The Strategic Rail Review will consider how the rail network on the island can improve sustainable connectivity between major cities, enhance regional accessibility including to the North West and support balanced regional development.
You do you
That's fair enough if you didn't go enough into the detail. I can see you are not against the idea. None of us are authorities on the subject - we can only give opinons based on available information.
There are others here however who don't want the WRC to go ahead under any circumstances. Back during the recession it was said that the WRC would need to be suspended until conditions improved and I dont think many argued with that such was the state of the economy. But now that there is a bigger budget surplus than ever before the talk has switched to resources. Thats fair enough too but some people are using that to put the WRC near the end of the list which pretty much means never do it.
I hear what you are saying about taking resources off other projects but given the scale of the project I would like to think it could be done in tandem with some of the bigger projects. I dont think there are many planning issues but even if it took a year and a half to deal with that and try and get started with the work in the next 10 years then that seems reasonable to me. If the recession hadnt arrived the next plase to tuam and probably on to Claremorris would probably be in place by now. Based on everything Ive read I see it as a medium term project rather than a 30 year/never timeline that others predict.
There will always be major projects demanding the bulk of money and resources but it is important to fit in lesser projects also in the interests of balanced regional development.
Any capacity diverted into the WRC is capacity removed from other projects. The argument on here that we should "do it all" simply doesn't stack up. There isn't an infinite amount of capital or resources available to do it all.
As someone who lives in the West Of Ireland, I get the balanced regional development point. I want investment in infrastructure here, including in rail. We spent over 100 million euro on a line between Ennis and Athenry that carries very few passengers, while we still have a single track from Portarlington to Galway. It's ridiculous.
When I last used the Park n' Ride at Oranmore a few months ago, the train was barely over Lough Atalia before it had to wait for ten minutes for another train to come in. That's a consequence of the prioritisation of the WRC over the main line. Let's not repeat that.
Commuter rail for Galway and Limerick should have a much higher priority than the WRC, even then LUAS lines should have a higher priority again.
The report is all very nice, but commuter rail was excluded from its remit, and there are many many commuter rail projects with a much higher priority than anything in this report.
If people really wanted improved rail services in the west they'd have campaigned for an Athlone to Portarling double tracking which would radically improve timetables but no, they just wanted extra lines on a map.
"Any capacity diverted into the WRC is capacity removed from other projects"
You are misrepresenting what I said which is frustrating. I didn't deny that installing the WRC would need resources. Every piece of infrastructure demands resourses and if you apply the logic that it shouldn't be done because it needs resources then its like saying we should stop road upgrades in the west because its using resources that could be used to build roads elsewhere. Not every project is the cause of lack of progress on other projects.
"The argument on here that we should "do it all" simply doesn't stack up. There isn't an infinite amount of capital or resources available to do it all.."
Again I never said "do it all". I'm simply stating that its a relatively inexpensive, shovel-ready section of rail that could be put in place. I'm sure it could be gradually progressed while the bigger projects are delayed in planning and land acquisition.
"When I last used the Park n' Ride at Oranmore a few months ago, the train was barely over Lough Atalia before it had to wait for ten minutes for another train to come in. That's a consequence of the prioritisation of the WRC over the main line. Let's not repeat that".
Where is the evidence that failure to upgrade that line was caused by work on the WRC? So we know for sure that if the WRC didnt happen the issues at Lough Atalia would definitely be sorted now?.
"There isn't an infinite amount of capital or resources available to do it all."
Again that backs up the point I was making in my previous post - Like when is there ever infinite resources or capital? Never is the answer. So unless that situation arises the message is never upgrade the WRC.
Based on what? Sounds like you are doing your own research there.
If WRC1 hadnt gone ahead I very much doubt double tracking galway to athenry or even oranmore passing loop would have gotten done before now
The money would likely have been spent on more roads instead - rail infrastructure was just not a priority at all then. Frankly im shocked that WRC1 did get done at all in that environment
It's a no-brainer to double track the rail from Galway to Oranmore and make it a commuter rail. Maybe even double track it to Athenry if necessary.
Then Galway should grow along this corridor rather than all the once off housing in the west of the city. Have nice apartment developments of 6 - 8 storeys with all the necessary amenities like schools, creches, shops, sports etc.
Most of the big employers are in the East also.
That's how you grow a city rather suburban sprawl.
Maybe 3 stations between Galway Ceannt and Oranmore. Can put in a nice Greenway and park along the coast.
Why does a thread on the All Ireland Strategic Rail Review have so much focus on the WRC? Its not the only forum to be similarly focused.
Just one question: Why?
I agree with this.
WRC is commuter rail for both these cities.
Exactly pitting one piece of infrastructure against another is pointless. I doubt very much that shelving the WRC would speed up work much on other larger scale projects.
Because its part of the AIRR and people here have decided to talk about it. Feel free to bring up other parts of the review if you wish.
It's not though. Nobody needing to be in Limerick or Galway for work would use it. It's much faster to get the far more frequent buses or to drive.
Not really, more stops closer to the city to allow development is what is needed.
Quoted for truthiness.
Mod Post #744 asked posters to refrain from discussing the WRC, particularly Athenry to Tuam as there are more relevant things to discuss, and most that can be said about the WRC has already been explored.
All to no avail.
Next action will be to delete them.
I wonder does anyone have any thoughts on the potential timeline for the double tracking to Athenry?
...
😂
There's a lot of ambition in the plan at least. Long overdue for the most part. We need to be double or quad tracking lines continuously for a decade in my opinion. Irish Rail is probably better off getting in house staff for this and work for a few decades on it. This is basically all the improvements that should have been happening in the 20th century, as per normal developed countries.
So much for no more mention of the WRC. But in fairness the map edit is an appropriate symbol for your long running contempt for the line.
TBF, I definitely understand the dislike of the WRC, whichever phase. It's a fair argument, that if the same effort has been put in to double track sections of mainline or add additional commuter stations between Galway and Athenry, this would have been more impactful. That being said, the 100m spent on Phase1 is super cheap versus today and that line has now been brought back into use, avoiding further dereliction.
Anyway, Moderator Sam, I've no issue with WRC being deemed off topic, but only if it's handled fairly. People should not be allowed to dismiss discussion on other rural lines by referring to WRC, while at the same time, we're not allowed to tackle any negative comments made, if we disagree.
AIRR discussion is going to discuss the most controversial aspects of the plan. Lots of people dislike WRC as a concept so it is going to attract lots of discussion. Deeming it "off topic" is silly given the plan proposes to extend the existing WRC to Claremorris.
Haha still nothing mentioned on the Cavan line. Surely that's more controversial... no one here has dared voice support for it 😂
Haha, well if I were to discuss other parts of the plan, I'm enjoying the "new connection" to Sligo harbour. I didn't even know that Sligo port did run freight still, but after checking Sligo CoCo website, I'm enjoying their description.
Strandhill last had Dublin flights 12 years ago.
This is my post re WRC.
I did not say WRC was off topic. I actually said that the discussion should be on the Cross-border review. There is plenty to discuss.
The comment I made was referring to the fact that the existing M18 is more likely to satisfy the possible need for Tuam to Athenry public transport needs. It is, in my opinion, going to carry more passengers than any possible railway line from Athenry to Tuam. That particular discussion has been done to death.
Now, if there was to be a line from Derry to Cork, would it go down the west coast?
It probably will be built on a new route so it hasn't been worked out how to block it with a cycle path yet. 😜
What are the likely next steps following publication of the AIRR? It would be great to see an achievable action plan, rather than waiting for huge individual projects to get through years of planning etc.
Rural:
- Add passing loops at every station and additional loops as required to maintain a maximum 10km distance between loops. This should be super easy to do without restrictive planning, minimal capital and with broad support.
Mainlines - Cork / Belfast:
- Add 3rd passing loops at appropriate locations to support regular commuter and faster intercity services. More difficult regarding planning and construction, but can be implemented relatively quickly versus waiting for 4-tracking
Mainlines - Limerick / Galway:
- Considering all these lines used to be double track, it should be relatively easy to prioritise sections of double without restrictive planning. Let's say 3km sections of double track every 20km or less.
New/closed lines:
- Define definitive / exact routes now and ensure the routes are protected. Give land / home owners certainty, so they be kept in planning limbo, like what happens for many road projects. Build Greenways on all the routes, with enough space reserved to build rail lines at a later date without closing the Greenways.
As long as the sclerotic ABP process is dumped then things will happen
You make some very interesting points on increasing track capacity. Just a few reservations.
The most urgent candidates for track doubling are Portarlington-Athlone and Limerick-Limerick Junction (I take it that Athenry -Galway is already approved by everyone except ABP),
I think that Irish Rail are seeking advice on whether the Limerick Junction line should be doubled in whole or in part. It could be that doubling Killonan-Dromkeen would get you lots of ectra capacity at relatively modent cost.
Similarly a partial doubling of Portarlington-Athlone, say from Athlone to Clara could have a big effect on capacity and timetable resilience.
So modest amounts of redoubling might enable one to get increased capacity more quickly and at less cost. However I don't agree with your proposal for 3 km loops (dynamic loops) as these only work seamlessly when trains are running exacly to schedule. A longer double track section gives you more room for avoiding knock-on delays.
And by the way Athlone-Portarlington was never double track (unlike the defunct Athlone-Mullingar line)
I like this idea for the new/closed lines. Even god forbid we could do this for the Portadown/Cavan line. Even if it has a really poor business case as a railroad, it could be an excellent greenway to link to the Royal Canal one
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