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Deposit return scheme (recycling)

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13567…200

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    #62
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76,213 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429552#Comment_121429552

    They won't be getting them for free on people's doorsteps, which is what's relevant to the cost of waste collection



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    #63
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429689#Comment_121429689

    True, instead of having to go to several thousand houses, to collect, sort and process, they'll now have to go to maybe a dozen locations with the waste sorted already

    Seems like a win-win to me



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    #64
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76,213 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429711#Comment_121429711

    You're not quite getting this.

    Domestic waste collectors will have zero involvement in this scheme. They currently make money from the cans they will no longer collect. More money than the delta cost of collecting them versus the rest of the bin they will still collect and get little to no value for.

    They were very upset about it but it didn't stop the scheme



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    #65
    SteM
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,876 ✭✭✭SteM


    They'll still have to go to several thousand houses to collect the recycling that the scheme doesn't cover. Now they're not even getting aluminium cans from the trips,im sure they're delighted.



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    #66
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429715#Comment_121429715

    Again, why do you think waste companies won't be involved in dealing with waste?

    Where do you think this waste is going to go?

    If some waste companies won't be getting their piece of the pie, does that mean we shouldn't improve our recycling rates just to keep the status quo?



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    #67
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429734#Comment_121429734

    If they were smart they'd extend the time between collections as there would obviously be no need to collect on the current cycle

    So if they currently have a 2 week cycle to collect the recycle bin, just switch it to 4. Hey presto, reduced your collection costs



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    #68
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76,213 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429764#Comment_121429764

    Do you think that every small regional bin collector has their own processing and recycling facilities?

    They don't. They hand it over to the bigger firms. This business is gone for them forever.

    If there's more than one recycling firm involved in the back end for re-turn I would be astounded.

    I'm not saying this shouldn't happen, I'm just explaining (again and again, it seems) that it will not make your domestic recycling any cheaper, and may actually make it dearer.

    Cutting the frequency isn't going to work either as the mass volume of domestic recycling will still exist

    If you still can't understand this, I give up



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    #69
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429864#Comment_121429864

    Is that your guess or do you have anything concrete?

    My guess is that it doesn't matter either way, any business impact will be adapted to and Ireland will increase its recycling rates and the world will keep on spinning.

    Its like you are resistant to the change just for the sake of being resistant to the change



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    #70
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76,213 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429874#Comment_121429874

    I give up

    I am not resistant to this change. I am explaining something in a manner that everyone else appears to be capable of understanding. Your lack of comprehension is your problem.



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    #71
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429880#Comment_121429880

    We'll have to wait and see if the sky comes falling in



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    #72
    ednwireland
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,032 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429880#Comment_121429880

    totally agree. the value of your recycling bin will go down, so the company lifting will have to put the prices up ( mine has already gone up and I assume will do so again ) I already bring cans and bottles to a recycling point.

    I put my cans through the dishwasher so they are delabelled. Maybe they could put plastic ones on so the mark stays ?

    not sure how you wash cans without wetting the labels ?????

    "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others" - Winston Churchill

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



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    #73
    Magnolia Fast Image
    Posts: 7,522 ✭✭✭ Magnolia Fast Image


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429916#Comment_121429916

    But that’s what you’re not getting here L1011 is not saying anything is going to go on fire in the immediate aftermath but it almost certainly will lead to an increase in your domestic waste collection.

    either one recycling/waste management company will benefit profit wise from ReTurn the rest will lose money and that loss will be passed to who it always is— the customer OR ReTurn have a processing plan of their own to use in which case none of the waste management companies benefit here.

    But regardless the smaller and more regional companies who sell their cans to the likes of Panda or BNM are going to lose out on a lot of money if the cans recycled at home reduces dramatically.



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    #74
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429954#Comment_121429954

    Again, another guess based on nothing more than a guess

    Price increases happen for any number of reasons and we've seen waste collection prices increase over the years, nothing new there

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/another-bin-collection-company-increases-its-prices-for-households/a755974256.html
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/major-bin-company-becomes-first-provider-to-increase-prices-due-to-new-government-levy/a170095778.html

    That being said, its still not a good enough reason not to proceed with the DRS.



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    #75
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Hopefully the DRS will see some of these numbers improve

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2023/1128/1418838-epa-ireland-waste/




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    #76
    Magnolia Fast Image
    Posts: 7,522 ✭✭✭ Magnolia Fast Image


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429969#Comment_121429969

    No one said it was for a start and second of all are you seriously trying to suggest there’s no evidence or indeed precedent for a company increasing prices in response to a loss of profit?

    you’re surely just acting the maggot now?



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    #77
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430191#Comment_121430191

    No one said it was for a start

    Fair point

    second of all are you seriously trying to suggest there’s no evidence or indeed precedent for a company increasing prices in response to a loss of profit?

    Again, you are basing your guess on a guess

    You are making a guess about profitability based on a guess that waste companies will not be involved in the handling of the waste.

    Maybe guess is the wrong word. Assumption?



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    #78
    Genghis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,485 ✭✭✭Genghis


    I happily recycle all plastic bottles and cans, carefully cleaning them before putting them into our recycling bin.

    I detest this scheme and their cheery marketing that seeks to make people think the return of a deposit is some kind of reward.

    Accordingly, I have started making the changes below so I can completely avoid it. On top of the personal satisfaction of opting out of an imho stupid scheme, the bonus is my choices are reducing plastic.

    1. Will buy still water in 5l bottles, as they are exempt, and also use tap water where I can.

    2. Bought a sodastream to make sparkling water and soft drinks as needed, all without plastic. So far delighted with this.

    3. Bulk buy beer, and also soft drinks you can't make with Sodastream, in Northern Ireland (I usually make 2-3 visits there p.a.). Will probably buy locally in the run up to introduction (I expect many items will be discounted to run down non bar coded stock, some already are). NI means I avoid MUP too, another imho stupid idea.

    Will continue to happily clean and dispose of all cans, glass and plastic bottles at home.



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    #79
    Rigor Mortis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭Rigor Mortis


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121429944#Comment_121429944

    Not sure why you would wash soda cans. Its not necessary for existing recycling nor for the DRS.

    Washing bean tins wont matter cos tin cans for food arent in the scheme. They stay going into your green bin.


    As to the point as to how the waste no longer goes to the waste companies, Re-turn is collecting from stores, returning to two sorting plants one in Dublin and Limerick and then the materials are processed and sold back to the soft drink producers who can then have it turned back into bottles and cans.



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    #80
    elperello
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,918 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430366#Comment_121430366

    It remains to be seen how many will follow your example and find a work around which will suit their circumstances.

    There is no doubt that you seem to have it sorted.

    There was another thread about this and it became clear that for someone who is already a compliant recycler this new system offers only inconvenience.

    The only consolation for us good recyclers is that this new system MAY increase recycling rates and reduce littering.



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    #81
    Rigor Mortis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭Rigor Mortis


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430366#Comment_121430366

    Very carefully thought out.

    MUP and DRS will be in in NI within 2 years but you'll get a bit out of it.



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    #82
    elperello
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,918 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430476#Comment_121430476

    Without a functioning assembly I wouldn't be too sure about that.



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    #83
    Genghis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,485 ✭✭✭Genghis


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430476#Comment_121430476

    Depends on when an executive forms and what else is in the backlog when they do. I believe NI were invited to join re-turn but refused, preferring to join a UK scheme. How quickly the UK move, am not sure.

    Will obviously re evaluate then, but it may be many years away.



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    #84
    Rigor Mortis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭Rigor Mortis


    NI was never invited to join ReTurn. Minister Poots gave the basis on which the NI scheme would operate before leaving office. He made it clear that the NI scheme would align with England for the purposes of legislation. The Uk scheme is scheduled for Oct 1 2025 but early 2026 is more likely at this stage.

    NI DRS is not dependent on an Executive returning. But i believe MUP probably is.



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    #85
    elperello
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,918 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    I think MUP is dependent on the Executive returning.

    I suppose without MUP the DRS wouldn't be a deal breaker for regular ROI shoppers in NI.

    They would just return their empties for credit like the local shoppers.



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    #86
    tjhook
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 769 ✭✭✭tjhook


    There's one other option to avoid the scheme. I've opened a "subscribe & save" with Amazon to deliver a slab of cans from the UK every month. Obviously no good for alcohol, but fine for soft drinks etc. I'll continue to recycle using my green bin.



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    #87
    Rigor Mortis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭Rigor Mortis


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430947#Comment_121430947

    That'l be interesting. I'd put a (small) bet on that Amazon will end up charging you the deposit not long after launch. Legally they cant sell product in Ireland that's not part of the scheme. From mid March, they'd theoretically have to stop importing non scheme product into the country. Interesting to see how long you'd get it for.



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    #88
    tjhook
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 769 ✭✭✭tjhook


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121430988#Comment_121430988

    Yeah, dunno. But the cans won't have the Irish DRS QR code so I don't know how they can participate in the scheme. Maybe importation of foreign beverages will become a crime and Amazon will have to stop offering them.



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    #89
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76,213 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121431047#Comment_121431047

    It'll be illegal without the code and they'll either participate (different stock) or stop selling here.



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    #90
    Rigor Mortis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭Rigor Mortis


    That’s pretty much it. You will most likely see some small niche imported products disappear from the market. Some of the real niche beers will go. You’d have to imagine. They can sticker, but it’s a huge pain in the neck for very few sales.



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    #91
    TheChizler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,569 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121431054#Comment_121431054

    Is there an anti competition/EU free movement of goods side effect of this?



This discussion has been closed.
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