The union must see the opportunity present from the success of the u20's. There's a lot of talent there. Why bring in NIQ,s? Or they're pushing the provinces to produce players. There's not much need for many NIQ players anymore.
Why would a province bring in a NIQ if they can have a same Irish player of similar standard? they have no risk then of players not settling, family not settling etc. Getting them to buy a house, if young are they earning enough to get a house
From a business point of view it makes more sense to have Irish players.
The NIQ was always supposed to be star players that could add to the environment, pass on knowledge etc. It got slightly watered down mostly because the bigger name players get offered a lot more in France/England. But still they should be players who are adding value
If you are getting the same quality player from an Irish player, why would you bring in an NIQ? doesn't make sense to me, even if the IRFU are not blocking
That's an easy one. Coaches have to win. Signing an experienced NIQ makes life easier for them. They're ready and able to implement your gameplan, without having to go through any of the ups and downs of developing as they play.
If you didn't have the IRFU saying 'no' you'd likely see a fair few more NIQs at each province.
How will signing a experienced NIQ make it easier for all the reason I outlined above? Plenty of NIQ have come to Ireland and haven't been a success. Plus they are more likely to leave ASAP as soon as the investment is done and they are better players.
As I said the NIQ system is put in place to sign quality not quantity.
You also said of the same quality, now you are saying the NIQ is better, so changing the goal posts a bit
Keenan to miss Ireland's Summer tour with Olympic 7s.
https://x.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1793272612967088528?t=UJ1_-HFqe-bDhB4ymH81fw&s=19
Also missing the URC playoffs - which is f****ing stupid.
How is he eligible for this, I thought there was a requirement for the players to play a certain amount of qualifying events?
Just as well we've explored other options at fullback and have plenty of depth there. Oh wait...
No I didn't say that actually. I said you could get pretty good quality New Zealanders or South Africans for the same as you'd pay the Irish players. Same money, not same quality. Purely based on the size of the player pool abroad it's likely you could pick up an NIQ who was at least slightly better, or more ready for the pro game anyway, than the homegrown player if you were inclined to go out looking for NIQs, which would be much more the mindset if the IRFU didn't place restrictions.
Summertime is the time for exploring these other options tbf.
Don't have a problem with JOB deputising for Keenan really. Won't be as good, but he shares a lot of the latter's characteristics as a player.
But the NIQ system was never for a player who is "at least slightly better"
It was for players like Synman/Barrett/Nankivell etc. Real quality players, that has got diluted over the years but that was the plan.
The restrictions are in place for good reason, one I agree with them.
The number of NIQ hasn't been reduced or isn't been forced to be reduced. The restrictions should and hopefully will stay in place so we don't get "slightly better" players and get real stars that can add to the provinces and the young players in the squad
I welcome it. He obviously wants to be an Olympian, which is something very special.
It's a big opportunity for Jimmy O'Brien in the URC playoffs. 11. Lowe, 14. Larmour, 15. JOB is a quality back three.
Zebo and O'Brien to me are the obvious fullback picks for the South Africa Tests, although they're probably more likely to back Frawley instead of bringing Zebo in.
Whatever about JOB, I'd way prefer Haley at FB over Frawley.
There is zero chance of it being Zebo with him having announced his impending retirement this week.
Some of my reaction to this is probably coloured by the fact I'm generally not a fan of 7s (despite recognising the obvious benefits it's brought in player development over the years).
I completely get why it's a cool thing for Hugo, but to miss the URC playoffs is a significant deal for Leinster. Missing the SA tour also significantly weakens Ireland.
I get the argument that Ireland needs to develop alternatives at 15, but that isn't an applicable argument for Leinster in the playoffs.
The final point - I think it's kind of fundamentally unfair to the 7s players who slog away throughout the seasons, and actually help to qualify the team for the tournament (for pretty lousy money tbh) that one of them will now miss out.
Larmour played 15 v Scotland, so I would expect him/JOB/Frawley depending on make up of squad
With the Options now available for the Summer Tour
I think the best FBs in the country are
Keenan - not available
Haley
JOB
anyone
Frawley
Larmour got in because of a late withdrawl tho, right?
Not shocked that your view is the best option is of course the Munster player.
Haley mightn't even be the best full back in Munster right now.
Mod: Post warned.
There's about as much chance I'll play FB on the SA tour as Haley will.
agreed.
This could open the door to Haley touring, probably will actually.
Not sure what the issue with Frawley is, he had a brilliant game against La Rochelle in the QF and has been playing at 15 all season.
We've capped four different players at 15 in the last twelve months.
And we've literally just given our first choice guy the summer off.
Which restrictions are you saying are in place if you think the number allowed hasn't reduced? You're saying the IRFU says 'no' if the NIQ isn't of a high enough standard, is it?
You really think Leinster would be allowed to sign 6 NIQs (or 5 maybe, since project players aren't really a thing anymore) like they had in 2011 if they had the money to attract foreign signings good enough to make their strongest XXIII?
Why on earth would they bring in a retiring player, that hasn't played for Ireland in 7 years, for a summer tour?
Hopefully will see Haley and O'Brien both get an opportunity in SA.
I never said 5 or 6, I said 3. 2011 is 13 years ago. Time to get past it now don't you think?
You claimed the numbers are been reduced, as far as I can see they are not.
If you think the answer is NIQ, good for you, I don't. I think 3 NIQ's of high quality if perfect to compliment the players the provinces produce themselves.
At this stage you are going in circles, I explained my point,
He's not being serious.
Anyway, what a fantastic opportunity for Keenan. A shot at an Olympic medal, amazing.
To give yourself the best shot at winning. Zebo would be ahead of Haley in my eyes. He also has a lot more international pedigree than Haley (35 caps compared to Haley's 1 game for Ireland and 1 game for England), so he'd be more likely to feel at home and hit the ground running.
They haven't shown much interest in Haley, so isn't he just as likely to be a stopgap while Keenan's unavailable?
Haley, Zebo, Shane Daly, Larmour, Frawley, JOB, Stewart Moore, Lowry, McIlroy, Lowe and Stockdale could conceivably be considered. I don't see them actually taking Zebo. It's just what I think I would do.
Emmm, I'm not sure what to make of this. I said the total has been reduced slowly over quite a long time. So of course you'd have to go back in time to see when the number allowed was higher. It certainly hasn't been three forever.
I'm not advocating signing NIQs. I'm just making observations about the reality. I'd actually quite like to see a Leinster squad of fully Leinster-developed players. I think that should be a bit of a goal.
Whether the number allowed becomes a hard 2 and then is reduced even further over the coming decade is, like I said, anyone's guess. It's perfectly possible it bottoms out at 2 or 3.
I'm a huge fan of Zebo but this is a summer tour at the end of a season in which Zebo retires, there's zero point in playing him.
IMHO, the summer tour should be about trying new players, different combos etc and developing existing players that wouldn't have huge amount of international caps.
I'd play Haley now, I advocated it before but unfortunately for him he was injured or just back from injury when Keenan was last unavailable. He's still the best option to replace Keenan just not the best option to bench for him.
I would assume Haley and JOB both travel and the jersey is up for grabs.
I hope it's not Frawley but plenty of smarter coaches than me seem to consider him a live option there.
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