I guess no one's buying petrol cars that don't have 1000km of range so.
My old petrol car hits the red in about 360 around town.
I've tried to explain with similar cost examples including fuel savings but some people will not listen to reason. EVs aren't for everyone but suit a lot of people's needs, wants are a different story.
Shoog was reflecting/imagining 50→30, but new both times, not 2nd hand.
^ it also has 137000 km on it and is wrapped.
The ID.3 Family spec was €37,514 new in 2011. The car has covered 137,000km (34,000km/year) which is quite high for a 3-year-old car and has lost 54% based on it's advertised price. I'm not that surprised to see a high mileage car depreciate that much over a 3-year cycle. It's done about 6 years of average mileage.
It only has 23,000km left on it's battery warranty.
Take this for example
https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/volkswagen-id-3-pro-150-kw-family-58kwh-5dr-auto/36600923
This was probably close to 40k when new and is on sale from a Dealer for €17,500
I'd reckon the owner got about 14k for it from the dealer.
BTW this EV still has its warranty
No specific car, but the proportions are reflective of what happened.
What car is this? I know of 75 to 55 drops, but not 50 to 30.
I think the main grievance people have is seeing the car that they paid €50k for two years ago been sold for €30k new now. Its hard not to feel ripped off when that happens.
Such is the lot of the early adopters. I remember when the first CD players came out and we're been sold for a thousand - only to find better machines selling for €200 a few years later.
Let's look at 3 examples, according to AIG the top selling cars in Ireland in 2023 were
EV equivalents
So the next time the significant portion of people you know make that claim simply point the above, could save them a few quid on their next car.
And that's before we talk about second hand deals
I don't think it's all jealousy that is motivating it. I think it's more related to a fear that an "inferior" experience will be forced upon them. Yes, I know "inferior" is a loaded and triggering word around here.
It's worth remembering that while the leaf was an innovative vehicle for its time, the terrible battery has left a damaging legacy. The people that are not into cars hear about used leafs that have degraded to less than 100mi of range. You also have the disappointed owners of newer cars that have real world ranges that are significantly lower than wltp. Three four years ago you had another wave of early adopters, less informed than what came before and now that disappointment is getting an airing.
Lastly, the media see the "culture war" around EVs as being relatively harmless. It's certainly not as controversial as taking a stand on gender or migration but delivers lots of engagement and clicks. The Irish media are happy to feed people's biases in this context.
I think you won't see a turn until the next generation of battery tech starts to arrive in mid market cars and real world ranges of at least 700kms highway. That's probably at least 2 years away.
In fairness that's got nothing to with EVs..
yes they do. It's partly attributed to jealousy. Obviously my acedotal observation isn't applicable to all Anti-EV, but certainly those I know.
Do they have a vendetta against ICE cars that can't afford.
I don't have a vendetta against Ferrari's because they are expensive and impractical for me.
A significant portion of people I know personally who have a vendetta against EVs simply can't afford an EV. The remainder are waiting for charging infrastructure to improve(on street parking, destination chargers).
THIS.......
What you have to bear in mind is that many diesel drivers think diesel is the only thing that works.
They would feel lost if given a 1.5 TSI, a PHEV or a Toyota style hybrid. Asking them to drive an EV is almost like asking them to hand their licence to drive back.
If they are getting the vibes diesel is on the way out.
It's totally unsurprising that lots of them are trying to get into a 241.
Which they can then drive indefinitely (they think).
I'm sure all those who come in here taking about EV battery degradation and range, will equally be all over the EU commision report that the WPTP test looks to have been out by 20% on petrol and diesel consumption, also on CO2 and other emmisions being much higher than claimed by Manufacturers
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/motors/2024/0415/1443651-fuel-consumption-of-new-cars-may-be-higher-than-claimed/
In a change to the usual. Pat Kenny read out a text on his radio show a few mins ago. Somebody was at a garage with his "reliable" petrol car and the mechanic had a Mercedes EV in that needed a new €20k battery
In fairness to Pat he completely rubbished the text with the facts and questioned who is spreading the misinformation so much. Alluding possibly to the oil industry being the culprit
64k for a diseasel shitbox, the world has gone mad.
We had an Astra that didn't. Last car we had that didn't..
Just because yours was ok doesn't mean they are all ok.
We've had diesels l that had no problem and others that just had no end of problems with it. Russian roulette with them. Hence why theres so many "questionable" modifications with them.
https://www.irishtimes.com/advertising-feature/a-car-with-a-dpf-filter-removed-cannot-legally-drive-on-public-roads-in-ireland-1.4119079
Are you sure your Jeep has a DPF?
They only became mandatory around 2009/2010 so depending when your car was built it may not actually have one.
My 2009 Octavia didn't have one but the newer engine released a few months later did.
Their design life is 150k miles before they become blocked with ash. The regen cycle shortens thereafter causing a significant increase in running cost and potentially damage to turbos. Its a very common issue and the only solution is to replace the DPF.
I talk to my mechanic and he says he sees it in lots of cars over 10years old and most of the time it's not econical to put them right. He says he wouldn't recommend a diesel to anyone who doesn't do most of their driving on motorways.
What is a particulates system. Do you mean DPF. Its a bit more than 150k. I have a jeep and it's nearly at 190k miles or about 300k kilometres and no issue with the DPF, and I consider mine low milage it's a 2010 jeep. Who is putting up misinformation on social media now
The total on the invoice it was 62k
I see on Kia website now it starts at 64k. With the difference I pay for fuel few good years.
I haven't sat in a Sorento I don't know how better is compared to a model Y. it seems it is longer with 6 cm but Y has a 7cm longer wheelbase so I imagine they are both around the same size. I just skimmed some reviews and they say Sorento is a 7 seater or at least a 5+2 version? All in all is 50% more expensive than the model Y.
I think he was saying the VRT was 16k+. There's the rest of the car to pay for too.
20k cheaper than 16k+ Vat?
Diesels have a useful life of 150k before they need a major overhaul of the particulates system. This often costs more than the value of the car. Anyone who has been through this will generally say never again on diesels.
Yeah was discussing Model Y in work yesterday with someone who just bought one and a 3rd person beside us was amazed at how cheap they were. Assumed they were 80-100k new. Has been a very common thing over the last 4yrs for me. Also noticed a lot of people have no idea how (expensive) much new ice cars cost
anecdotal story
Some guys at work were debating how is possible to pay 16k+ VRT for a diesel KIA. They had the invoice on the screen and were saying it must be wrong, the dealer did a mistake. Other one said "With some 10k more" you could have driven a Tesla like this guy (me). I intervened ad said actually my car was 20k cheaper. They didn't believe me so I had to get a linky out. Sometimes people do very little research outside social media, and trust untrustworthy sources for the info they get.
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