For regular riders of events what is the preference in terms of on/off road mix?
Gravel Grinder in Fermanagh seems to be up around 90% off road. If that was south of the border 90% typical Coillte woods would have me reaching for the uppers.
I like mixed off road sectors and don't mind having to lift bike over things but most other people may differ. 20% - 50% of varied off road once the roads are boreens seems to be where most of is landing.
Just helping with an event so was curious as to other peoples opinions
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/51646050
That's as good a gravel ride as I've done; Knockmealdowns are streets ahead of any where else I've ridden in Munster for gravel options
*5 mountain passes north to south which are linked with back roads and or gravel
*River tracks out of Cappaquin
*St Declan's way
*Some lovely private but accessible gravel sectors around lismore
The road sections are really pretty to especially in South Tipp.
Some technical descending on both and a few dismounts but nothing out of the ordinary. I don't know if I'd bother with Mount Mellary farm roads again sections were like the Arenberg with a failed foundation
As an aside the official Statement Declan's way is still changing evolving.
The Gap in the Comeraghs taken from Tipperary side of Knockmealdowns
Where the civil war ended
Where was I?
The post is a repurposed cart axle which given it's length was from a wealthy estate rather than a tenant farmer...
Definitely with you on the hunting - often come across the signs when exiting a forest when I've entered at a much less used entry point (but an entry point nonetheless). Signs where they park up is as much as they bother with.
The first thing Coillte need to do is just allow open access to all woods and point to the close to non existent duty of care they have towards recreational users as per the amended Occupiers Liability act. Dealing with the cost of any spurious claims or otherwise is just part of the cost of their remit; the benefit to the general population far out weighs it.
I'm often in woods with harvesting gear; there is close to no issue. It's obvious they are there and we would generally avoid not because of any risk but because the tracks make the fire roads horrible to ride.
While they are at it they would want to come up with a proper system in relation to allowing access to deer hunters. The current system is the hunters put signs on the morning telling you to stay out. Where I ride there is just too many access points that this is completely unworkable.
Each season sections of woods should be set aside for hunting and properly closed off by Coillte.
It is some Mickey Mouse system as it stands; I've twice had a rifle pointed at me in Coillte lands over 25 years; once by a poacher and once by a hunter who had paid. The latter got a bollicking after he got shirty with me.
I've a "lovely" 200km audax route with about 30km or some of Coillte tracks which I can't run as an event or permanent; although a bigger obstacle might be me having to ride a route check 😀
I don't disagree, but I think in this State it has to be locally driven. Or at least perceived to be locally driven. Look at the objections to greenways that are on old rail lines in some parts of the country!
But Coillte* could be made to do more - there's a lot of dead end fire roads which wouldn't take much to create loops or better linkage between forests or forests and roads to create routes.
*they should be made a non-commercial semi state with a different remit.
I'm convinced that there's a massive untapped market in this country for outdoor sports. We have this reputation of a green, natural island of rugged, outdoorsy folksy types. Which as anyone who lives here know, is nonsense. But the perception is still there and the tourists keep coming. Imagine how many more we could get, especially to places like the midlands, if we properly utilised our existing landscape. Just requires a tiny bit of imagination and motivation from someone in some department.
interesting development
Waterford county council's plan for a gravel network.😁
Planning in for several trails on the old bog railways, if Ballydermot wind farm happens it would also connect to these and would leave a big network of off road cycling in West Kildare and East Offaly
https://www.offalyexpress.ie/news/local-news/1779077/bord-na-mona-seeks-consent-for-second-major-offaly-cycling-trail.html
https://www.ballydermotwindfarm.ie/wp-content/uploads/sites/17/2022/08/Ballydermot-Wind-Farm-Draft-Amenity-Map.pdf
BnM have to do stuff to justify their existence now they no longer harvest peat, and leisure seems to be their big idea.
There's planning gone in to extend the Lough Boora trails, anyway, and I thought I read something about some of the trails around the Bog of Allen (or that general area)
That's a very big assumption
they're certainly planning on doing that in Longford, I'd imagine BnM are doing it elsewhere as well.
If they just put gravel along the old bog railways there would be a great network of routes all over the midlands
On the Coillte topic actually I watched this last week which was interesting
Just finished three days cycling in Catalonia, based in Lloret de Mar.
While I get Spain has a rich and varied cycling culture, Ireland is really in the halfpenny place.
It is just so easy to do here, woods and hills fully of routes, signposts everywhere, lots of challenging stuff (some more suited to MTB), public gravel access roads all the way to urban areas.
Crowd fund a 2 day tour to bring head of Coilte and Bord Failte here? Day 1 with electric bikes for them and day 2 dragged along the ground by a quad ISIS style if the message hasn't sunk in 😕.
Sounds like you were in Clonkreen wind farm, the entrance is close to Edenderry Power station. Mt Lucas is to the west and the under construction Cushaling wind farm is to the east, BNM have plans for an even bigger windfarm at Ballydermot aand have given a commitment facilitate joining them with the old bog railway lines to so it won't be long before there will be a big network in West Kildre and East Offaly. Add in the canals and we'll have a lot of gravel riding in this area.
Has anyone done any cycling in wind farms? Was out for a spin yesterday, did a bit of my usual canal route from Robertstown ad far as Edenderry and after continuing on past the town for a bit and turning south, I ended up in a wind farm. And there are apparently a few of them in the area, some with signs up advertising cycling/walking routes. They a seem to have nice hard packed gravel roads, bit like the forests I suppose. Between these wind farms, the bogs and the canals, there is a crazy amount of completely asphalt-free cycling to be done in the midlands
Well in fairness they do the same for mtb, with the enduro I think in carrick?
It is so frustrating - so much new active travel infrastructure is shared space, but apparently that's fine for me commuting but a massive danger at the weekend on the same bike (without the added weight of the work gear too!).
so we're not allowed ride our bikes in the woods, yet this, from the Irish gravel cycling facebook group. (allegedly a coillte forest)
the mind boggles.
Time went against me so 35-46,km was cut( which is a lovely smooth section of gravel) and the trespassing in Mellary.
Lovely really varied route. It's got a bit of everything except a bit of bog road.
Nearly killed a grey crow, had buzzards overhead for at least an hour, met a rather flightly pony. Lost count of the pedestrian bridges. Two lovely ford crossings. Great spin all round
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/47842246
A bit of wandering, porting and trespassing in the Knockmealdowns.
70% off road.
Got a dirty cut on my hand on the farm road section a few years back. Cycled into cord type electric fence. Nice bloody fork when I got home on the other side of mountain.
https://gravelunion.cc/article/travel-gravel-gravel-riding-on-the-emerald-isle
Might give people a few ideas.
I might be to blame for the difficulty encountered in Tipperary 😀
People cycling and people walking are expected to share greenways and much of the new "active travel" infrastructure but can't share forestry fire roads in Coillte!?! fwiw I've never experienced any issue or complaint using fire roads on the Wicklow Way, or other forestry areas. Only self entitled (dog) walkers I've met have been on non-coillte trails where cycling is allowed in the byelaws (unlike walking your dog off lead!)!
The document describes the signage that would be placed at the entrance to warn users that the area is multi-use and to remind cyclists of their responsibilities. It then lists a number of very reasonable criteria that a forest must meet to be considered as a FCA. These are listed below:
The forest should not be a high-use recreational forest already under pressure from many other recreational groups.
Forests with many developed looped or long-distance walks should not be considered. Similarly, where arrangements exist with groups to maintain the forest or other trails within the forest, consideration must be given to these in the first instance.
The topography should be relatively gentle rather than challenging – forest cycling areas are intended to provide for cyclists with lower levels of experience in the outdoors.
Forests with forecasted high levels of operations over the ten year period following the proposal should not be considered.
Consider likely ways that cyclists could use the forest and the likely routes they would take. Descents on forest roads should be avoided but where unavoidable, should be mitigated by long clear sightlines and through use of warning signage – cyclists cautioned to control their speed, etc…. Any walking trails within the forest that do not allow for safe dual-use should be marked for walking use only.
Finally, the document goes on to say that “Proposals for sites to be designated as Forest Cycling Areas will be assessed by the Recreation Unit in Coillte”.
Although, if cycling was still banned in in non-FCA's, it would rule out a lot of the Wicklow Mountains!
Department of forestry is up there with the most incompetent of our various departments.
Between dieback, felling licence fiasco it's been a sh1t show for years.
I can't get how Coillte are ok with deer hunting (with high powered rifles) and all access control being provided by hunter but regard cycling as this high risk activity that can't be entertained.
With the current occupier's liability act amendment the duty owed to recreational users isn't onerous at all.
I'm sure some cyclist will eventually cause a loss or insurance cost but in the general scheme of things the potential and upside to society in terms of recreation and tourism dwarfs and potential downside.
Update from David Flanagan today
Kinda disappointing but hardly surprising, all we can do is keep a squeeze on the politicians, we do have a Green minister for forestry, it has to be embarrassing for them to be trumpeting the amount of money spent on cycling amenities and then to have a semi state company bar cyclists for an existing cycling one.
“Between 1944 and 2021, 9,912 km of forest roads have been built in the public forest estate or on average 127 km annually”
5.1.1 Public forest roading, Ireland’s Forests - Annual Statistics 2022
I know the organiser and they managed to create a route avoiding Coilte properties.
