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Child Item

Keeping Irish Registered Car in UK

greyc

Hi, I just need some advice on what I should do with my car while we’re away. We’re living in Spain at the moment and we’re likely to be here for the next 12-18 months.

I can’t bring my car over here, as apart from it being a RHD, my insurance company will only cover it comprehensively for 30 days. I had planned to leave it in London with my daughter so that she could use it, and I could also have a car to use when I visit her, and could take it back to Ireland occasionally during this period.

Someone told me that I could leave the car long term in the UK, and don’t need to re-register it if I’m not living there, but on reading up on it, it seems that it can only be kept there for 6 months in any 12 month period.

The other option of course is to sell it, but it’s an Ioniq 5 and I’d lose a shed load of money on it.

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated.

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Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058377779/keeping-irish-registered-car-in-uk

Either way, your U.K. resident daughter cannot drive a non-U.K. registered car in the U.K. as it breaches the terms of the U.K. VAT and duty exclusion for temporary imports (equivalent to Ireland’s similar provisions). The consequence of her being found driving it would more likely be the seizing of the car until the tax is paid and the car reregistered (not what you want) rather than a criminal sanction on her (provided it is otherwise taxed, insured and NCT’d).

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122765600#Comment_122765600

Thats a bit of a tricky one being an EV, since there was no probably no VRT paid in the first place therefore no VRT refunded when exported.

If the car was petrol/diesel, you could get a VRT refund alright but then you’d have to pay VRT again when importing the car. So its probably easier to just export it without a VRT refund and then import it again and not have to pay VRT

Firblog

@greyc she was with Aviva @Marcusm

All comments

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058377779/keeping-irish-registered-car-in-uk

greyc

Thanks for the info I wasn’t aware of that, so that option is obviously a non-runner.

Probably the two alternatives I have are either to cut my losses and sell it, or bring it to Spain and re-register it with Spanish plates, so that I can insure it over here.

If I chose the latter, I’m not sure if there would be any issues when I return to Ireland re changing back to Irish plates?

M3CS

If you bring the car to Spain and register it there I think you'll be able to avail of the VRT rebate scheme and get a sum of cash back. There will be a registration tax to pay to get the car on Spanish plates but if you stay there for more than six months and bring the car back to Ireland after that you may be able to avail of the Irish VRT exemption when registering it here again.

Someone that knows more than me about this may chime in and confirm if it's possible.

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122765600#Comment_122765600

Thats a bit of a tricky one being an EV, since there was no probably no VRT paid in the first place therefore no VRT refunded when exported.

greyc

Thanks guys really appreciate the info, and if anyone else has done this before or if you can think of other options I’ve missed I’d be delighted to hear from you.
I know it’s a first world problem, but I just want to try and get things sorted asap.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122765908#Comment_122765908

I assume it's obvious, but just incase… If you bring the car to Spain do not drive it over an EU border until it is registered. And even after it is registered do not let a non resident drive it across a border. People seem to regular get caught with this stuff.

Luna84

I've seen English people drive around on English plates while living in Ireland. But this is rural Ireland compared to the well policed London so you would most likely be caught straight away if you done the same as they do in Ireland.

M3CS

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122765621#Comment_122765621

My mistake - didn't realise it was an EV!

greyc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122766043#Comment_122766043

Hi, I’m not sure I understand this. If I bring the car to Spain I’m allowed to drive it on Irish plates for 6 months, although my Irish insurance will only cover me comprehensively for 30 days, so I would need to change the plates and insure it here within the 30 days. I assume this is much the same core all EU countries.
Are you saying that once I get to Spain I can’t cross another EU border with the Irish plates, or this only applies if I’ve started the process to re-register it?

M3CS

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122766043#Comment_122766043

Like the OP, I don't understand this either - can you elaborate on what you mean?

M3CS

I met an Irish guy in Spain that bought a house there a few years ago and has been living in it permanently since then (ie. it's his only house and not a holiday home). He has an Irish registered car that he had transported over and has been driving it around his area in Spain without any issue. Despite now being a Spanish resident and owning a home there he has chosen to keep his Irish registered car.

I met another Irish guy who has been there for well over a year driving a UK registered car - again, seemingly without issue.

I wanted to ask both of these about their insurance policies and how they work but they're acquaintances I met through colleagues in work so it wasn't appropriate. In some parts of Spain there are tons of foreign registered cars there on a long-term basis so I think there must be some legitimate way to insure an Irish or UK registered car while living there.

Luna84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122767641#Comment_122767641

I was never in Spain only the canary islands so I have no first hands experience of it over there. But what they are doing isn't legal but as I said a few posts up about English people living in Ireland still on their UK plates is what those guys in Spain are doing over there. You can lie if you get stopped and just say I'm on holiday etc.. and hope they tell you to drive on so.

Sir Galahad

If you end up with a member of "Traffico" that checks your NCT status online you better be fluent in Spanish to make your excuse 😎. Why would you expect not to be fined if you're tax domiciled there ?

greyc

There are a few insurance companies who will insure English registered cars for a period of 3 months while they’re getting their Spanish plates, but since Brexit they won’t insure Irish vehicles.
All Irish insurance companies are legally obliged to insure your car while in another EU country, however they only have to cover you to the lowest legal requirement in that country, ie 3rd Party.

Charles Babbage

Firstly, there is a question as to whether you will in fact be resident in Spain. The legislation here presumably reflects EU directives and going somewhere for a big year intending to return may not make you resident if your personal ties remain in Ireland. If you remain normally resident in Ireland then you can drive the car on Irish plates. That doesn't solve your insurance problem though.

Maybe just export it to the UK and register it there and let the daughter use it, you'll still be down but at least someone in the family will benefit.

greyc

Thanks, that’s an option I’m considering alright, but I think we can get temporary residency once we can prove that we have a rental agreement for longer than 6 months.

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122773740#Comment_122773740

Unfortunately Spanish residency does not come into this and the 6 month period will not increase to the period during which the OP is not Spanish resident. The exemption from Psanish registration and any other motor taxes extends only to 6 months in any year predicated upon NOT being Spanish resident. That is why, for example, and Irish resident with a holiday home in Spain could not leave an Irish registered car there indefinitely while (s)he remains resident in Ireland and travels there for less than 6 months of the year.

The imposition of a requirement to register and pay relevant tax on an immediate basis would be an undue restriction on the freedom of movement granted under the EV Treaties. The period chosen (in 1998) was six months although this can be extended to 9 months if the person is working in Spain (while remaining resident in Ireland).

The OP’s case just doesn’t seem to fit those facts. I had a similar position back 15 years ago when I spent most weekends in Dublin (plus longer periods) while living in London. At the outset, I was very conscious of the six months and, as I had two cars, I would swap them. Realistically, I always kept a copy of a U.K. electricity bill in the car to show that I was UK resident.

Ironically, the only time I was stopped by the guards was shortly after moving to Ireland permanenney and on my way to NCT centre for the VRT exemption.

For the OP, it could work in Spain - I spend a lot of time in Portugal and there are lots of permanent/semi-permanent foreign registered cars (ones which don’t travel back every six months). I would not like to get caught up in The bureaucracy. RHD is also a pain for car parks and stuff and I don’t know what charging accessibility is with a foreign-registered cars - is there a tourist premium they’d have to pay.

greyc

Thanks for the input, very informative. I’m going to contact a lawyer here, who has done some work for us before and get his opinion on what we should do.
Even if I’m not importing the car, I understand that EU citizens may only stay in Spain for a period of 90 days, after which time they must apply for Spanish residency, so it looks like we’re going to have to do this anyway.

Marcusm

once you go over 90 days in any EU member state you need to complete the local formalities - it’s just that there are none in Ireland. For Spain, you will need to establish that you have work or funds to independently support yourself and, of course, surrender yourself to the local bureaucratic requirements. It’s just a right to continue residing rather than making you a resident, per se.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122767590#Comment_122767590

If you drive a car across an EU border and that car in not registered in you name in the country you are registered in, then you have may have imported a car illegally into that country and are subject to the rules of that country, not the EU and you need to check the rules for that country.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122776361#Comment_122776361

A person recently arrived Spain would not be resident immediately in Spain in that sense. Someone might spend a couple of months in Spain and then go to France. There is no mention of the OP taking up employment, there are choosing to live in Spain for a while. In that first 6 months there would be no problem in them going anyway.

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122776361#Comment_122776361

There is certainly no “illegally” in that context. The question is whether the temporary importation exemption for certain registration taxes applies. In that respect, there is no express requirement in article 3 of the relevant 1983 directive (as updated) that the vehicle was previously registered in the member state in which the individual is resident. That might sound counterintuitive but and Irish resident could pop to France, buy a car there and drive it across the border to Spain and keep it there for up to 6 months without it being required to be reregistered either in Ireland or Spain. How such a person could maintain insurance etc would probably mean that this doesn’t happen very often (or at least not properly).

You might be thinking of the more onerous conditions applicable to frontier workers?

greyc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122777288#Comment_122777288

Yes that’s the case alright, I’m retired and while we’d initially planned to move to Spain for 6 months, we just recently got an option on another apartment for 12 months from next May.
If we were only staying for 6 months I wasn’t going to bother bringing the car over, but seeing as we’ll be staying for longer it might be the best option.

I know a RHD isn’t ideal but I think in most cases it’s probably not going to mattertoo much.

whomitconcerns

Export to England change plates then export to Spain. Easy. 🤣

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122778221#Comment_122778221

unless it’s unlikely that the Spanish reg process was going to take more than six months, I don’t see what advantage to the hop, skip and jump. The requirement that the Spanish formalities “must have already started” would seem to rule out any advantage unless these take months.

greyc

No I think it’s fairly straight forward, maybe only a few weeks. I’m not going to be taking it over until Feb or March so I’ll try and have everything in order by then.
On a slightly different topic, car hire is still really cheap in Malaga, providing you take their basic package. I have an annual policy with CarHireExcess so I don’t need to upgrade to the hire company’s rip off insurance, and I’ve just booked a medium size car for 3 weeks for €108.

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122779919#Comment_122779919

Jesus, a fiver per day is below my expected look of a tenner a day! Will they get you in rental of the tolltag or anything?

greyc

Not sure but I usually set Google maps to avoid tolls. I used the DoYouSpain website, and usually find that 3 weeks before picking up a car is the ideal time to book.

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122780164#Comment_122780164

sounds great. I signed up for Bipngo for France, Spain, Portugal as the “no toll” routes from French ferry ports down were just awful. Wouldn’t work for a hire car and if you’re just staying around the area it would not matter. Over 12 months, I could see you heading Cordova, Seville, Cadiz etc and toll roads might be more prevalent.

Firblog

OH was able to extend her Irish car insurance for 2 consecutive periods of 90 days in Spain. Cost was less than €100 each time.