A judge has lifted the suspension on this contract, more details here.
the surprising thing in this story is that neither company can deliver 8 train sets in 4 years time.
Starting from scratch to design, build, test and certify a brand new train of a complex nature 4 years is about normal.
Once you get the certification off you go and you could build a full train set a month, test it and have it in service by end of the following month.
BTW can I just say bravo for these comments from the judge:
There is a very significant public interest in not unnecessarily delaying publicly-funded projects which reduce emission levels, he said.Another public interest attaching to the project are the significant benefits of the new trains, particularly regarding access for people with disabilities,over and above those provided by the existing trains, he said.There was also the issue of the reduction of emissions by the new trains which might be regarded as "badly needed", he said.
There is a very significant public interest in not unnecessarily delaying publicly-funded projects which reduce emission levels, he said.
Another public interest attaching to the project are the significant benefits of the new trains, particularly regarding access for people with disabilities,over and above those provided by the existing trains, he said.
There was also the issue of the reduction of emissions by the new trains which might be regarded as "badly needed", he said.
All very sensible and well thought out by the judge, looking at the bigger picture and the social good for the public. Makes me hopeful for the various Judicial Reviews underway if this sort of common sense thinking is being applied.
It'd be a refreshing change alright.
wrt to the tender - starting from scratch? apart from regauging to 1600mm what other changes do they need to make?
I'd assume it being tri-mode initially, ICE - Battery - 1.5 kV DC OHLE, with the ability to be converted to dual voltage OHLE at a later date is a fairly unique and complex requirement.
What is so confusing to me about IÉ in this particular situation is that they release grand plans about 200kph trains within this connect project stuff to rail passengers through their own website.
And then the Government just sneakily hands out a decision contained within their Sectoral Transport plans which announces that Dart+ SW will be delayed until at least 2030?
Can someone explain to me why the Government would say OK to delaying Dart+SW for another 5 years.
That crazy decision will have a huge negative impact on people's quality of life living in places like Adamstown up until 2030.
The article listed above reports here that Evara had received planning for up to 900 new homes to be built in Adamstown.
The people who now have to live in those new homes now have to stick to an arrangement of using PT by way an eventual overcrowded bus & rail service going from Adamstown into the City Centre until Dart+SW gets rolled for service in 2030.
I just don't understand that logic from the Government at all tbh. Why do they have to implement a 4 year delay on a critical project like this one? It's sounds so utterly stupid to me that they have to delay it for this length of time.
You said 2030 twice in that post - that's when DART SW would start, but it could take 3 years to build. So Adamstown etc won't see DART until around 2033.
Not suprised on Dart SW, never expected any major works until DART W is significantly completed.
Because they are two very different projects at very different stages. project Connect was basically announced because they got funding from the EU for it. To be clear at this stage it is simply an early stage study into how this might be done, works for involved, etc. just a study, we aren’t even talking about detailed plans yet here. If Project Connect does eventually get go ahead, you are likely looking at a phased, multi decade project. Dart+ SW is much further along, it now has a railway order and is almost ready to go. Realistically Dart+ West likely needs to go first. It is certainly disappointing that DART+ isn’t moving faster but project Connect has no impact on it.
Not really new news, but there's some interesting mock ups going around after confirmation of the Stadler order.
Presume the images in the thread are from the Railway Gazette article:
EDIT: Ignore the Tri mode in his first tweet, he really means that it's Bi mode but will AC support will be added in the future.
Its tri mode
1500 DC
Diesel
Battery
Looks great. Looks like a more regular looking intercity type train like the Class 745, rather then the Flirt 160’s with their power pack approach. It will make for a new unique type of train from Stadler I believe, until now they have all the more Intercity type FLIRT 200 trains have been EMU only, so will be interesting to see how the Diesel version works out.
Two diesel engines will be installed in the driving vehicle at one end of a unit, creating a power car and avoiding the use of underfloor engines. Whilst both engines will normally provide power, it is expected that a single engine will be capable of delivering sufficient traction to maintain performance in the event of any failures.
It doesn’t specify in the article but I presume they’ll be 200kmh capable…?
It also says that 8 of the vehicles will be articulated pairs - This presumably means that the trains will be about 10 cars long (including the two cab cars, one of which will apparently be a power car, and the other a passenger car) meaning that they’ll be shorter than normal carriages like the new DARTs. Surely this is also a plus for capacity?
Completely missed that! 😂
Top speed is 177kph. That's more than the current top speed of 145kph
I presume 177 is on Diseal?
Anything below 200 on wires would be a very bad considering they will be around for 30+ years.
8 sets x 10 cars each.
I'm guessing €25m per set to purchase?
I’ve seen the 177kph mentioned in reddit too, but see no confirmation in any article or spec. As Jamie says, understandable if running on Diesel, but I’d really hope it can hit 200kph once fully converted to EMU.
Tender requires 110mph/177kph minimum, 125mph/200kph desirable
There have been suggestions to put a car park at M7 Jct 9a (Millennium Park) with a feeder bus to Sallins. (Naas developemnt plan)
Would a better idea not be to build a new station there with a feeder bus into Millennium park, M7 business park & Toughers Business park. Sallins train station is near capacity anyway.
Plenty of land to create a large park and ride - very easy congestion free access to M7. Traffic free feeder bus service and my guess is a large number of Naas & Clane residents would use that instead of clogging up Sallins. Not every train would need to stop there and some trains could use it as a starting and finishing point of the journey.
Could it be that 177 km/h is required for diesel operation, and only when there is electrification North of Drogheda would 200 km/h be a realistic proposation?
Its likely to be 200kph only if 25kV available
The FLIRT is incredibly quick off the mark so most of the time savings will come from the quicker acceleration not absolute line speed
110mph the fastest you can go before UK regs become a problem
Would the flirts not been a better option then these alsthom they ordered.
Completely different type of trains, these FLIRTs a very much an intercity type train, the Alstom ones are a commuter/s-bahn type train.
Rail Project Prioritization Strategy published. Interesting that the reconfig of Limerick Junction to enable Cork - Galway train journeys is in the short term (before 2030) category
https://www.gov.ie/en/department-of-transport/press-releases/ministers-welcome-publication-of-rail-project-prioritisation-strategy/
Limerick J is for Waterford/Limerick J service.
Cork-Galway is possible today, demand for end to end makes it unviable for additional services. Start would be Galway-Limerick all extended to Limerick J and only require 1 change.
Hard to believe theres not enough demand for Cork to Galway, could the Galway to Limerick service not be extended to Cork run hourly? Maybe remove the need then for Limerick to Limerick Junction service.
you’d imagine with all the strong intermediate journeys ie mallow, limerick, Ennis etc that you’d easily make this viable. Common enough in GB to have services where the end to end destinations aren’t the biggest draw in terms of passengers
The question is how many direct Cork-Galway would be filled and not take resources from elsewhere?
Extending Galway-Limerick to Limierck J and with a single change is the best option and an immediate saving of 20-30m.
Direct trains will not win passengers, comparable journey times will and today Irish Rail cannot provide that nor will they be able to beat Citylink with a direct service.
You often find those who use lack of direct trains to drive instead of taking the train are for the most part unlikely to use the train even if direct. The next excuse would be the cost or the times don't suit and so on.
This was exactly what i meant
