For Ireland and many other countries they can't mandate a figure for recycling, because some countries dont have a recycling plant.
This was all very predictable and was called out before the scheme was even introduced.
There is more waste on the streets since the scheme was introduced, particularly in urban areas.
Thanks.
I was under pressure and couldn't find it.
The plastics industry would like people to believe that plastic can be recycled infinitely. But this is a lie. At best, you can get a useable product from plastic in two or, if lucky, three cycles and most plastic (90%) simply cannot be recycled at all. When you couple that fact with the fact that there's nearly a million plastic bottles produced every minute (over a billion every day), you can understand why the plastics business would like the naive to buy into the bullshit idea of a "circular economy" with regards to plastics.
Frankly, when oil runs out on this planet, it might be better for mankind and the world over all, assuming mankind is still on it.
I agree completely.
As I said, adding a significant tax to PET items in the DRS would force the producers come up with a solution that actually reduced the amount of PET items sold.
As things stand there's no reason for them to change anything - everything has been de-risked/offloaded onto their customers. If the customers wouldn't stomach the increased tax, sales would collapse, the market would drive change.
I agree but just pointing out the target I have seen for PET is 90% collection. The EU Commission document doesn't specify actual recycling.
I used to travel to Frankfurt frequently on business. In the area I stayed I saw this every morning - all waste bins had been turned out overnight - the street cleaners came along every morning and cleared it up pretty quick to be fair.
The area was a business district with many, like me only in for 1 or 2 days so either unaware or, could care less about a bottle deposit - charging costs to expenses anyhow. So bins would have been great targets.
There is a slight problem with the targets. The target should be reducing single use plastic as a whole, not just increasing recycling. To recycle PET plastic you have to melt it which uses a lot of energy. It can only be recycled a finite number of times, and its uses dwindle with each iteration.
It seems to make the numbers easier, they want to get to 90% recycling first, and then start reducing what comes in plastic and then they will put pressure on to reduce the amount of plastic used. I mean, its not like the climate crisis is urgent or anything right?
Aluminium on the other hand can be recycled an infinite number of times, and the process is relatively straight forward.
A move, to make all drinks be in aluminium would achieve a lot more than the silly DRS scheme.
This is one of the Berlin style bins, bottles and cans left for the homeless to easily access without having to route through the actual bin.
Well thats a start however in my opinion it needs to go a lot further. There's a tendency from staunch supporters of Re-Turn to criticise the RVM tech, shop staff and even customers but flat out refuse to address the fundamental and glaring problems baked into this scheme:
- have bulk return machines (like you say) at local bottle banks and recycle centres - allow IBAN deposit refund - accept crushed containers - dont force people into shops to get their own money back (gombeenery) after doing extra work for free - some kind of sweetener for people who were already doing their bit for the environment (as apparently this is what Re-Turn is all about) by using and paying for their recycle wheelie bin never mind prices going up
Edit: a bit of transparency on how much of our money from deposits is sitting within Re-Turn and concrete plans for this cash wouldn't hurt either.
Plastic container production could have been addressed at source but it seems all responsibility for targets and the environment has been transferred onto the customer / shop staff while the CEO and media tell us how great Re-Turn is. The very least that can happen is make things as convenient as possible for the people actually doing the extra work and paying increased product prices + deposits.
What I'm suggesting is a kind of collar or bracket that holds cans/bottles attached to bins.
I had a link to them in other countries but I can't find it now.
I'll try again later.
Could be but the supply of non-Return cans will run out in time.
Except maybe in border areas and Tipp is a bit far south.
If you make the openings for public bins so small that people can't fit a coke can in what else can fit in?
We have also agreed that the system has problems that needs to be addressed.
I've mentioned a couple of things in another post.
Maybe looking for non-Return cans they can re-label, but usually the ones going in there are a bit battered.
I wonder what's their game cutting into the can banks ?
Unlikely householders would go to the trouble of going there to get rid of cans when they could go to the RVM and get the deposit back.
Interesting to know how many the cutters got.
There are clearly issues with the scheme and especially the amount of down time that there seems to be with certain machines that seem to have been cheaply produced.
However since the scheme has started the only deposits that I have yet to get back were a couple of beers that I had in town before a gig (went in the yellow 'can only' bin on Grafton St) and some that I have left at a relatives house who claimed the deposit themselves.
I find the SuperValu machines to be best and usually get a cash return as despite their name there always seems to be little Valu in their stores.
I've outlined several suggestions over the course of the thread and provided links.
Things like bulk machines for people with a lot of returns, collars for public bins so cans don't end up in them, shops having to make the RVM available whenever the shop is open.
I'm sure we could make a comprehensive list if we went about it.
Whats the point of the concept being simple but the practicalities of it being anything but?
Its the practicalities what will make or break a scheme such as this.
@Genghis To add to your list - I've also seen labels ripped off bottles on supermarket shelves, I expect to be used on bottles that aren't in the scheme.
I heard about this, apparently the contents of some public bins are being pulled out and thrown on the street by some people searching for cans and bottles. If true, the relevant minister should be out there on his hands and knees picking it up. It's his baby.
Two stories from this week illustrate how the noble efforts some people go to to re-turn every bottle.
What do you think needs changed to address the problems with Re-Turn?
See previous post. 6 euro 4 pack of coke now costing 6.60, as an example.
The overall price for the product has increased by the value of the deposit.
A 4 pack of coke cans that used to cost 6 euro will now cost 6.60.
The overall price for products has increased by the value of the deposit.
Nothing strange about it.
I already clarified that I was referring to the concept.
And a couple of posts back you said "but yes, the concept is simple".
This weekend I saw my first 150ml can with the deposit return specs on it, the amount of aluminium compared to a 500ml can is gas.
Was it a 1.75 litre bottle. Did he throw off one of them and fire it on the ground. No.
Only a smaller bottle. Which makes this scheme reductive.
What makes you say that it is 'going pretty well'?
