Drones hit Moscow airport
What tactics of "fear and intimidation", to quote @rogber 's original post, are used in Western Society that can be drawn as morally or functionally equivalent to that of Russia - or any other despotic-adjacent nation? What institutions exist here, for instance, that ensure a compliant populace that are equivalent to that of Russia's, a country that never really had any suffrage movement or broke away from its cultural sense of serfdom?
Bred to be used as gun fodder they're only fulfilling their destiny.
There's been a fair few vids of Russian soldiers complaining about this and that at this stage. Has there ever been an after the video video. I'm assuming these troops are either shipped to the front, imprisoned or executed but wonder what actually does happen to them.
Now i feel i have to caveat the post with, I am not sympathising with Russian soldiers or people, in this thread. I am curious. Hopefully that will keep the keyboard warriors off my back.
They are getting annoyed by the slide. 97 rub to USD today.
And to add to the misery of Russian back at home, a Russian friend was telling me yesterday that in the Republic where he lives, the temp is now at 47c, and for 3 hours each day the grid is shut down as its unable to cope. And the forecast is that it will remain like this until the end of next week. Basically, everything is stopped as everyone in indoors sheltering, road surfacing is being destroyed and anything that has a low heat tolerance is being damaged. Imagine, 47c and not even a cooling fan.
Russians have always known that they have no value to their Government, but they've never been able to change it. How could they, when criminals are in charge?
After Ukraine, do you honestly think that Putin was going to allow Belorussia to go the same way? Lukashenko lost that election, but refused to accept the democratic will of the people, and when they started to protest, Putin sent the troops in. And today, there are so many Russian troops and equipment there, that it has been taken over in all but name by Putin. Even so, Luka is terrified that Putin will make him fight in Ukraine, that would definitely trigger a revolt.
I'd say that these guys are on the front. They're not at home anyway. But one way or another, they will be punished for sure. Dissention in the ranks is not tolerated in the Russian Military in any shape or form. Imagine what ideas the troops might get about pay and conditions, if it was allowed? Maybe even strike?
Going to be interesting to see of this turns out to be true
french Mirage 2000 supposedly in Ukraine
I had a hunch France might do something like this when they offered to be in the jet coalition earlier in the year....
Mirages have also been ever present on the NATO boarder, wouldn't surprise me if they have Ukrainian rear seaters.
Brilliant if true !
Could explain the mass missile attacks on Western Ukrainian airfields earlier in the week.
I highly doubt it. Not that I can read french or understand exactly what the tweet is talking about 🤷🏻♂️
Are they saying french planes have been flying in Ukraine or the french have given Ukraine mirages?
Do this group of soldiers know how precarious their lives can be from now on once their complaints are ‘brought’ to the notice of Mr Putin and his enforcers. God bless them. They must be only listening/looking at RT
Lets wait for a confirmation, but Ive heard rumours of their presence in Ukraine for the last 2 weeks.
War in Ukraine, Zelensky in Paris this Wednesday evening.
Of course he being such a genius and all -knowing , he issooooooo right. It’s great to see him getting sooooooo animated. I am surprised why he is going so public with the issue
Seems like they're saying that there's rumour of Mirage2000's hanging around Ukranian airfields for a few weeks. Which would only really make sense if they were being trained on them. I dunno though. I somehow doubt the west has been playing coy all this time on the F16 issue only to pivot and reveal they've been training Ukraine on Mirages this whole time. And delivery of 50 of the French planes this fall to be announced. Id love it to be true but I doubt it.
There really isn't a need to go further than the most obvious explanation. The Su-24s that are wreaking havoc on Russian supply lines and command posts with Stormshadows and Scalps are Numero Uno on Russias target priority(when they're not busy bombing hospitals, grain silos and restaurants). So targeting the Su-24 airfields is the more simple explanation.
I am amazed that none of them are wearing face masks to mask their identity. The background will also help identify who they are
All of it is meaningless hot air if the true reason for the Ruble's collapse isn't properly explored by the Russian media. Which, of course, it won't be 'cos the entire media landscape will be tightly massaged into continuing the lie over the invasion.
Ah God, the poor wee fecker tilting against the will of the rest of civilised world.
Le Figaro had reported back in March that Ukrainian pilots were receiving training on the Mirage but the story was refuted at the time by their Air Force:
https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/03/22/france-trains-ukrainian-pilots-on-mirage-planes-le-figaro/
That doesn't mean that it didn't happen of course. Even if the training and planes were committed back then, it wouldn't be in Ukraines interest to advertise it as it could have hampered efforts to get the F16s.
Good. More of this is needed
In modern Ireland? I'd like to know of examples where criticising government policy and supporting peace and human rights here will see you deprived of a future and possibly jailed for several years as is the case in Putin's Russia.
I think you would need to be very ungenerous to have interpreted my saying that every country and society employs these tactics to mean that they all did it with the same ferocity.
I meant that in every society, people who go against the socially accepted narrative or acceptable opinion are more often than not ostracised and for the want of a better word "cancelled".
It was not my intention to say that every example was equal but rather there are similarities in how having the "wrong opinion" will get you in trouble which coerces people to fall in line and this is very commonly used by governments.
It was a throwaway remark.
Indeed. Systematic examples at that. In Russia you are going to be arrested if you protest in any way against the war or regime, or even just holding up a blank piece of paper. Some of these people are receiving up to 15 years (in a brutal prison system). Navalny just received 19 years for the crime of being an opposition politician, and the latest is a man in his sixties who got 7 or 8 years for being anti-war, who was the sole-carer for his sick mother. She subsequently passed and he wasn't allowed to her funeral.
If ordinary Russian citizens wanted change, they are quite capable of achieving it. Stop making excuses for their acquiescence. The authorities can certainly deal very harshly with individuals, dozens, hundreds, a few thousand protesters. But no state can deal with tens and hundreds of thousands, millions of people on the streets demanding change. It becomes an impossible task and spreads to those who are supposed to implement crackdowns. Anyone who says the plain people of Russia have no capacity for change is just making excuses.
Do you have any personal experience of overthrowing a totalitarian mafia regime? How did it go for you?
Okay, then we're not in major disagreement, except that I think the difference in degree is important here. Getting "cancelled" or ostracised for holding an unpopular opinion is indeed a form of social intimidation and coercion, but still quite different to being told you can go to jail for several years for opposing a war, or that you'll be unemployable if you dare join an opposition party.
There's a big difference between cultural mores and prevailing moods - and systemic punishment by the regime in charge. You can't really imply an equivalence between a comedian getting "cancelled" (then enjoying a lucrative career on the talking circuit about getting cancelled), and the institutionalised paranoia and iron grip seen in Russia.
Do you feel the same towards all populations living in dictatorships, from Iran to North Korea to Syria? That basically it's their own fault for not going onto the streets en masse to protest? Or is Russia a special case?
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