Old thread seems to be permanently locked. It will be interesting if anything can come of this at last.
Threadbanned Posters:
They’ve been talked to death - I’m not going there again - my only focus now is the outputs of the current Garda investigation - that’s all that matters at this stage
It may well be different in this case given the amount of public interest. However normally a file is only submitted to the DPP when a charging decision is required. In a case of this magnitude the charging decision is taken out of the hands of the police.
So what are these other possibilities and probabilities that you talk of ?
Put them out here and we can all talk about them.
Now you’re assuming I’m basing my information and opinion on what I read here - the second time you’ve misinterpreted my post and why I’m completely bored stiff with such nonsense posts as this - have a different opinion to me fine, but don’t put words in my mouth thanks .
You said that it's clear that there are other possibilities or probabilities.
I replied that there were none and most of what you read here is misinformation, I used Shirley as an example.
I could be wrong but I thought the general consensus (mainstream media mostly) is that a file will be submitted, even though Bailey is now deceased -I stand corrected but I thought quite possibly even the Gardai have stated they’ll be submitting a file ? How else can they justify or bring to any sort of conclusion the massive effort they’ve given this case over the last couple of years? It can’t just end here and Peter out?
I never mentioned Shirley - in fact I never mentioned anyone nor do I intend to as I’m sick of all this going around in circles- there are people out there both dead and alive that have the possibility at least of being a person of interest, but with all the assumption of innocence intact
A file would normally only be submitted to the DPP for a charging decision. This is/was the case with Bailey and the DPP twice refused to authorise a charge on the grounds of insufficient evidence. With Bailey dead there would be no requirement to submit the file if the current enquiry determines that he is still the only suspect. Only if there is evidence to indicate other, viable, suspects would AGS be required to submit the file for a charging decision.
it’s clear that there are many other possibilities and indeed in some instances, probabilities, than just Bailey.
But there's not.
People making up facts, like Shirley was allowed to drive to the dump with a boot full of evidence, or thinking that they are seeing stuff that was not looked into previously are not other possibilities or probabilities.
A public place and there's more to it than than simply being drunk
It sure is, being drunk in a public place in Ireland can get you a €100 fine or on conviction up to €500.
I've read some nonsense on this thread but it's being taken to new limits now
What are you on about
Being drunk isn't an offence in itself
You can only legally be deemed drunk in Ireland by a doctor, a Garda can arrest you or fine you on 'suspicion of being drunk' but legally they can't accuse you of being drunk without a doctor confirming that you are actually drunk. Generally it averages between the numbers I gave above for both male/female.
Everyone has different tolerances but they need a cut off point for you to be legally accused of something, same with drink driving, I could hop in my car after 5 pints and be all over the road but you could jump in and be perfectly capable of driving, thats why there are limits.
Correct
It's an assumption that the case file is likely focussed entirely on bailey based on what i'm reading and this info is highly likely sourced from gardai
No more than that
If you're basing your assumption of Bailey's guilt in what you read in the media then you're simply reading what AGS spoonfed the media (and the media happily lapped it up!). There was next to no journalism involved - certainly not investagive journalism! I'd also point you towards that Phoenix mag critical analysis of the cosy relationship between AGS and rhe media in relation to this case
Neve heard a definition for legally drunk is 3-5 pints
Tolerances would vary in terms of drunkenness
It's just like all situations in criminal cases, they always try to figure out the demeanour, mental status etc etc of a person, it's all about building a file and a profile for the suspect.
Being legally drunk in Ireland is typically around 4 or 5 pints for a man and 3 or 4 pints for a woman, don't know about others but after 5 pints i'm still aware of my surroundings and dangers etc etc.
I'm going mostly by media reports
Someone will be along to quickly shoot that down of course - but I have to make a judgement call based on what I'm reading
As far as what's "new" in the file I don't think any of that's in the public domain?
Someone was stating as "fact"( which is used loosely by a number of posters here) that the post-death searches yielded nothing
I'm not aware that this is a "fact"
Given the previous criticism the DPP provided of the files submitted, it’s very hard for me to foresee a similar file being submitted again - what has changed in terms of evidence? What new evidence or testimony is there?
The Gardai of 2024 are no fools- but I don’t see how they could submit a file yet again that only focuses on Bailey - it just doesn’t make any sense to me.
do they want ridicule for a 3rd time? I know those investigating now weren’t part of the original investigation but surely they can see that there are at least unanswered questions around certain individuals that could have moved the investigation in a different direction had they access to such people .
The avenues that were not fully or even partially explored at the time that unfortunately have now closed, mainly due to the death of those people, are as suspect as Bailey is- yes Bailey has evidence against him because Gardai pursued him, and gathered such evidence via statements from people- but what’s to say they couldn’t have also achieved similar had they pursued a number of other people?
A bonfire, a few sarcastic comments, dubious “eyewitness” statements that changed to fit a narrative, scratches that were never properly forensically examined- if they’re submitting all of that again, then sorry, as a tax payer I want a refund please.
I think the focus of the file will be firmly on bailey
I believe he's likely guilty - no more than that
There's so many unknowns in this investigation
Practically every aspect and detail in the case can be argued about
Any guesses as to when the final file will be submitted to the DPP? Would it be 2024 I wonder?
Given the guards alleged prime suspect has now deceased, there’s not a huge amount more they can do- unless their focus has shifted to another party or parties known or unknown.
As divisive as this thread can be (thanks for the mod intervention @[Deleted User] ) it’s clear that there are many other possibilities and indeed in some instances, probabilities, than just Bailey.
While we don’t have access to the current evidence, we have clearly seen from the DPP report, that the evidence previously submitted, was a reflection of a highly disorganised investigation riddled with extremely questionable police practices and very flimsy evidence.
Im expecting this time, a balanced approach- a file that won’t necessarily pin point any one individual- that’s my prediction -
while it may outline what “evidence” there is towards Bailey, it will likely also allude to other potential suspects, known or unknown, alive or dead, but whom the Gardai cannot, for whatever reason, progress an investigation any further.
The case will remain “open” but likely will never again be reviewed to the degree it has been on this occasion.
Anyone else think similar around the DPP file or indeed the opposite?
Then what is the point of mentioning they were probably drunk? What difference is it supposed to make? Catch 22.
I've come home drunk many a nights but always go around switching off lights and tv's etc, just cause you're drunk doesn't mean you've lost your train of thought.
Moving the body in theory would get you more time to get out of the area.
So just some possibilities thrown out:
You didnt need the time to make a getaway.
Hard to move body without getting blood all over you.
Something startled them after the murder, say a passing car and they legged it.
The body was left in the open because the perp had no fear of the Guards / being apprehended.
Since we have learned that Sophie almost never went to the cottage ALONE, and probably the criminal could see her car, I now think they may have gone to the house to check if anyone else was there who might have seen or heard the assault.
Doesn't add much to the story, I know, but still points to the question; how did the attacker know that Sophie was alone? (IF they did...)
In fact, how many people knew that she was unaccompanied on this occasion?
Killer probably intoxicated and in a panicked state
Fair point. But I wonder why someone would leave the body there rather than just dump it behind some bushes etc?
Seems a bit contradictory ... drunk but has presence of mind to go back to turn off a light?
I think a car was used and it was at night. Lights turned off and blood on door handle means someone went inside to turn them off and also the lack of hiding the body is definitely more relevant to darkness and potentially someone who is maybe drunk.
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