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Double axle trailer

Seadin

Hi just wondering if the combined gross weight of car and double axle trailer is less that 3500kg can you drive with B license?

Also if you have a full B licence but learner permit for BE can you still drive with the trailer on your car on your own or do you actually need someone with a BE licence in the car with you?

TIA

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Markcheese

I think you theoretically can drive a combined 3,5 ton vehicle on a b licence,

But good luck finding a vehicle that has the legal towing capacity, and would still be under 3,5 in combination with the trailer ..

Although I may have that arseways ...

Del2005

The amount of axles is irrelevant. For a B licence all that you need to be legal is that your car is rated to tow the trailer and the combination has a MAM less than 3.5t, or 4.25t if the trailers MAM is <750kg.

https://www.ndls.ie/about/cars-and-trailers.html#can-i-tow-a-trailer-on-a-car-licence

The only learners permits where you don't need to be accompanied are the As and W.

Seadin

J am a bit confused because I could technically drive a caravan with single axle on B licence but yet not a double axle trailer if the weight of it goes over 750kg. I saw on the Garda facebook that a jeep and double axle trailer was stopped yesterday because the person driving it hadn't the BE category.

I have a saloon car with double axle trailer, will I be stopped by the Garda? How would they know I comply or not? The car weight myself and a 8x4 trailer would hardly go over 3500kg? Car is 1650kg

I am just going to go away now and do the test to be sure.

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122667607#Comment_122667607

Another example of a glaring inconsistency in so called road safety rules. Just get your 16 year old to drive a JCB Fastrac at up to 60kph pulling anything up to 20,000 kgs and you'll be as safe as a house. Yet some poor ejit pulling an 800kg trailer with his car will be vilified as a potential mass murderer.

blackbox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122667846#Comment_122667846

You may only tow a trailer over 750kg if it has brakes. Number of axles is irrelevant. (This may not apply to agricultural tractors)

Whocare

It go by gross weight of trailer so it doesn't matter if empty or loaded went garda Calculate the weight

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122668499#Comment_122668499

So if my trailer has brakes, can I tow it with a normal saloon car or must I have a BE on my license to do so? It be just so much easier if every trailer on a car needed a BE category.

Seadin

I know I can't tow a horsebox but a 8x4 trailer on car?

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122668499#Comment_122668499

Where does it say that a trailer needs brakes? Trailers made recently have to have brakes but if you've a trailer from before brakes where mandatory it's still legal to tow. Just like if you put someone in the back of a new car they have to wear a seat belt but if you put someone in the back of a car from the 1960s they don't need seat belts, as they where never fitted.

Dirty Nails

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122669476#Comment_122669476

Double-axle 02 trailers manufactured and first sold prior to June 2011 need a service or running brake on at least one axle.

Double-axle 02 trailers manufactured or first sold after June 2011 need service or running brakes on both axles.

https://www.rsa.ie/road-safety/road-users/professional-drivers/vehicle-safety-legislation/light-trailers/braking-requirements-for-light-trailers

All trailers after 2012 has to have a chassis plate, before that I suppose if there was a doubt you were overweight you'd get escorted to a weighbridge

blackbox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122669762#Comment_122669762

From RSA - I can't find the relevant S.I. but I am (naively) assuming the RSA checked it.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122670072#Comment_122670072

Trailers from 2011 have to be braked only if they have a MAM >1,500kg, trailers from before 2011 or have a MAM <1,500kg don't.

A secondary coupling is sufficient (instead of a breakaway brake)for older trailers with a MAM exceeding 750kg, and those manufactured since 1st June 2011 provided the MAN does not exceed 1.5 tonnes.

mgbgt1978

You were going well Del…..but I think you read that quote wrong. It refers to certain Braked Trailers not requiring a Breakaway cable, but rather a secondary coupling (usually a chain and ring).

That would be why they are saying a secondary coupling "instead of" a breakaway cable.

Whocare

9935452

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122675792#Comment_122675792

What i have done to cover myself .

My car is plated to pull 1300kgs.

I have a 8x5 twin axel ifor williams which is plated to 2000kgs. 440kgs empty.

Because the trailer is plated to 2000kgs which is above what the car is legal to tow, im technically wrong .

I bought a set of plates on ebay and plated the trailer to 1300kgs .

If im.ever stopped ieverything lines up

Whocare

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122677719#Comment_122677719

Why don't just get license it not that hard

9935452

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122677769#Comment_122677769

I have the license,still doesnt mean the car is legal to pull more than 1300kgs

mgbgt1978

If you have the B+E then the MAM of the trailer is not a problem. It's the actual weight of the trailer, and it's contents ,that is taken into account.

You could have just left it plated as it was, and just ensure that whatever you Tow doesn't exceed the Towing Capacity of the Car.

blackbox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122677719#Comment_122677719

driving with trailer unsafe due to exceeding towing vehicle design
committing fraud
driving uninsured

Seadin

I booked the test today online. I'm on waiting list. It says that il be waiting,10-12 weeks before I get a notification to book a test. So does that mean I could be waiting longer to get called? I wouldn't want to be falling or the test will never get done. Joke of a system that they can't have something better than that.

9935452

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122681983#Comment_122681983

How so to all 3?.

Not exceeding what the car is designed to pull.

Fraud? Its not illegal to replate a trailer. Its done all the time.

Driving uninsured ? Already checked it with them , no issues there

traco

Article here fomr September if interested:

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/court-for-drivers-not-properly-licensed-for-towing-trailers/

CiniO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122670792#Comment_122670792

I thing you misunderstood those regulations.

Only what changed from 2011 was that multi-axle trailers must have brakes on all of the axles.

Before that 2 axle or 3 axle trailers could have brakes only on one axle.

But all trailers above 750kg always had to have brakes.

No car type approved in the EU is rated to tow unbraked trailer above 750kg.

CiniO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058371296/double-axle-trailer

Crucial here is to understand what is "gross weight".

It's not the actual weight of the vehicle+load (trailer+load), but rated maximum weight.

For a car you can check that parameter in the logbook (in field F.1 if I remember correctly).

For a trailer you can check that on a trailer plate.

For example I have a 2gen Honda CRV (car actually weights about 1550kg) but GVW is 1990kg.

I have one axle ifor williams boxvan which is rated as GVW 1400kg.

So the sum of GVW of the car + trailer is 3390 kg which is below 3500kg so this allows me to tow this set with B licence.

However I hardly can imagine any 2 axle trailer with such low GVW to be able to fit withing this 3500kg limit allowing towing on B licence.

Also many heavier vehicle would be rated GVW more like 2500-2700 (some 4x4, pickups, etc) leaving less than 1000kg for a triler.

Not so easy to find a bigger set of vehicle+trailer to fit withing 3500kg limit.

BrianD3

Just to demonstrate why the number of axles "rule of thumb" for B licences isn't a rule of thumb, let alone law.

https://woodfordtrailers.com/the-lightweight-trailer/#LightweightTrailerSpecification

Here we have single axle car transporters with 1300 kg MAM and twin axles with 1600 kg MAM.

You could tow one of those 1600 kg twin axles using some models of smallish cars like a VW Golf with a B licence. Whereas you couldn't tow the 1300 kg single axle with a Range Rover with a B licence.

Seadin

I can't understand why they just don't have a separate category on the licence for towing all trailers. It makes no sense that you can tow one single axle trailer on a B licence but you need a BE licence to tow a bigger trailer. You need no test to drive a tractor and trailer out in the road which weighs several tonnes more it just makes no sense.

I also think it's ridiculous that you have to do a driving test again with a full car license. And passing it all depends on the driving conditions,the tester and having luck on the day. Why one couldnt go away and complete a driving and practical course on trailers and then pass that test and add to your licence. I just think the testers will have to pass and fail so many on the day its not a real reflection on if a person is competent or not in their test. I know good drivers who failed their driving test and I know terrible drivers that passed first time.

Seadin

Just wondering is the waiting time for car and trailer test the same as car tests? Can you go on cancellation list if you fail? It would be a disaster if you had to wait another 8 months to do the test.