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Applying for internal vacancies while on long term sickness

LimerickGray

ive retired recently but I was out sick for quite a few years prior.
during that time there were lots of internal vacancies that I was qualified to apply for.
if I had applied for these vacancies I’m sure they couldn’t have not hired in the basis of not being available due to illness. Wouldn’t that be discrimination I would take up the position when I notionally returned.

It would have increased my final salary and pension contributions

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LimerickGray

I did let them know I was thinking about returning to work but I then got a far more serious illness. I was made redundant. I’m not sure how to explain in your terms why, but I was.

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122142303#Comment_122142303

no my story is real sadly.

Avatar in the Post

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122141523#Comment_122141523

IF he was able to come back and the company said, two people are now doing your role, that’s textbook redundancy. But, story seems to get added to/changed as time goes by.

Avatar in the Post

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122141724#Comment_122141724

story changes. It might actually be true, but you’d hardly be surprised if he said. “Gotcha!”

🙃

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122142075#Comment_122142075

you are most kind.
the point of this board was to invite conversation about whether it is possible to apply/gain positions internally when in long term sick leave.
how I finished working isn’t relevant to that- other than I’m not there now.

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122142029#Comment_122142029

Why wouldn't I ask? It doesn't matter your situation there's a huge difference between retiring & being made redundant. Your actual personal circumstances don't change that.

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122141724#Comment_122141724

I wish you could see or hear me. You wouldn’t ask.

Thank you for helping

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122141700#Comment_122141700

Hold on - you said you retired? Which is it? Because even with voluntary redundancies, there's a process involved that the employer has to follow. And you would have received a package of statutory redundancy pay that I find it hard to believe you forgot about until you looked at the paperwork now.

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122141523#Comment_122141523

perhaps you are right but I’m looking at the paperwork here now. I was made voluntary redundant for the reason I gave.

thanks

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122140866#Comment_122140866

No the role didn't cease to exist. Other people were covering. There is a massive difference. I covered my colleagues role while she was on maternity leave - her role was not at risk of redundancy.

The rules for making a role redundant are incredibly strict & there's a whole process around it too that would be quite cumbersome to apparently just get rid of 1 person. Especially if the work still needed to be done. Much easier to let that person go & then be able to hire into the role.

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122140999#Comment_122140999

it’s ok. I have too much time on my hands since I became ill and spend too much time reading this board and procrastinating.
Sorry for wasting your time.

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https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122140866#Comment_122140866

Exactly, and while other people taking on another person's role is a redundancy situation, it hardly applies in your position as

They were covering your illness.
You never let them know you were considering coming back to work

Tell me again, what's the purpose of the thread? Do you think the company has in any way done something wrong?

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122140168#Comment_122140168

that’s not quite true. The reason for redundancy was that the work I was contracted for was being carried out by others.
this happens a lot if someone is out a long time I suppose.

thanks for all the help here.

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122138621#Comment_122138621

Ok you can't make a person redundant, you can only make a role redundant. And that would take a while and they would not be able to hire anyone into that role again because the role is what is made redundant. You would have possibly been let go if unable to perform your duties. And they can't predetermine that before you go back because there is a whole back to work process when someone has been off on long term medical leave. But as a private business they don't owe you a promotion while you're off and can decide that if you are unable to fulfill the role that you can be let go. You wouldn't have gotten a redundancy package.

AnnieinDundrum

I can see how someone can be medically unfit for their job, and there’s another one that will work for them. Eg maybe the current one involves standing and the new one doesn’t. And a caring employer with an interest in employee welfare, and perhaps a desire to retain experienced staff, might look at moving them.

but that’s at a point in time and is more likely to come from an individual member of staff with this motivation rather than a company policy in my experience.

if you are absent and out of sight for a period you get forgotten simple as that. And if you want to return to work you have to manage it yourself and bang on doors and keep visible. Let people know that you are keen to return, they’d be accused of harassment if they chased you to show up for interviews etc.

Immaculata

I'm sorry you were ill or otherwise medically unable to work but without wishing to be uncharitable, one could wonder how one could expect you to be simultaneously too unwell to work but well enough to do an interview?

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You didn’t apply when you could, so pointless speculating. If it’s any consolation it may not have been as clear cut as you consider.

Basically, WHY didn’t you apply if you felt up to it?

AnnieinDundrum

some older pension schemes included income protection for long term sickness.

Finding a new role, one more suited to your abilities now would have been a nice thing to do, maybe a recruiter can help. Employers aren’t obliged to do that but some do.

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122138790#Comment_122138790

no. The illness that I was on long term sick leave, was not the same illness I had to retire. Different scenarios sadly.
I would have gone back to do the job but I could speak coherently or “normally”and that was a requirement for the role. I would have applied for roles that didn’t require speaking and were not as taxing. It wasn’t just about money.
i might have gone on forever on the income protection as I’m getting less income now.

Avatar in the Post

As you say it’s now average and not final and the OP said they were not in the CS.

Avatar in the Post

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122138621#Comment_122138621

Until the person in HR was told to do their job and exit you.

But, if you were guaranteed redundancy why didn’t you take it. Or, was your ICP worth more to you over the years?

You were also of the opinion you were guaranteed promotions if you wanted it.

tohaltuwi

A long time ago in the general public services there might have been actually some truth in OP’s question, which I presume to be a p1$$take in present times. I have known of more than one case of somebody getting promoted in something of these circumstances, to beef up the pension. A very long time ago the Civil Service, people were commonly promoted to a job they simply could not have done, just before retirement, in order to get the increased pension.

LimerickGray

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122138480#Comment_122138480

someone friendly in the HR department told me off the record that if I was ever to attempt to return to work, then they would make me redundant for inability to perform duties. Regardless

Thanks all

Avatar in the Post

Reading further, companies have a defence of ‘dignity in the work place’. This can be used as a defence for not putting someone with a disability/brain damage, out sick for years on sick leave through an arduous interview process.

Also, BEFORE they could allow you back to a work setting their insurance company policy would demand you prove you can come back to work. THAT would have meant you losing out on your income Protection money… and you still might not have got a job. Since you were out on long term Income Protection the company had no obligation to hold your job.

TL/DR they did you a favour

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You’re not in the Public Sector?

Okay, this is simple. No, you definitely would not be entitled to promotion while out long term sick. In fact they could have legally managed you out.

Instead, they were decent and had Income Protection so that you would be taken care of for the rest of your life. Employers don’t need to provide social services, but you’re not alone. I’ve come across more employees than I care to think about that are institutionalised into thinking a company is there to take care of them.

Avatar in the Post

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122136114#Comment_122136114

check out your OP. Try and keep your story consistent next time.

AnnieinDundrum

actually did the OP ever apply?

Were the jobs advertised outside the organisation? Or if it was internal did they check their emails?

im not sure how the practicalities would work. We aren’t allowed attend the office if we are on a sick cert. So how could you even attend an interview? I guess it could be offsite.

magicbastarder

as per the above, i assume it would raise the question of 'what makes you medically fit for this job, when you were medically unfit for the last?'

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122136142#Comment_122136142

The problem is you would have had to show you were medically able to return to work in the new role in order to get those increases. They won't just give them to you because you're qualified enough. You would have had to attend interviews and also be in a position to take up the job itself. They wouldn't just give you the promotion & then have you off again on medical leave. That would leave them back where they started without someone to do the role they were hiring for.

Put yourself in the hiring managers position. 2 candidates. Both similar qualifications. 1 maybe has more experience but they're currently on long term medical leave and there's a question mark over their ability to return to work. The other has a little less experience but is available to work. Which would you choose?

Also 3% increment on salary is actually pretty ok. I know people not on medical leave who are getting less in yearly increments.

LimerickGray

i think that might be correct but laws don’t quite see it like that They don’t have to change my position to allow me return and that is why I had to leave

Medically unfit to attend and interview or a department performance review is the tactic