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Have we lost our Patriotism?

jimmy5694

Over the years I have been wondering what does it mean to be Irish. I had the privilege to travel to the US and the UK and experienced there patriotic culture.

British and American patriotism; people believing in there country, sovereignty, democracy and constitutional rights and also celebrating whether its to do with the Monarch or Independence.

But, in Ireland I don't see it, when I talk to people about patriotism/loving your country the conversation seems to nearly always go to "Barry's or Lyons", "The IRA", "GAA", "Leprechauns", "Irish are the best drinkers".

I think we have lost our way, what does it mean to be Irish?

if we celebrate our Independence is it seen as right wing extremism?

Our President; it seems like we don't know what his/her function is so what's the point. At one stage people wanted to give up our Presidency because the believed that such a role is a waste of time and money so why have a president. I've heard people say "Anyway our current President is old and he doesn't know what going on so why be involved".

Another example is that people seem to be too busy and it doesn't impact me so why would I bother.

It seems like our patriotism aligns more with the paddy-whackery then it does with characteristics of the UK and US.

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ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121485639#Comment_121485639

Out of price range, alas.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483262#Comment_121483262

This house wasn't around Camberwell with a lad named Alexander de Pfeffel by any chance was it 🤣

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121485552#Comment_121485552

Funny how it's ok for you to do so.

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121484241#Comment_121484241

So patriotism should result in the complete discounting of people who have survived awful circumstances? Luck determines where we were born so I'm inclined to be far prouder of a nation that supports those in need when necessary. But by your logic that is not patriotic...

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483907#Comment_121483907

Jesus Christ ACD, but you don't half make sweeping statements without a semblance of an attempt to back them up at times

happyoutscan

'Thank you for your service' and the likes of this newfound (9/11) false patriotism would make you sick.

Vietnam vets treated like dirt for decades comes to mind.

Most American's notion of freedom is 'the right to work 3 jobs to pay the rent'. I think that was a comment left here many years ago that resonates with me to this day.

One f*cked up country.

Jack Daw

Our politicians lack patriotism today as they genuinely seem far more concerned with getting the approval of foreigners and foreign entities than representing the views of people who actually live in this country.

I don't care anywhere near as much about things that happen outside of Ireland because I don't live outside of Ireland if more of our politicians had that attitude I'd have more respect for them.Unfortunately they don't and a lot of our major politicians all seem to be eyeing up jobs in EU,UN and IMF and so they represent their interests first and foremost and not the people of Ireland.

A lot of leftist politicians in this country genuinely seem to care more about Palestine than they do about Ireland for some bizarre reason.

Of course if you point out that Irish politicians should put the people of Ireland first and foremost you'll get labelled as racist by the media.

We need a more Ireland first approach from our politicians and they need to put the needs of the people of this country (many of whom are immigrants) first and foremost.

buried

Paddy has had enough of "patriotism", it's not acceptable for Paddy to be in that sort of mind frame anymore. No good for Paddy, only leads to trouble. Paddies should forget about the only homeland they have and only be solely concerned about other nations "patriotism". Nations like the Ukraine, Palestine, and whatever other place 8000 f**king miles away it will be next year.

niallpatrick

Real patriots nationalists and republicans should never capitulate, I never have when out numbered by loyalists in work and have the physical scars to prove it including a dent in my head. This BS 'for all of our people and children' I have scars and dents older then most of the fake wanabee 'OG's' running about the estates calling themselves Irish nationalists, patriotic to anyone who tells them what patriotism means as long as they know how to screw over a foreign occupying government.

SF the stickies and IRSP will never make a dent in the British government coffers, but we need the US we need the EU bleat bleat bleat like sheep into a vat of caustic marking dye. Don't forget people that B-road linking two roundabouts together was funded by the EU and they won't let you forget it. It's the same as getting a mortgage for a house and having the mortgage provider put a massive sign outside letting everyone know you couldn't afford your own house and had to take a loan out.

BagofWeed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483944#Comment_121483944

Brussels and Washington DC both controlled by a banking, military and industrial cabal. Our politicians are in the main just figureheads. I wouldn't think there are many countries left in which the buck stops with it's elected politicians. Any country that wishes to really be free would need to be self sufficient in a lot of necessary items. Globalisation can leave countries susceptible to outside factors that greatly diminish their independence.

buried

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482731#Comment_121482731

You should go over to Zelenskyy in the Ukraine and tell him that. You'd have the whole thing solved in two seconds.

yrreg0850

Is there still need for patriotism , After all we have lost our sovereignty and are now ruled by Brussels.

BagofWeed

Corporatism is the new nationalism. A lot of the now over 40's thought the sun shone out of the USA's ass and here we are now, division amongst people, a large and widening political divide too and homelessness despite full employment.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483894#Comment_121483894

Everyone who advocates and defends nationalism and the far right advocates this.

Greyfox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482583#Comment_121482583

And nobody said it would help. Another thing that doesn't help is when people (not you) who question our immigration policy get accused of racism.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483331#Comment_121483331

There was a year I went home and found a neighbour walking around with a grabber and a bin bag picking up rubbish from the sides of the road. My Da used to say that plenty of men will die for Ireland, few will roll up their sleeves and do a day's work for her.

I'm proud and thankful to be Irish as well which I why I despise modern nationalism so much. Their habit of looting, drinking and racism just makes us an embarrassment to the rest of the world.

Floppybits

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483262#Comment_121483262

I agree that they would be the first to look for a way out of doing any service to the country. Always remember when playing GAA a coach telling us never to worry about the lad that is mouthing off because they never do anything, its the quiet ones you have to watch.

The people claiming to be patriots now are nothing but troublemakers who are hiding behind being patriots. IF they were asked to do something for the country you could bet they would run a mile.

I am proud to be Irish and I am proud of the way people treat you when you say you are Irish, which is more friendly than hostile. Yes there will be the stereotypes who think you are a drunk but in the main when people hear that you are Irish it is a more positive reaction and that I am proud of. That doesn't make me a patriot though.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121483146#Comment_121483146

I'd a housemate in my last houseshare who I caught ranting once about children being disrespectful because they weren't going to church. Said individual spent his time drinking, womanising & siring offspring he would then abandon, taking drugs, and never once went to church. Essentially, the people who make the most noise about something tend to be hypocrites.

Modern nationalists always lend their full throated support to anything that makes lives worse for actual people. Think Trump, Brexit, anti-vaxx, climate science denial and whatever other odious drivel they've imported from the UK and the US.

They'd be the first rats off the sinking ship if Ireland got invaded. That or they'd pull a Vidkun Quisling.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482603#Comment_121482603

Were you ever in some pubs down the country here when a band is playing and and the end they play the national anthem. And you have all these locked mongs having a go at people who are talking when the national anthem is on. Its pathetic. If you asked them a question on history they wouldnt have a clue.

Years ago, I lived in a house share with 4 other lads. All fairly typical goings on for a group of lads in their late teens early 20's. We used to socialise together and occasionally went for pints mid-week. One time, we were in a bar where the band ended the night with Amhran na Bhfiann.

Most people stood for is normal except for a couple of lads at the bar, who stayed sitting, but stopped talking and sat in silence while it was being played. One of the lads I lived with saw them and started shouting at them to GTFO if they couldn't stand for the anthem. One of us told him they probably weren't Irish and he took that to mean they were British and so instead of telling them to GTFO of the bar, he told them to GTFO of the country and how they had abused Ireland for centuries.

I'm not sure if they even heard him, but thankfully nothing came of it although those of us near him were annoyed with his behaviour. Several years later, after we had all moved out and moved on, I was still friends with one lad in particular who still knew this guy who had been doing the shouting. He told me that he had gone to Australia, overstayed his visa and ended up getting kicked out and sent back to Ireland. To overcome this, he got a UK passport due to his mothers place of birth being England and so he went off back to Australia.

I think of him when the topic of patriotism comes up and how he went from abusing someone who didn't honour the anthem, to being ok with effectively denouncing his Irish heritage (not exactly but in the context of how he identified at Aus immigration).

Floppybits

I suppose it depends on what a person think patriotism is, for me it is the love of ones country so much that one would be willing to put their life on the line to either free , defend or improve the country.

I often think if Ireland was invaded today and their was a call to arms, something similar to Ukraine, how many would be signing up to defend the country?

Patriotism is not waving a tri-colour around saying Ireland for the Irish and everyone else ou.

Starfire20

patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel

20silkcut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482538#Comment_121482538

First world problems

[Deleted User]

Well when Michael Martin, who went on to lead this country, said We want nothing to do with a backward looking idea such as sovereignty then its hard for people to feel enthusiastic or have pride In where there from.

I lived in Uk & USA & there’s nothing wrong with being proud of who you are & where you come from. The most grounded & nicest people i met were proud patriots and looked after their areas.

whisky_galore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121479525#Comment_121479525

A patriot loves his country, a nationalist hates everyone else's.

Feisar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482757#Comment_121482757

Fair point.

Varik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482737#Comment_121482737

Except those aren't the same thing as yours involves him being asked why by people who know him and presumably know he's American and served, and the other involves strangers calling to random houses in an apparent threatening manner due to the absence of a flag when a lot of houses in general wouldn't.

Feisar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482648#Comment_121482648

Same happened a friends uncle although it was a few people from the neighbourhood committee who he knew. They enquired why he wasn't flying the flag. He told hem he did two tours in Vietnam and didn't need a flag to show how American he was.

walshb

The world is so ridiculously connected that I don’t care what I am. Pride in one’s nationality was very important when we weren’t nearly as accessible and connected. Now we’re all just people of the earth. I can’t understand in 2023 folks getting bent ouha shape about nationality and identity issues.

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482703#Comment_121482703

Calm down there. Its not a life or death matter. Just like talking during the national anthem isnt.

Varik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121482656#Comment_121482656

my post shows what I quoted. It shows your original post.