James Hume has been the outstanding Irish 13 this season, no question and only 27
I think there’s some selective memory going on here. From 2021-2023, Keenan was undoubtedly one of the best fullbacks in world rugby and probably the most complete 15. Genuinely outstanding week in-week out. Aerially, kicking, running, distribution, defence. He was brilliant However his form the last 2 years hasn’t been at the same level, he’s starting picking up a lot of injuries and he’s 30 this year. Is he still our best 15 when fit? Yes, probably. Although I really liked what I saw from Hansen in November. I hope as much as anyone that Keenan can get back to the level he was at a few years ago, but there’s no guarantee he will do. And we shouldn’t handicap ourselves by not being prepared to explore other options if he doesn’t get back to top form.
There's no "Yes, probably" about it, Keenan is by some margin the best 15 in Ireland.
My suggestion earlier re him being tried at 13 was based on the potential that he might be our next best 13 after Ringrose, so if we were very short there (i.e. nobody else we had tried had worked out), and we have good cover at 15 (Osborne, Hansen), then it might be no harm to see him play a half game or two at 13.
I'm not suggesting we don't play Keenan at 15 when he's fit & everyone else is fit, or that we play Keenan at 13 if Osborne has shown himself capable to play at 13 and both Keenan and Osborne are fit.
If Osborne turns out to be pants at 13 and is fit and trusted at 15, I'd like to see Keenan get a run at 13 if Ringrose is unavailable.
The alternative is to try Hansen at 13 maybe. The point being, if nobody is emerges as the obvious Ringrose back up then it would be good to try out some other options.
Okay, maybe Keenan shouldn't play 13…
…but I reckon we should give him a few games at 9. He'll be gas.
Actually, maybe Mack learns to play 9.
Both of them, for the sake of depth?
We can figure out 13 later, but it'll probably involve Crowley/TOB. And Stockdale's playing 13 tonight!
Why would we play Keenan at 13 when he’s never in his professional life played there and there are plenty of good centres at the provinces doing the business regularly?
Simple answer is there is no reason
So are Ramos and Beauden Barrett, they still play other positions when required
Keenan has played other positions when required, just not 13.
He’s 29 and has never played there. It makes literally no sense when there are many Irish centres who could do a good job if given a chance.
We're out the door with talented young centres, and you want to put our best ever 15 at 13. Make it make sense.
I don't think anybody actually does want to put him there.
This started because someone was making an excuse to keep him out of the team for Osborne, despite Osborne having no attribute at 15 better than Keenan.
One of the cases was Osborne's ability to run lines off 12 from the 15 position, as if line-running wasn't one of Keenan's best qualities.
Then it became a goal-post manouever about him playing 13 full stop.
All of this to avoid saying that Keenan walks back into the Ireland team.
Lads, forget about trying Keenan at 13. The only logical option is Furlong.
Think Prendergast should be getting a few more games at 10 too, just because like.
Its not an excuse to keep him out of the team.
I just stated we had options.
As TRC10 posted he has had Injuries & is not the same player of say 22/23 when he was the best 15 in world rugby. We have to see that in blue & green again
If he gets back to that form then happy days & I'd love to see it.
You can't ignore we have alternatives at 15 now.
God knows we gave game time to players for long enoughto play their way back to form namely due to the fact we had no test level alternatives.. e.g Hansen Autumn Int 24.
If he is the form of what we saw in previous years then we'll & good & we are better for it, its not outlandish to suggest we have an alternative or is it?
There's always this assumption that a player has to win the jersey back. It's very rarely the case, especially when players of the calibre of Keenan are involved. He has nothing to prove.
Keenan is the first choice full-back until he shows that he has regressed massively. He's just that much better than anyone else, Osborne included. The same very likely applies to Mack Hansen; I don't know if he'll be back for the summer but he won't be losing too much sleep about his Ireland jersey, regardless of the form TOB and Baloucoune have been showing.
Agree with Keenan
Not so sure about Hansen, RB has absolutely taken his chance and given us a real finishing threat that we normally lack.
Hansen would be a pretty great 23 also.
For the third time in this thread, this conversation wasn't about 'pointing out we have an alternative'.
This conversastion started because someone said 'does Keenan walk back into the team?'
The answer to this question, that was posed, is yes. Anyone who thinks differently has a short memory or just does not watch Keenan play. He is better in every aspect than any of the alternatives combined. That's how good he is.
I can ignore the alternatives at 15, because Keenan is still a level above them even if he comes back 80% the player he was. If we need one of the alternatives to step in. Great. Fantastic stuff.
That is not the same as thinking we're now in a position where it's 'horses for courses', where in a match the opposition might not suit Keenan starting. That's what horses for courses means and it's absolute nonsense. There is no situation where Hansen or Osborne should start other than Keenan being unavailable or is being purposefully rested against a lower-ranked side. That isn't an opinion, that is an outright fact.
This notion that he hasn't been the same since 2022/2023 is nonsense as well. He has always remained as one of the top rugby players in the world. Just this past Summer he was excellent for the Lions in all three tests.
https://www.sixnationsrugby.com/en/m6n/news/vote-for-your-2026-guinness-player-of-the-championship
Vote Stu
Done (but only because Ramos wasn't shortlisted)
Ramos played 10 against Italy. No one noticed. He was generally pretty anonymous apart from the goal kicking, especially in defence against Scotland and England.
Stockdale at 13 for Ulster today. Lets see how he goes.
All of you that say he'll walk straight back into the team are ignoring the fact he's been out a long time and is turning thirty shortly and could now be injury prone.
It's a lot harder to get back to where you were later in your career. He's had two injuries in quick succession. There's a lot of question marks.
We all want him back and at his best and hopefully that happens.
I immediately read turning thirty in a Bertie Ahern accent for some reason
Started tonight boyz
He had surgery to repair a hip cartilage issue that had been planned for months. Normal procedure based on wear and tear that many rugby players go through for all sorts of issues, beit shoulders, knees, hips etc.
He's been fit from that for weeks. The only reason he was delayed was because he broke his thumb in a pre-6 Nations camp.
Two completely different injuries that don't demonstrate any kind of pattern.
Just so I'm clear, do you think Jamie Osborne is better than Hugo Keenan?
I don't think he's better than Hugo at or near his best. I do think he's done a great job in his absence.
world today
up tomorrow
Bundee was sensational tonight to be fair.
Great, absolutely not. He did ok, the Rhys Carre try was a serious error.
Obviously you didn't watch the game if that's your opinion.
Good, we agree then that Keenan walks back into the team.
