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Solar panels get €1,000/acre so what’s the catch?

Kerry2021

So I’ve heard a lot lately about solar panels getting farmers €1,000/acre for their land.

I want to get a full understanding of it all and would like for everyone else to tell me what they know or have heard about it.

I’ve read lately in the papers about solar farms having an operational lifespan of 40 years. However I’ve read that there is 10 year leases being given out. So what happens after 10 years when the lease is up if for whatever reason the company you are dealing with doesn’t want you continue the lease? Also your farm would be covered in these solar panels & sub stations etc so wouldn’t this leave anyone in a very poor position to try negotiate a new deal? Plus if the company that is leasing from you somehow goes belly up how would you ever get rid of the solar panels and all the rest of the stuff? You’d probably be stuck with it.

Something else I want to know is if it is possible for a farm to go back to being a farm after the 40 years or whatever are up? Or will there be all cables and concrete etc all over the farm preventing it from ever being land again?

I know €1,000/acre sounds like a lot but you’d have to be getting paid that money into a company. The company would be leasing out the farm, this type of company would be subjected to 25% tax and there’s no way around that. Also when a person would try pass on the farm afterwards they wouldn’t be able to avail of whatever special tax treatment that farmland is subjected to usually.

Personally I would never in a million years be in favour of solar panels. It’s just a death by 1,000 cuts much the same as planting a farm in forestry. I’d genuinely be extremely interested to hear what everyone else has to say about it though

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wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122723132#Comment_122723132

Yea, €1300/acre plus €100/acre if we graze it with sheep index linked

Markcheese

For The guy totally surrounded by panels it does look bad , I'm not sure what the set back distances should be , but like forestry there should be some ,

But it'd be a very big deal for people to be entitled to a view , it could mean no development anywhere ,

Also should a neighbour be allowed object to what's on a piece of land - this was all cereals when I moved here and now there are cattle , as a vegan - I object , or your fences, on your land affect my enjoyment of my home ..

TinyMuffin

the land grabbing pricks coolmore are trying to set up solar farms now too.

80sDiesel

Sure ain't pretty. The house in Meath mentioned above.

https://youtu.be/e2ZfsfPgLdU?si=fkEsUMe7bVF968I8

Castlekeeper

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122723110#Comment_122723110

You'll surely try and knock a bit I'd craic out of seeing how much you can draw out of him?

whelan2

I think the 400 acres is very greedy, they might have gotten a better reception with a quarter of that

dmakc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122723264#Comment_122723264

The term NIMBY can distract from what is in my opinion a very real issue. Primetime had a house in Meath last month literally surrounded by solar, the couple had moved out to green pastures and the only mistake they made was not owning the land around them. Now they're looking to sell with no callers.

Seperately, farmers can't compete with energy money for leased land, farmers lose out while prime agricultural land becomes an industrial estate locked away for a lifetime / eternity. A few years back a solar company near me bought land from under the nose of a long term lease, farmer only found out after the deal was done. No honest farmer would ever conduct business this way, yet a faceless entity can run down the farmer without consequences, they had the security fence and cameras up in no time anyway.

These private opportunitistic companies are in it exclusively for their own gain and will completely blacken communities if regulations aren't developed. Many don't engage with the community as same Primetime episode showed; "it's unfortunate that the community don't want us there" was the comment by the developer.

If the country used these Apple billions to get solar grants on housing and businesses, we'd be much better off.

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122647641#Comment_122647641

And what the grid can accept, your local may be maxed out.

Map of local connections June 2024

https://www.esbnetworks.ie/new-connections/generator-connections-group/availability-capacity-map

roosterman71

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122723264#Comment_122723264

That's exactly it. We need renewables and people are calling out for it but no way do those same people want to look at solar panels or turbines. We need houses but all and sundry object to houses being built near them (why cities aren't allowed build up is another stupid rule)

whelan2

There's supposedly a 400 acre solar farm going for planning not far from here. Alot of uproar but if people want sustainability etc I don't get all the backlash. Alot of not in my back yard stuff.

Mitchells33

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122723110#Comment_122723110

Sensible woman😄

Cushtie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122723110#Comment_122723110

Did ye even get a chance to talk money?

wrangler

We had a guy here today looking for land for solar panels, he wants all my land signed up. OH says it'll be over her dead body.

So that's that

Victor

"The grid connection for the project will be the same cost be it 1 or 5 units erected."

Not quite. The local system might tolerate a 1 MW generator being added (possibly with minor augmentation), especially if there is local demand and the location is partway along the main 10 or 20 kV line. That might not be the case with a larger installation. There are a huge number of single generator locations in the UK.

While the digging of trenches or the erection of poles might be much the same cost regardless of voltage (there will be incremental changes like different spacings), the cables themselves will be different and the equipment will be more sophisticated with a larger operation.

have2flushtwice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122665362#Comment_122665362

Planning will be the same cost.

The grid connection for the project will be the same cost be it 1 or 5 units erected.

Consultancy and surveys will be the same cost.

I know 1 wind farm, initial application was 2003, first ground was turned last year.

Spread it over 1 mw or 5 mw, thats how you reduce your costs.

Go into your local coco planning system online and take a look at an existing application. There's far more work and cost in the local studies that the unit detail itself

Victor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122665524#Comment_122665524

1 kW for 1 hour is 1 kWh or one unit of electricity. Many kitchen kettles would be about 2 kW. A microwave oven about 0.8 kW.

On average, across the country, households use electricity at a rate of about 1-2 kW total across the year.

So, a 1 MW wind turbine would power 500-1000 households. However, wind doesn't blow (adequately) all the time, so realistically it might power 200-400 households.

The access road needs to be good enough to take a crane that might weigh about 100 tonnes. No sharp bends.

peterofthebr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122665362#Comment_122665362

a substation is around 8km away. I had no idea mw were that expensive 😳.. though less then 100k.. I'm obviously getting my MW mixed up with KW.

eire23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122665292#Comment_122665292

Think it's generally well over a million per installed mw as a rough guide. Proably depends on the site, access and the smaller the build the bigger the costs. Are you beside a substation? If not probably forget about it. Any second hand turbines being taking down of that size will be worn out. A 2.5mw will be between 60-80m high and 40m blades or maybe a bit bigger. To get a loan you need the wind speed recorded for a certain amount of time..think 8ms is where it needs to be or higher.

peterofthebr

Dont know if this is correct thread. But I'm thinking about a wind turbine on a site on the farm. I'm looking to understand size difference between say 1,2 3 and 4 MW turbines? . I'm only thinking of installing one basically in the middle of the farm to sell back to the grid
Qs are
-What's the cost to install say 2.5MW?
-What's the lane/road access needed/requirements? Just a rough idea will do me

- it need to be close to power lines I guess (to transfer power onto grid),?

-if say installing a 3MW turbine I guess the ground area used is small and it would still allow land to be used for feeding livestock?
-neighbours..

. Whats the rough cost for say 2MW turbine vs 3MW total cost to farmer.? Thanks

Kevhog1988

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122619982#Comment_122619982

i think its very dependant on esb infrastructure in the area and proximity of substations etc.

Cushtie

There are 6 turbines on it. It's fairly old, some upgrades done recently so I'm guessing about 6MW with 20kV line going to 38kV substation about 8km away.

Then there is another 4.5MW farm also tieing into this line.

I suppose first thing is to see if there is capacity in the substation.

Probably a non goer but interesting doing the research all the same. Alot of variables that need to come together and it takes just one to rule it out.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122640848#Comment_122640848

How small is the windfarm? Are they connecting to 20kV or 38 kV powerlines? Your project would have to be done in collaboration with the windfarm and likely would not be able to produce to its maximum capacity either as it may have to cap its output on windy days. The windfarm has a specified lease and planning timeframe left to run. You would have to fit in with that timeframe. It's a difficult venture to negotiate and very tight financially.

Cushtie

So I went down a bit of a rabbit hole in this. The new scheme announced this year - Small Scale renewable electricity support SCRESS is a guaranteed feed in price of 12 cent for SME for projects between 50kW and 6MW. What I can't seem to figure out is the 12 cent the max you get per unit. Ie if you are getting 10c from Energia you will get a top up of 2c from this scheme. And if you get 15 cent from energia do they claw back to 3 cent.

At 12c it doesn't make financial sense.

Im kind of interested as I would have access to around 10 acres adjacent to a small wind farm so the connection to the grid "should" be relatively uncomplicated. I think it would depend on if the line was good enough and the substation could take the extra power generated.

Water John

Unless a company had access to capital, it couldn't build either wind or solar, without a long term contract, against which to raise finance. Solar farms will do away with peak price at lunch time. The only peak then to be tackled is 5-7pm.

Victor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630993#Comment_122630993

I can't comment on the exact details, however:

Wholesale prices can vary wildly. Today, the daily price has varied from €56.52/MWh to €240.24/MWh (5 to 24 cents per unit) However, given that solar is fairly predictable, I suspect that many have long term contracts.

The solar farm operator also has to pay their connection fee, even if they export no electricity.

kollegeknight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630760#Comment_122630760

like I said we are surrounded by them.
there’s only one neighbour with issue and he originally came from Dublin with his American wife.

we had a dog kennel in the area at one stage and it nearly drove people cracked but not a word about the turbines.

Being surround by Sitka spruce with my horizon taken, I’d take turbines.

Water John

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630993#Comment_122630993

Yeah about 5 acres pre Mw. Don't have efficiency figures to calculate return.

148multi

There's a large turbine farm bedside my bil,

It doesn't bother them at all, got half the price of solar panels and batteries plus €900 into a/c each year. Not a house they would be sitting out back sipping wine. There's another house that is beside 1 turbine and it drove them absolutely silly, sold up for small money, a polish couple live in it now and have no issues, all that said have been in a house east of the wind farm and some evenings the flicker is bad.

Cushtie

Would the Solar companies be recieving the wholesale price of Electricity. I,m presuming so, unless they had negotiated a rate with the utility companies? If it costs around 1.1 million to develop 1MW of Solar, which would generate about €90,000 per year at the current wholesale price of 10cent, by the time they have funding paid, land rent paid and other running costs, its not huge.

I think it takes approx 4 to 5 acres for 1MW

Or are my sums way off?

Water John

I'm just 400m from a large turbine, not on my land. Don't take any notice of it. The noise levels are what largely dictate distance. Wish my neighbour well on his good fortune. They have a bonus of a great internal road network. Solar farms in the US are getting farmers to run sheep on the land, best ground maintenance, win/win.