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The light touch CA moderation experiment

Ha Long Bay

Don't think I have ever even started a thread before on the site and to clear this one is not one to have a dig at the mods in any way.

When I initially saw the decision to lift all bans and a basic free for all I really did think the forum was dead.

Over the last few weeks in my opinion whoever made the decision was proven right and it did allow much more rubust debate.

I think with a little tweeking to nip outright trolls in the bud it is working better than the previous rules.

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pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123679038#Comment_123679038

On the same coin you are allowed call people child killers and racists. The majority wouldn't want to not be allowed do that. So its a free for all with abuse for both which is fair.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123679154#Comment_123679154

I'll say what I always say...

Just use the ignore list.

If a poster really has nothing to contribute (in someone else's opinion) and is just there to stir and wind others up, just add them to the list.

Sure, it means that certain threads end up with half a page of hidden posts but threads would flow a lot better if everyone did that.

Let's be honest, in most threads it's maybe half a dozen people we're talking about, often the same half dozen too!

The other thing is to try not to take the bait and engage with them. I fail this one sometimes myself, but the best way to get rid of these types of posts in a thread is to ignore them outright.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123679260#Comment_123679260

I agree ignore us very useful. But it's needs an extra feature, ignore quoted posts from people in your ignore list. Because if everyone quotes and replies to the troll the thread is detailed.

But there is so much trolling and spam it derails the thread. So regardless of ignoring it's impossible for the thread to function. About 70% of the posts are from one or two trolls and replies to them.

It was like this about cycling helmets and hi viz on the cycling forum. It was relentless. Every thread spammed. This is now happening on other sub forums with different subjects.

So while the thread seems busy it's really only a handful of people posting because no one else can get a word in.

You can see on other forums it drives the non trolls away. So discussion and different options fade away and all that's left are these massive monologues and rants from a few obsessives.

It has to be obvious from statistics. People with massive post counts in threads and massive successive posts.

People will vote with their wallet and feet.

Headshot

You can only laugh at the audacity of the OP to be complaining about rules with there anecdotes nonsense

I was very hesitate about the rule changes in CA, felt it was a cop out from the mods but I've blanket ignore numerous posters and my experienced has been changed completely and I'm not constantly worried about being banned for anything so insignificant

It's been a breath of fresh air in CA

Backstreet Moyes

Can we be advised on if baiting and taking about other posters is allowed?

Painful watching a poster spamming a thread with multiple posts baiting a poster to talk about other posters.

The poster has form for the bait and report tactic.

Be nice to know if this is now allowed and others need to suffer trawling through the nonsense.

looksee

There doesn't appear to be anything in the Terms of Use about baiting and talking about other posters, and certainly nothing in the new rules. I cannot see why you should not refer to someone who is trolling as a troll, which was not allowed previously. I think it is clear enough when someone comes in making troll-y remarks and repeating them/reinforcing them without providing any evidence or arguement for their point, there does not seem to be any reason why you should not call them a troll.

However, it doesn't make for great discussion and is a bit counter productive given you are reacting and that is what they are looking for - any reaction. Total ignoring of the most blatent examples and ignoring after a couple of failed attempts to get a rational response would seem to be the best solution. Unfortunately there is always someone who will bite - the troll is not remotely interested in your response or opinion, they might even share it, but stirring is more fun.

osarusan

Can I sincerely ask the AH mods, if, using the festering shitheap of the Hamas-Israel thread as an example, are they happy with the way things are going?

I mean, is that an example of what you expected, and wanted?

The decision to change moderation policy baffled me at the time, and it baffles me still.

And I don't get the connection people are making about putting posters on ignore lists - you could always do that and it's not connected to moderation.

And the argument that 'Well if I put all those people on ignore who talk endless shite, then the place isn't so bad' doesn't make much sense to me - surely those people who talk endless shite should be stopped from doing so?

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123684123#Comment_123684123

The issue is that what is "endless shite" depends on which "side" of the debate you sit yourself.

Take the immigration thread - There are maybe half a dozen serial posters that I feel add nothing to place and who only seem to wind up the majority of other posters through things like obviously and deliberately contrarian opinions intended to provoke others, one line "smart" answers to considered reasonable posts, constant asks for "sources" and then dismissing them when provided because they don't like that source, who post maybe half a dozen replies in succession to various others with either the above replies or to call them racist or whatever else..... The list goes on!

I'm sure anyone reading THIS post and familiar with that thread can recognise what I'm talking about - but at the same time, who am I to censor anyone? Let them post what they will (so long as it's not illegal or in breach of the basic terms of the site) and others can make their own minds up. If anything, such posts actually undermine whatever point they might have even more than any reply could.

I do just ignore them outright most of the time and yes, sometimes I roll my eyes when I see others take the bait and give them what they want - engagement - and the thread spirals until the mods have to step in again, which I absolutely understand is frustrating and time consuming for them too, but overall, despite these handful of posters, the discussion has flowed much easier since the changes.

I see the thread in question is under review today (for what appears to be repeated discussions of matters before the court from what I can see in the edits and 2 posters basically calling others racists because they don't like the comments - I'm sure there's other stuff that's already been deleted/actioned too)

It would be a shame to go back to heavy handed moderation because the same group continue to cause problems on a topic that very much should be aired and discussed on this site. Far better as I will keep saying, if others just ignore it and refuse to engage at all.

Backstreet Moyes

Why exactly is the thread locked and a threat of it being closed permanently.

It was two or three posters spamming the thread last night.

Ban them and not just punish everyone else.

Immigration is one of the biggest topics in the country.

If you want to keep boards alive then I wouldn't be advising censorship of a huge topic in the country.

Necro

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123688422#Comment_123688422

It had absolutely nothing to do with this 'spamming' you're claiming - and I would add there are about 10 posters who under the old rules would be serving very lengthy bans for their constant derailment of the thread.

I deleted 52 posts discussing a case before the courts yesterday morning. It seems even basic site rules are beyond some posters in their rush to discuss certain topics.

It's not censorship, it's making sure there is no legal issues for the site. I'm sure you can understand that?

I would also argue there is very very little discussion of the actual topic in all honesty.

In any case, the thread is being reopened shortly.

DayInTheBog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123674401#Comment_123674401

It's an issue of moderation when the mod bans a person for holding a contrary view with the usual charge of "whatever phobia".

odyssey06

Can we get clarity on 'attacking the poster'?

I've seen posts made since the new CA rules along the lines of… anyone making this argument is stupid \ insult X.
They don't directly name any poster but it is obvious\implicit they are referring to posters on the thread, because they have made that argument on the thread - rather than just somebody on social media \ a public figure.

Is that attacking posters? Trolling?

Backstreet Moyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123688601#Comment_123688601

Fair enough and it's understandably not easy for ye.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123688652#Comment_123688652

Is that not the very tactic that you and others have been using for years in the Trump thread and a few others ?

Labelling anyone who doesnt agree with the echo chamber as Trump supporters.

Calling Trump supporters idiots, unintelligent, poorly educated, racists, nazis, pedos, degenerates, rape sympathisers or what other insult is in vogue .

It is obvious\implicit that you and others are referring to other posters on the thread, lets call a spade a spade for once.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123688805#Comment_123688805

If you want to make a specific accusation against me (i.e. "you and others" report my post on the thread. I won't derail the thread by getting into specifics of any particular post or poster (my understanding is that is against charter) other than to say - I reject that entirely.

Is merely labelling someone a supporter of a current politician an insult? Yet you consider it so? Strange framing.
And why would it concern posters who strongly declare themselves not to support X to be associated with such insulting terms being associated with X supporters?
TO make it a more general point - if someone repeatedly posts in defence of X, attacking their critics in far stronger language than whatever rare criticisms of X have to be dragged out of them - then it is entirely reasonable to draw the conclusion they are supporting X and to state that.

And I've seen supporters of public figures, as in visible types on social media labelled with some of those terms. That is not specific to any one side of the any discussion. Republicans, Democrats, Tories, Labour etc.

Now if someone makes a specific argument in favour of a e.g. a particular policy on immigration, then as racism is one possible motivation for a particular position on immigration, it is reasonable to bring that up with justification imo.

The type of tactic I am referring to is where there has been very recent discussion on the thread of a particular issue A, and posters have made argument about it, we shall call B. Then someone pops onto the thread and says anyone making argument B is a <insert insult here>. So plainly and obviously they are applying that insult to those posters.

If you have come across examples of where insults have been applied either in that manner, or anyone who supports X is a <insert insult here> well then I suggest you report it as it may advance the answer to the question.

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123668057#Comment_123668057

In what way how has it not worked for that thread?

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123688805#Comment_123688805

Trump supporters haven't exactly ever been known for behaving well on such threads. And you know what, plenty of them have expressed incredibly bigoted views over the years. I'd actually say they've been given an incredible amount of leeway in terms of what they've been saying.

On a more serious note, the active court case rule seems to be actively being flouted ATM and it seems more like posters thinking that there are no rules or something. Moderators are handling it for the record but there seems to be intentional ignoring now.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123688805#Comment_123688805

I'm confused. I thought you weren't a Trump supporter.

Backstreet Moyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123690558#Comment_123690558

What has that to do with a feedback thread?

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123690558#Comment_123690558

I'm not and neither are most of the posters deemed Trump supporters, that was the whole point of my post.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123689262#Comment_123689262

"On a more serious note, the active court case rule seems to be actively being flouted ATM and it seems more like posters thinking that there are no rules or something. Moderators are handling it for the record but there seems to be intentional ignoring now."

There's also some extreme over reaction to this rule. I'm on my second three month CA ban, for talking about media coverage of active cases, not talking about the case itself.

Quantum Erasure

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123690769#Comment_123690769

Well, if you're not a trump supporter the comments were obviously not aimed at you...

wink, wink

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123689262#Comment_123689262

Trump supporters haven't exactly ever been known for behaving well on such threads. And you know what, plenty of them have expressed incredibly bigoted views over the years.

Its clear which side has the bigoted views on that thread, and it isnt the side you think.

Its a cult, just as bad as the Maga one.

looksee

Wouldn't it be good if the supporters could explain the thinking behind the policies, or indeed what the policies are, and how they are being effected by executive action (that's effected, not affected). So that we could discuss them, rather than perpetual whinging about how unfair everyone is and how its an echo chamber. But we have been asking for years and so far no sensible response.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123691849#Comment_123691849

I'm sure. We've definitely never had Trump supporters who have claimed dogs were being eaten by migrants or that George Soros was a Nazi collaborator or pushing the claim Kamala Harris had slept her way to the top or pushing the conspiracy that Paul Pelosi was attacked by his lover. Oh and there was smearing Trump's rape victim even after winning her civil case. That's some stuff off the top of my head from Trump supporters in those threads and it was frankly horrible. The Trump fan base on the site have a victim complex in spite of the fact that invariably that behave atrociously. 😂

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123691858#Comment_123691858

But most of the posters labelled "Trump supporters" in that thread arent Trump supporters.

Thats simply the tactic employed to castigate them.

Discussion, no, anyone who tries to discuss anything is rounded on by the usual suspects, and labelled a Trump supporter and then subjected to abuse.

That thread doesnt want or tolerate discussion, it never did.

pjohnson

The dishonesty is a problem. People can agree with 95% of anything Trump says yet still 100% not be a supporter of his.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123691881#Comment_123691881

And I'd say the posters who make claims that they're being impartial while appearing to be fully supportive of MAGA are very much so Trump supporters. We've even had people who are not MAGA post a ream of text of MAGA social media accounts and passed it off as their own. I would say we can reasonably conclude they are at that stage. You seem to think posters should get special protections from criticism of their stances and how objectively terrible they are. It's somewhat telling when posters are attempting to hide the fact they are supportive of his views.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123691858#Comment_123691858

Its like The Joker. They haven't a plan, they just want to complain about being censored/silenced. If they didn't spend 85% of their postings complaining about not being allowed post, they might actually say something with those posts.

Quantum Erasure

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123691935#Comment_123691935

or people can agree with less than 1% of what trump says and be labeled a trump supporter for ever more