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Old thread here......
https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2057962937/mayo-gaa-discussion-part-4#latest
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Green Peter - Permanent
Man Vs ManUre until 9/05/23
Horan inherited a squad that were broken….lets be real here….we lost to Longford. There is no point glossing over it. We went from that to been a serious contender and rocking through teams in Connaught. It was a serious achievement in such a short space of time. As someone else said he took the BS out of Mayo and if you want an example "Mr Jackson", the conditioning, the pace and intensity of our play, tackling, turnovers. We were right up there with the best of teams.
Horan made some mistakes, but he mostly made good calls. He is without doubt our best and most successful man to lead Mayo since 51. In the final of 21, what we witnessed was the start of the decline of the team and it has continued on. i don't blame him for that… some of the players were done at the final and hung around for a few years.
I hope it stops with the new guy. I have serious admiration for Horan, but at the same time I agree that his time is over as manager…… However, it all depends on who comes forward for the position. I can understand the appeal of Horan considering where we stand and if you are not getting a high-quality candidate… then you are faced with - who is better
I'm glad you cited McGeeney.
He took Armagh from a very low base (league division 3) to AI victory in 10 years. He won his first and only All Ireland final, and while Galway weren't great, McGeeney won the sideline battle.
Despite losing to Longford in 2010, Horan inherited a very good squad of players, much better than the Armagh squad McGeeney inherited.
Horan set serious standards for Mayo football and increased conditioning levels to match the top teams, which is probably what Mayo were missing in 04 and 06. He promised to 'take the bullshit out of Mayo football' and went a long way towards doing that apart from being too influenced by the Breaffy element in the squad. As mentioned Aidan should have been taken off in some games and he repeatedly played Hennelly despite recurring mistakes in big games. Also Conor OShea was given many chances despite clearly not county standard.
Horan has a lot to offer as an underage coach or director of football but no we can't go back to him as senior manager for a 3rd time.
I'm too am not sure about Horan as the next manager.
But you know to a certain extent what he can do.
They could select Austin O'Malley and he could be a disaster, but equally he could be great.
You only find that out after the fact.
With Horan they caught lightning in a bottle, a guy in that a few years earlier had been managing in intermediate club, brings you to multiple All Ireland finals.
It's hard to repeat that.
It took Armagh ten years for McGeeney to get it done.
We all give Horan credit, myself included.
Its just on AI final day he loses the plot and has nothing to offer.
And agreed all those managers did the same, particularly Rochford in 2016.
Which is why someone else needs to be given a shot.
John O'Mahoney lost an All Ireland as Mayo manager
John Maughan lost All Irelands as a Mayo manager
Mickey Moran lost an All Ireland as Mayo manager
Stephen Rochford lost All Irelands as Mayo manager.
But none of them revolutionised Mayo football like Horan did.
And for that I'll give him far more credit than the above.
None of us liked 2021, it still bothers the f""k out of me, I could write a book about it.
But I'm not squarely putting the blame on Horan for it, and it's certainly not going to allow it to take away from my opinion on what the guy did for Mayo football.
Maybe not start O'Shea or take him off when it was obvious he wasn't going well?
As per https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117879742/#Comment_117879742
Clearly within Horan's remit and was called out by multiple people at the time.
Also the obvious McShane one.
People really need to be reminded what Horan gives you.
Nothing the manager could do about the players playing badly? Substitutions maybe? Move players around? Change tactics? Do better countering Tyrone's break at speed tactics. Tell Mayo players not to carry the ball into contact? Multiple ways he could have changed things. Mostly better preparation. He was clueless.
Double post
I said he was useless on All Ireland final day.
Which he was. No-one can doubt that. To lose one final, fair enough. To lose four out of four, there is no justification or excuse for that. Its indefensible. Particularly 2013 and 2021.
I really cannot understand why people think Horan would be a good fit again. He is simply not going to deliver an All-Ireland. If you want a couple of good days out in Croke Park every year, Horan is your man. But he's not going to deliver an AI, not if you gave him a 10 year term. You know what you will get with him, a couple of big wins every year and a predictable failure on AI final day.
Time to move on, that ship has long sailed.
He wasn't useless. On the contrary, he got Mayo to punch above their weight. Out of nowhere, we were heading to Croke Park on an annual basis, and for many of those years, it was to finals. I don't think the Tyrone management did anything special that they outfoxed the Mayo management. The reason they won the final was that their players gave everything, had no fear and played really well. Our boys (after a magnificent semi-final) seemed to freeze on the day, didn't have much intensity, and basically didn't really want to get on the ball for the 70 mins.
Exactly , this nonsense of criticising Horan is bizarre. He is without doubt the greatest manager in the history of Mayo football. Six Connacht final appearances as a manager and six wins.
I can guarantee without him as manager we would have been an also ran from 2010 - 2020
Horan revolutionised Mayo football.
When they write the next chapter of the history of Mayo football about the early 21st century, Horan will feature largely in it.
Hopefully we don't regress into pre 2011 mode, I was worried that was happening with this latest management team.
As for Horan and finals, I blame the players more for 2021 than him.
The majority of them collectively failed to play well that day.
Nothing Horan could do about that.
Rumours going around that Austin OMalley with Andy are lined up for the job. Couod be BS but it feels like someone was already lined up before that meeting with McStay.
what’s another year😂🥳
Ask your friend how many Mayo managers have won and All Ireland with Mayo. Your friend should say less than three.
Totally, he must have felt he had given his all and it didn't work out. I don't think Horan 2.0 came with the same passion and drive in his second stent. He was very raw and hungry in Horan 1.0 and everyone took to him as they saw the transformation he brought. Agree he should be in the development side of the house as they could do with someone of his experience to drive that.
Go on Mac
Absolutely no question he should be involved at developmental level. Just not as Mayo manager.
Its time to give someone else a fresh start, probably Andy Moran. Give him a few years to bed in, and hope for a serious tilt in year 3 or 4, with a bit of preparation for an AI final.
I have nothing against Horan other than he won't win an AI.
i never understand the disrespect Horan gets to be honest. Yes losing those finals will always be a lightning rod for criticism but where he took that squad and the country from in 2010 can never be overlooked. Listening to a podcast lately and hearing him talk about Mayo football, high performance, standards coaching and developing players reinforced my belief that he should be involved in some developmental capacity - some sort of conduit between underage grades and development to senior.
Re McStay, it wasn't handled well. They could have waited until the championship was over, asked for a report from him and management team and then decide.
All the chopping and changing of championship formats and league and championship being so close didn't help.
Able to put in great performances against big teams but flop against lesser ones was not good. Unlucky manager but time to move on.
Brilliant except on the day it really mattered when he was always useless.
I was done with Horan after 2021. His SEVENTH year as an inter county manager, 4th AI final and outfoxed by a pair of novice managers and a Tyrone team who have done nothing since.
If he had even the slightest tactical nous he could have won that final, and at least one of the others.
Andy Moran getting rave reviews by the way, seems to be big on preparation.
https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/the-moran-identity-is-giving-the-farney-army-a-new-attacking-edge/a690926669.html
Not sure why Cuala winning what they did was seen as a penalty kick for O Malley.
There would have been a lot of Dublin clubs ahead of them in betting last year.
Too much of a winning mentality, wouldn’t fit in.
Kevin Walsh. That is all.
Shame he left in 2014. They were on the brink of something then.
In fairness Horan was brilliant and he needed that bit to get over the line. Some say he would not listen to anyone but that could be what made him so good as he stuck with players and got serious buy in.
He is mayo to the core and on his first stent, made me so excited before the games, as I knew everything was given. Brilliant times when I look back at it. He made those players what they became keegan, boyle, vaughan, o'connor, o'sheas. I watched the 2017 game vs dublin on youtube the other day and what a panel we had. Shame really that they did not win it out.
stop digging, this is so niave posting. There is nothing strange about it. If he and the CB agreed to an approach, he would have issued a statement and it would not have lots of people up in arms over the CB statement. I think they have told it like it is. They feel it is best to get the recruitment process going. It seems to me that they are leading from the front on this and they see no future with McStay and why wait. This is all very well co-ordinated approach, no messing around and dare I say they could possibly have someone lined up - reading between the lines 😀. Anyway, this has been on the cards since last winter's review and people are wondering about why it was done so fast…well now.. go figure that one out!!
Starry Boy has no chance of getting the Mayo job.
You could well be right in that McStay didn't want to go, only those in the conversations know for sure. It doesn't really matter what the details are, it's fairly clear he was sacked but the statement could have been worded more diplomatically at absolutely no cost to anyone. Instead, it's an unnecessary news story
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