected lifetime somewhere in the statute books you'll be disappointed.

Charlie

WexCan wrote:

Relevant legislation that doesn't say much, IMO. At least not anything definite.

Now you are being unreasonable. "Relevant legislation that doesn't say much" what more does it need to say:mad: I'd love to see laughs you'd get in court if you said that in answer to being convicted of a statutory offence.

WexCan

With all respect to you, for something like this surely it should be less "wishy-washy"? If I was accused of theft, fine, the law is clear. The law in this case, is not.

Charlie

WexCan wrote:

With all respect to you, for something like this surely it should be less "wishy-washy"? If I was accused of theft, fine, the law is clear. The law in this case, is not.

Wrong. The law often has to be interpreted by the courts asto what the intention of the legislature is. This can involve deciding whether an offence is of strict liability, to detrming whether a person can be convicted of murder on the basis of recklessness rather than intent. Not everything is black and white and the law is one of the greatest examples of this. In case of the sale of goods act, it is prudent to allow a judge to decide whether a good is of merchantable quailty because, in order to adduce such a fact many onsiderations have to be taken into account. Therefore each case differs from the last and it would be foolish to set down a set of rules which could result in harshness on behalf of the consumer or the sellor.

Linoge

Ok, so has anyone actually dealt with Dell with regards to problems outside of warranty?

TempestSabre

On a slightly different tack. Did you try any other companies to repair it? Some of them may have Dell parts from other machines or buy them from the US etc.

http://www.computersunlimited.ie/

Never used them myself, but worth a try?

HelterSkelter

WexCan wrote:

So can anyone then explain to me the point of having a warranty option in the first place?

The benefit of the warrenty is that Dell pick up the laptop and deliever it back when it's repaired. Plus you don't have to go through arguing with someone on the phone like you who doesn't know what the customers rights are. Also a lot of customers don't know their own rights and assume if it is out of warrenty there is nothing they can do. Dell can make a few extra quid by selling extended warrenty to these people.

HelterSkelter

Linoge wrote:

Ok, About last May my laptop (Inspiron 5150) went on the blink. Just stopped booting for no reason. No overheating, no obvious hardware problem. Long story, but yes its been sitting there unused ever since.

Now I find out that there is actually well documented cases of the same fault and very much looks like Dell were at fault.

http://forums.us.dell.com/supportforums/board/message?board.id=insp_general&message.id=166703&view=by_date_ascending&page=1

Needless to say I am slightly annoyed:mad:

Has anyone else had this problem with any Dell? Has anyone had any experience with Dell outside of their warranty?

OP, any update, you been back on to Dell yet? Did you mention the Consumer Act?

WexCan

HelterSkelter wrote:

The benefit of the warrenty is that Dell pick up the laptop and deliever it back when it's repaired. Plus you don't have to go through arguing with someone on the phone like you who doesn't know what the customers rights are. Also a lot of customers don't know their own rights and assume if it is out of warrenty there is nothing they can do. Dell can make a few extra quid by selling extended warrenty to these people.

Hey, I'm only trying to work it all out myself, no need for all this WexCan-bashing.

HelterSkelter

WexCan wrote:

Hey, I'm only trying to work it all out myself, no need for all this WexCan-bashing.

Sorry buddy, didn't mean to have a go at ya.