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Trump - The positives - (see Mod note in OP)

DUBLINIRL

I haven't really ever managed to understand why people elected Trump the first time nevermind the second time. I've heard the high level stuff like he is building a wall to keep the Mexicans out and is going with a US first approach which I believe that means he will give less money to other countries, provide less defence abroad and increase tariffs on imports.

In Ireland we are overwhelmingly negative towards Trump and it seems largely based on his attitude and what he says as it just doesn't play well with most of us.

It seems like we can't have a conversation about the positives Trump brings that make people vote for him in a more emphatic way that it seems any recent republican presidents.

Can people help us understand why people elected him and what tangible benefits he has brought to people's lives?

There are other threads to say how much you dislike him and his policies so if that is your take could you please use any of those as it would be good if many of us could finally understand why this man is president again.

Mod Note: there is to be absolutely no discussion about gender realignment, trans, etc. or a permanent ban from the Politics will be issued.

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twinytwo

And you know on his last day he is gonna pardon himself and everyone in his family.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215186#Comment_123215186

If Biden can - and did - get away with it , why would 'nt Trump?

In his final days in office, President Joe Biden pardoned his siblings and their spouses.

Biden issued blanket pardons for his brother James and his wife, Sara, his sister Valerie and her husband, John Owens, and his brother Francis. A few weeks earlier, Biden pardoned his son, Hunter for tax and gun crimes. Biden also issued other pardons and commutations for his aides and friends.

Of course Trump will do the same.

dulpit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215448#Comment_123215448

He shouldn't, but he will. Biden also shouldn't have and has set a rotten precedent.

spacecoyote

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215448#Comment_123215448

I guess we'll never be able to get a definitive answer to it, but I'd wonder if Bidens move to pardon was exclusively driven by Trumps win and his vindictive nature?

He almost had to get in a preemptive strike knowing what would likely be coming his family's way if he didn't.

I don't think he'd have bothered if Harris had won

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215618#Comment_123215618

Very obviously so, respectfully. He knew full well what sort of low character Trump has and acted pre-emptively.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215618#Comment_123215618

He also didn't pardon himself , which Trump will absolutely seek to do.

Those pardons , whilst not a great precedent, when viewed with some of the other pardons were clearly taken as a protection against Trump targeting them for "revenge" rather than actual wrong-doing.

Igotadose

The whole presidential pardon thing, like so much, is badly in need of overhaul. Need some controls over the politics, and no, I don't know what that is - Congressional overrides? SCOTUS review?

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215930#Comment_123215930

It's properly medieval. Ironic for a country that likes to style itself as a republic.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215930#Comment_123215930

It's utter nonsense.

Yet another "Pretend King" feature that they've built into the Office of President

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123216073#Comment_123216073

Mmph. There is a need to be able to pardon people posthumously, as well as overruling egregious SCOTUS decisions, like denial of death penalty appeals (not like Orange Julius Caesar would ever do that, but other presidents have.) Not sure how to square this circle, as the Constitution currently stands.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123215860#Comment_123215860

Should not really matter what sort of a character the incoming President was or is. Fact is, Biden's son for example faced criminal charges.

From Wiki, Biden was convicted of three federal firearms-related felony charges in June 2024 after he had admitted to illegally owning a gun while a drug user. His tax affairs have been under federal criminal investigation since late 2018, and in September 2024, he pled guilty to all of the tax charges. There should not be one lax for Biden's son because he is Biden's son, and a different law for everyone else.

https://apnews.com/article/hunter-biden-pardon-poll-approve-disapprove-survey-cb7b7e4931b0a778bd0a68cc1733c4a9

Of course Trump is no better.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123216288#Comment_123216288

Agreed , but not within the imprimatur of a single person.

By all means have a "Presidential Pardon Commission" or whatever run by a bunch of retired Senior judges etc. that bring Pardons to the sitting President for approval.

But having a single person being able to wave their hand and give a pardon is totally wrong.

dulpit

The president as a role was so close to a monarch that a suggestion was that the title of address for the president would be highness.

It's bonkers to me that so much power resides in 1 person and 1 person taking on the role can change things so dramatically. Parliamentary democracy ftw

spacecoyote

First US deaths from measles in 10 years, yeah, that vaccine skeptic as head of the health department is a great idea

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217050#Comment_123217050

His response when questioned about was disturbing to say the least.

Essentially he said "Ah well , these things happen and so far it's only Mennonites"

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217713#Comment_123217713

Another case in the Seattle area. Not clear if related.

I had toyed with the idea of going to Texas this year to see some friends. San Antonio. Not now.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217763#Comment_123217763

Hundreds of millions of people in America, I think you'd be safe enough. You would probably encounter a lot of people who are pro-Trump though, unlike in Ireland, so may be an eye opener.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217830#Comment_123217830

Measles is so virulent though, lasts in the air in the room with someone who has it, destroys preexisting immunities if you have them, … Definitely don't want to contract it.

My trip was part of attending a convention. Amusingly, when a similar convention was run in 2020 in Kentucky and of course no restrictions on attendees, many people came down with Covid. No masking, big crowds, lots of older attendees. Several died as a result. Hope it was worth it.

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123217861#Comment_123217861

Surely if you are vaccinated then you are safe against measles.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123218527#Comment_123218527

Vaccines make you less likely to catch a disease , but do not give you absolute immunity.

If you do catch it , the vaccine should weaken the infection , lessening the impact.

But if you are one of the few vaccinated in a sea of unvaccinated , the chances of getting it are much higher and the level of mutation will spike , increasing the chances that you get infected.

Red Silurian

Do we think he will use the meeting on the 12th to rip Micheal Martin to shreds or is he more likely to use the opportunity to forget about politics for the day and enjoy himself?

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123227246#Comment_123227246

To be honest, he probably thinks Leo Varadkar has gone bald. Trump is not a details guy and never has been. I'd say it'll be a fairly standard occasion.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123227328#Comment_123227328

The same could be said for a lot of republican US presidents to be fair. The word "bushism" comes to mind

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123227418#Comment_123227418

Yes and no. I see what you're getting but the "Bushism" was something to be managed and concealed decades ago and is now front and centre.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123227488#Comment_123227488

Most important word in your reply is the first one

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123227246#Comment_123227246

False dichotomy. Ripping people to shreds one of the ways in which he he enjoys himself. (The other is basking in sycophantic adoration. MM might - or might not - avoid being ripped to shreds by offering sufficient quantities of sycophantic adoration.)

OrangeBadger

Huge positives for Elon/zuck/bezos and all the other billionaires, these guys work hard so the enormous jump in their wealth is appreciated by them so that's one positive.

Also the Tate brothers have been saved so it's positive for them, all those money laundering/sex trafficking investigations were becoming a drag so it's great that Donald personally Intervened, a big positive.

And don't get me started on our goblin friend from Mordor he is positive glowing

Del Griffith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123229462#Comment_123229462

All 3 are down in wealth this year since Trump came in, not up

Bishop of hope

HHis World view seems to be a negative for everyone. But he sure has put the politicians in every state to work and made them take a look at what they're doing. Making them think for themselves and not depending on a US lead on every crisis facing us.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123236547#Comment_123236547

Whether that's actually a positive remains to be seen.