Sarcasm, the lowest form of wit, doesn’t really work on message boards.
No way? Really? Are you serious? 🙄
Should the county board not look at the Meath league structure of 10 divisions, Relegation and promotion in all and clubs find their level while keeping their senior club status. Also allows proper football for reserve teams from the larger clubs. Teams like Carnaross, Moynalty, Cortown are in division 5 in Meath, The likes of Maghera & Corlough could be the same. Also has more teams winning cups creating more of a buzz in area's. There are teams in Cavan that haven't won a cup of any sort in decades.
Laragh is already an amalgamation. They saw the light 50 years ago.
Them and Lavey would probably be a fiery amalgamation.
I see Cian Bannon scored 1-4 last week for Gowna last weekend against Kingscourt. He was in Australia for the last 5 or 6 years. Another good option in the forwards.
Is there anything to be said for another amalgamation????
There seems to be a lot of players from Laragh gone to Australia. They'll likely be in the relegation mix in the Senior championship m
More often than not the team that you amalgamate with at underage is often your biggest derby at senior level so the idea of amalgamation at senior level and losing their own club identity is unthinkable at many clubs and this problem is the same in every county from malin to mizen
It's not a simple solution or a one size fits all....
That’s been raised here before but from U14 to minor, they know nothing but playing together. They’ve 65 players between them according to a poster above, those numbers don’t add up for amalgamating at underage for me if they’re correct. Both Drung and Kill play separately up to U12 and then suddenly amalgamate - where are the numbers going? It’s not to get into a higher Division as they are normally in Divisions like 3 and 5.
The only way that is right is if one team is very small and wouldnt survive on their own. Otherwise in my opinion it is wrong and often such an amalgamation will end up working well for one team at senior level and not the other.
Us offering solutions anonymously on boards.ie doesn't strike me as something that is very ballsy to be honest, but sure there you go.
For what it is worth, I think two practical suggestions would be (a) a programme for coach development to invest in coaching structures and ensuring that coaches in each club (and at all levels) are up to a certain standard. Not sure whether that is the case at home, but as part of the Cavan diaspora that is the case where I am. Different numbers and resources, but that is something that could be developed.
Personally, I think that the competitions at adult level could be restructured. 40 teams, 4 divisions in league, and assuming all are fielding teams, 4 competitions come championship (senior, intermediate, junior and junior B) with 10 teams in each. Personally in senior there's a few teams hovering at the bottom that could give intermediate a rattle but aren't doing much other than avoid relegation in senior. That's even more the case for about 6/7 intermediate teams. A reshuffle like that would make things closer and more competitive which is what most clubs, players and supporters would want.
have you ever seen Kill play Drung at senior level? Drop down the next time they draw each other in the junior championship and get them on the field at half time to discuss one of them folding up their tent (or both) and amalgamating 😀
I'm not ignoring Peter Quinns report, how many years was it ago now? It was the biggest waste of money ever spent where do you think it is now, on a shelf in Breffni Park or put through a shredder is my guess.
I will use Drung and Kill as an example and i explained this to you before. They need to amalgamate most years at underage and have a agreement in place going back decades. In a given age group Drung may have 11 players (not enough to field on there own and Kill might have 20 (enough to field on there own but due to the agreement they don't let the other team down). Lately they enter two teams where they can to ensure as many lads as possible get games which is a good thing.
Now if you step up to Senior teams Kill have a currently panel of approximately 35 and Drung have 30 or so. If you were to amalgamate there would be 65 players which would lead to a lot of lads getting very little action and likely quitting.
All a club needs is 3-4 players coming into the Senior panel every year to keep things going. It will likely come to a head at some stage but it's working well for both clubs currently.
The likes of St Finbarrs (Kill/Drung) amalgamate and then enter two teams into that. I’ve never understood that to be honest. If they’ve enough for two teams, they should have enough for each club to at least enter an 11 a side team.
But sure do you not think clubs slowly withering away is losing players and people involved anyway? Maghera are already haemorrhaging players to local rivals and have been for years.
I’ve no issue with amalgamations. I just think where they are consistently needed a club need to make a decision. Just amalgamate all together, at senior and underage.
You are misinterpreting my posts if you feel I’ve an issue with them. You’ve also totally ignored all points about Peter Quinn’s report. The fact is there was an extensive study on this and we’ve too many clubs it found.
I’m not blaming the clubs either. Some of them may have some fault but at the end of the day it’s very difficult to combat changing society.
I know of clubs who might amalgamate underage,just to play underage at Division 1. They would have enough for a team in Division 3 or 4. It probably helps the club team at Adult level that some of the players are playing at a high level underage ,but players are missing out on football then and giving up by 18.
I am not a big fan of underage amalgamations either. They have a place no doubt. For me it comes down to this. If you look at the national schools in your catchment area and you are seeing 10 boys starting each year then you probably need to look for an amalgamation. If you look at your school and see 30 kids yet you are only getting 10 out to train and you decide that you need to amalgamate I think the problem is your club and amalgamation is a quick fix and a wrong thing to do.
It's up to each club to decide as I've said for the 3rd time now. They know their numbers and if they want to do a Maghera or Corlough so be it that's on them nobody else can decide that for them. If more go that way it will keep you happy anyway.
What's your problem with amalgamations isn't it giving kids games which is what the GAA is about.
I cant understand how you are so against it at juvenile level but want clubs to do it at Senior. Did a team you were coaching get beat in a final by a amalgamated team?
So the heads remain in the sand we wait for them to slowly wither away like Maghera & Corlough are doing?
I’m very glad you aren’t running the GAA and that they are actually looking at demographics and starting to make plans for the future as society develops.
The clubs you’ve listed might do it at one age level or the odd time but they aren’t doing it consistently. St Finbarrs, Blackwater & Dernacrieve are now consistent amalgamations at all levels from when competitive football starts.
There is no need for me to post an alternative I'm not looking for clubs to pull the shutters down.
I have no problem with clubs joining at underage. Clubs like Lacken, Ballinagh, Shercock. Gowna, Drumalee, Denn do it regular enough. Would you treat them the same or is it only Junior clubs you have it in for?
Peter Quinn was a paid to do it my point is if the likes of you or any other club delegate* starting saying it you wouldn't be going far before you would be challenged.
They are a different breed in Gowna majority of the current players are offspring off one off the best club teams ever in Cavan. The tradition and football is in them.
If lads don't have the footballing ability any amount off coaching won't change that you can bring them so far but they will never be elite.
You mentioned Cootehill one off the biggest populations in the County and can't field a reserve team while two smaller clubs out the road are fielding reserve teams without the need to use 1st team players.
I'd be near sure Killeshandra have had players on County team since 97.
You seemed to think it’d be quite outlandish to recommend to the county board to cut clubs but Peter Quinn did just that in a paid report. You said you’d love to see someone arrive into a county board and say it but Peter Quinn actually put it in a report they paid him for. So is Peter Quinn, former president of the GAA, another man like me who doesn’t understand the importance of the local club in the community?
Struggling for numbers - any that need to regularly amalgamate at underage level - Redhills, Drung, Kill, Maghera, Munterconnaught, Corlough, Killeshandra Shannon Gaels, Swad & Kildallan are ones I can quickly think of.
To compete - Maghera & Corlough for a start. Killeshandra & Kildallan also both struggling, Killeshandra now another club amalgamating a lot. I’d also expect Redhills and others will join this group in the next few years.
Again, did you want to offer any alternatives or solutions or just pick holes and offer nothing new to what is becoming an obvious problem?
Donegal has 39 Clubs with a population of over 160k. There is lots of soccer Clubs in Donegal, but Cavan shouldn't have more Clubs then a County that size. https://donegalnews.com/donegal-gaa-club-rankings/
How many clubs packed it in after that.
What other Junior clubs are struggling?
Every player on the cavan panel is an elite player in my definition. I totally disagree with your 2nd comment, the kids in Gowna aren't drinking different juices than in Cootehill. Elite players are made through coaching with a drop of natural strength and athleticism. Killeshandra not having a starting county man since 1997 is completely of their own doing, not meant to be insulting to them but they need to stop this waiting for some natural phenomenon to come along that they don't need to do anything with.
Any chance you could address any of the points I’ve raised rather than just totally attempting to twist the point in hand? You’re not adding anything at all to the discussion.
What’s your own solution to address changing demographics? What should clubs struggling to field numbers do?
Peter Quinn and a committee did a comprehensive report stating we had too many clubs. What parts of his study did you disagree with?
I openly said at the start of this I didn’t claim to have all the solutions but I’ve no problem putting my head on the chopping block - just a pity others haven’t the liathroidi to do the same.
It’s like a subordinate staff member in a workplace being negative. Don’t come with nothing but problems, try providing a few solutions.
Not every club can have elite players and coaches can only work with what they have.
Do you think there are elite players on the Cavan team? How many off the Cavan squad from the last 3 games would get on a Dublin or Kerry team?
Did Peter Quinn not do just that several years back in his report?
No I just don't believe that Gowna are at an advantage because of Dermot McCabe - unless someone can provide some evidence to the contrary . I also believe clubs like the two above are not doing enough clearly to develop players as the data shows are very poor output of elite players. I also congratulate Crosserlough as well as Gowna for doing a good job. The best club in Sligo where I now reside is Tourlestrane, a very small place. Size isn't everything.
What junior clubs are struggling apart from Corlough and Maghera?
Swad must have turned McKiernan away this year as they didnt accept the transfer.
How many lads move to a different part of the County and still play with there home club, very few and it's more lads who are coming near the ends off there playing days than anyone in there 20's.
I wouldn't know how many Gaels lads have kids with other clubs.
As I said before Clubs will decide what to do when numbers are against them and not before.
I'd love to see you land into a county board meeting and make that statement about to many clubs and we need to reduce the amount off them
