I forgot this is boards…
😆
I forgot it's some alternative reality, seriously what are you basing that on?
More power, mpg, mpge, no serpentine belt and ancillaries in the Toyota, heat pump in the Toyota, ecvt rather than a automatic doing something it was never designed for, and sufficiently bulletproof for New York cabbies!
Nissan has a more interesting drivetrain. Even if it's not that effective.
I would say it makes sense for us (trading up from a 192 Tiguan 87000kms to a new ID4 Life DX for €9500). Its cost positive over 5yrs (€1200/year savings on fuel plus residual values will be a lot higher on a 5yr old ID4 vs a 10yr old Tiguan with double the mileage. Wall charger cost (€600 after grant) offset by lower annual motor tax.
Thats the only reason we are changing!
Can someone do the dealer maths for me on this one? A new Tiguan costs either 42k or 50k. But it looks to me that the dealer will need to sell this 5 year old Tiguan for north of 30k to break even?
How much are you repaying PM currently on the Tiguan?
How much will you be repaying on the ID4 PM?
Seems expensive alright. Looks like 33k was given for the Tiguan. You'd be pushing into the likes of A6 and 5 series for that money at 5 years old next year. Which are much more expensive cars.
It may be a case of kicking the can down the road, massive push on moving ID4s from stock from VW head office so might be a problem the dealer is happy to try solve in 2024.
Cashing in rebates might cover this rather than trying to make money on any given deal.
That poster did well in my opinion
It’s an R-Line Tiguan to be clear (DSG & Leather, one owner). No finance on either, paying cash to trade up.
Dealer have them listed 38-40k although one dealer dropped his R-line to 33.6k. Unless VW giving them good margin on the ID4, I don’t see much on it for them. Probably 3k. We paid €44k for the Tiguan in 2019.
I bought a brand new EV 7 years ago and scrapped my worthless petrol banger. The total cost of ownership of the brand new EV was far lower than the zero depreciation banger. And my mileage is only a touch above average, so it wasn't just fuel savings although I did spend about €50 per week on petrol. In the EV the first year cost me about €30 in electricity. For the year. Tax also went down from €1500 to €120. Insurance went down. And zero maintenance even though I did all the maintenance on the petrol banger myself. 75% discount on tolls helped a few hundred quid a year too.
It was a nice petrol banger though, a 3l Jag S-type 😁 Everytime I put my foot down cost me €1 in petrol. I like putting my foot down, many times 😁 In the EV it costs a cent. And back 7 years ago it was free. Free unlimited charging for all EVs in Ireland. Seems like a lifetime ago now...
And for the unbelievers, a simplified total cost of ownership calc. €1967 = depreciation of the car over the 3 years I owned it. Bought for €25400 brand new on the road price, sold for €19500 privately
Bit of apples to oranges though?
That 25k car could only drive for 80 mins on the motorway, while the other car was a V8 or something?
Do you still have that robotaxi car that was supposed to be earning you a salary by now nearly 2024, might as well own a horse if you own an ICE I think you said once.
Do you still believe in that FSD/Robotaxi stuff or seen sense?
You have amazing insight into my posting history. For a user who only signed up to boards a few days ago. Although it seems you have misunderstood my postings on EVs over the last 8-9 years or so.
Looks like you have your very own stalker.😀
He's worth stalking, he's a gold mine of information. Even if you disagree with it.
Agree
A bit gullible but in general he has good info/ideas and he's good at reading the market short term, long term he's been wrong more than right though.
Yep appears to be a knowledgeable fella across areas such as solar, ev, crypto and motors from what I read on here and appears to have things nicely set up.
I've heard a lot of things said about me, but gullible is a first 😂 I'm rather the opposite, it's quite hard to extract money from me even at the best of times 😂
Go on, show me some of my long term predictions where I was completely wrong? And while we're at it, would you care to share what previous boards handles you have had? Unlike yourself, I do not hide. I have had the same one for over 22 years.
Short term prediction. They will ignore your post.
Long term prediction. They don’t bring it ok again!
Higher Mods should be able to check through the IP cross checking I would have thought?
Sorry I don't fully understand your proposed equation above so I can't answer that.
My fuel cost is about 200 for the year, we do about 28,000km a year.
The purchase cost of my id3 was 36k.
The range after 3 years(now) is 93%, if it continues on that trajectory (although reading these forums it tends to taper off) after 10 years it might have lost 20-25% range, bringing it down to under 300km
Interesting costings. the only part I disagree with is the zero listed for opportunity cost/funding cost on the EV. There is a higher initial cost, and that has a cost associated. Even if you're lucky enough to buy with savings, the cost associated with tying up 25k of cash in a non appreciating asset(especially as that was an era of near zero yearly inflation) are not zero.
Pity you don't seem to be a CMod anymore (?)
I know back in the day you could have muppetchecked him to see who he really is. I've been here since 2007 (I think) under prior handles, all of which are not banned or anything. It's pretty easy to see who's who anyway, even with his new handle I'm pretty sure I recognise the posting style.
Bought car with savings, money was sitting in the bank, not used. At the time, there were no longer any savings accounts that paid more than a few tens of a percent interest, so negligible. Like you say, there was no inflation to speak of at the time. These days in that situation, the opportunity costs would be negative because of inflation!
Of course had I bought the car on PCP / with a loan, the cost of finance should have been taken into account in total cost of ownership calculation
We were seriously considering an EV last year, most of the driving will be local traffic. We have two cars, one diesel and one petrol. The petrol is the local commute and our old diesel estate has been a fantastic economical workhorse, especially when we were driving back and forth to England a lot.
Both cars are now into the "what the fook is wrong today" zone so we finally considered a swap out and the thing that put us off EVs is that not many really appeal to us. I actually sat into a BYD seagull a few weeks ago and thought perfect local commuter, great tech for the price, but what else will be arriving in the coming years?
In the end we're swapping out the 2ltr petrol for a one ltr petrol for all the local commuting, but when it comes to swapping out the diesel it will be for an EV. But we don't want to simply get the latest thing, we want something we'd be happy to live with for a decade.
That's a tough ask in any motoring domain, let alone a fast changing one like EVs.
EVs in 2024 and 2034 may be like chalk & cheese potentially.
100%.
Look at a 2014 Leaf compared to a 2024 Atto 3 for example.
Now I do believe you have changed your tune and finally seen sense!
Congrats!
The summary of the original question is yes - it makes sense to move from ordinary car to ev - but it seems only if you have free or almost free availability of electricity and obviously never charge publicly (even though the same people often comment on where is best to charge on long journey's).
People seem to lack the ability to think about anybody's else circumstances on these treads - i.e. those sharing a house who can't force others to get night rate, or those 30% of the population in rented house, or the 10% in apartments or houses without driveways - all of whom charging at home is often impossible.
Bravo for you if you own your own power plant, but wouldn't it be interesting if somebody used the National Energy Price Index to compare costs - i.e. 47 cent per unit and see how the diesel versus ev comparison would work? I'm guessing the ev fuel saving disappears?
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-households-paying-almost-1000-more-for-electricity-than-eu-average/a575360375.html
“even though the same people often comment on where is best to charge on long journey's)”
I don’t use public chargers. Last time I paid for a charge was when I was delivering my i3 to its new owner in 2020 so they had a full charge on collection. I haven’t a penny in credit on my easygo account and still have the €20 minimum on my eCars account just incase. Don’t have an ionity, cirkle k or any other apps.
Ive actually never fast charged my current car, so it could have a faulty ccs and I wouldn’t even know it!
But, I’ll still advise people on the best public chargers or charging rates because I keep up with the industry. It’s nice to advise people that have t don’t those trips before or are nervous on their first “long” trip.
The cost of finance. Not loan repayments 😉 But I've explained that to you many times and as many times you have refused to believe me.
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