Agree.
I’ve seen some suggestions online that the airlines should just move the late night and early morning flights to Shannon/ Cork/ Knock which I find laughable because
1) isn’t that just moving the night time noise problem that’s so unbearable (sarcasm) to others under these flight paths so as long as it’s not the north runway residents effected by noise (even though they aren’t already!!!) it doesn’t matter
and 2) Even if this restriction comes in, it’s not going to be Shannon/Cork/ Knock that will benefit as airlines will simply just move the planes out of Ireland and therefore the whole country is at a loss.
Hopefully they are successful, these NIMBYS need to be put in their place.
Longer term, approval for key pieces of national infrastructure should be made at national level, not locally.
I've been caught by Airport curfews before - London City being the nearest example with an Avro that could not be fixed before the time ran out. So they had to put us up in hotels for the night. I can see a lot of late EI and FRs being caught on their last hops here and diverted to ... Shannon ? I know it's technically not a curfew and this amount of flights - which are already sold for the next few months will pose a massive issue - even coaches - cos EI and FR arent scaled for that kind of thing at Shannon.
FR in particular would rather lop off their left arm rather than put people up and will have a cancellation plan ready to go as its what .. force majeure and not technically their fault so they dont have to pay compensation
Regarding the ‘noise’ at Dublin Airport: I live about 300 metres from the main Dublin Cork train line in Newbridge. The Cork express doesn’t stop in Newbridge but zips through the station at ( guess ) 100km/hr with its horn blaring every hour. We are so used to it we don’t even bat an eyelid.
Why, has something changed?
What’s happening to the Boot Inn?
Again, airport was there before majority of the houses. Any insulation they offer is a bonus to the residents on top of buying cheaper houses due to the proximity to the airport and exposure to noise.
if insulation is offered the same few residents will still not be happy and will want more and more.
It is mainly the residents off of the north runway complaining about night time noise and not the residents under the south runway.
I don’t know how many times it has to be said but the operations at night in DUB do NOT effect any resident under the north runway flight path any differently than they have since runway 28L10R opened in 1989 (I think it was) except for the very odd event of maintenance on the south runway which is few and far between.
Both north and south runways have been planned since 1968.
Time they were ignored now for the benefit of the rest of the country.
I think any airport authority anywhere in the world that brings noise issues upon private citizens should pay to address the problem. It should just become a cost of the project and I don't buy the 'Poor old DAA' line either. They can afford it and they should pay it. They are looking the full North Runway project on the cheap if you ask me.
Daa in high court this week according to business post to block Fingal enforcement order.
Between them, the dedicated cargo operators (DHL, UPS, FedEx) have several flights into DUB during the early hours of the morning and some continue to SNN. If we are talking about flights that are important to the economy, these are amongst them - more so than red-eye flights to or from Mediterranean sun-spots.
Two things.
Planning was amended by fingal last year to allow nighttime flights which also included more houses to insulate . As this was appealed by just 4 residents (unbelievable the power those 4 have) and is now waiting ABP decision and the insulation has been put on hold pending this. ABP should be held accountable for the unacceptable delays it itself has.
I also fail to even see why you think it’s your right for the daa to pay for everyone’s insulation on a flight path. Runways have been planned for 30 odd years. Airport is there 80 +. It’s not as if the airport showed up outside your back garden one Sunday morning. And the daa didn’t force anyone to buy a house under its flight paths.
There's a lot of 'blame the victim' and 'for the good of the nation' going on.
Planning is breached. The breach was planned. This is a serious issue where DAA are trying to have their cake and eat it.
Simple fact of the matter is insulation needs to be paid for instead of avoided. Then the problem goes away and everyone is happy. There are 100% redress schemes in place for Mica so why can't affected residents get insulation, which would also be an investment towards green energy.
People can turn on residents all they like. The solution here is for DAA to put their hand into their deep pockets instead of giving 2 fingers to An Bord Pleanala and the rule of law.
I live in a highly insulated new build under the flight path and I can't imagine what those people are going through. Like sleeping in a tent in my back garden.
Most cargo in and out of Ireland these days is on scheduled passenger flights.
There's no reason why the relatively small number of cargo flights should be affected, in my view. Also, it could for example be agreed that flights to and from business destinations or hubs be prioritised. Alternatively, if there is to be a large reduction from current activity levels, the airlines could each be given a quota and allowed themselves which flights to drop or reschedule. It wouldn't be pretty but maybe better to let them be the ones to decide, taking all factors into account.
A lesson for all then, don't believe what you read on the internet!
On the basis of some of the flights I've seen operating at crazy hours of the night, some of the recent issues are down to the problems being caused by things like the French Air traffic control strikes, which are resulting in strange routings to get to places, or slot restrictions, and the airlines are trying to operate as many of their scheduled flights as possible, due to the issues that would be caused by cancelling, I've seen flights both arriving and departing a considerable time after the times they were scheduled to operate at.
That said, we've all known for a long time that trying to turn a 737-800 in 25 minutes is asking a lot, especially if the flight is full, even more so if both inbound and outbound are full, and if there's fuel to be loaded as well, things very quickly get messed up, and Ryanair's scheduling doesn't have the wriggle room in it to allow for recovery if things are going bad, and that's not allowing for any technical issues that may arise.
The chances of this getting sorted any time soon is looking slim to me, given the very evident bias against aviation that's ingrained in the green agenda, and it's even worse with the lack of awareness from some people in high places of the realities of living on an island that's on the very edge of the EU, if meetings or similar have to happen, then it's not easy to be in the place where the meeting is happening if there's only one or two flights a week, which is the case for quite a few places these days.
Hopefully, there will be some progress on alternative fuel sources that will resolve the issues for the green NIMBY'S that are determined to try and make life as difficult as possible for the country to trade effectively. The idea of stopping cargo flights at night will cause huge issues, the harsh reality of a lot of specialist areas is that if you want parts in a reasonable time scale, you're going to be importing, and if cargo has to be sacrificed, then that's going to make the cost of doing business in this country even more uncompetitive, and we're already struggling because of misguided policies that have caused problems already.
A lot of exports are time and temperature sensitive, if aircraft can't be used to ship some high value cargo, then the manufacturers will look very urgently at moving to countries where they can get their product shipped in an acceptable timeframe. This country can't afford to lose those high volume high value industries, not if we want to keep the standard of living that's been achieved over the last 30 or so years.
It really only became an issue when the new runway was opened, as it's tied to that 2007 planning permission. If it wasn't formally agreed to by the Board, it should at least been on the DAA risk register and brought to the Board's attention through that mechanism.
How did the current amount of aircraft movements in excess of planning permission get approved ? Surely thats an DAA board decision that they have written down somewhere
Sorry your last line.
Thats completely untrue, it has nothing to do with commissioning or phasing in. The IAA has not approved the daa’s LVPs because they want ANI and the DAA to create joint rules and won’t approve the north runway for RVP or LVP operations till they are created and approved.
It has nothing to do with equipment either.
North Runway/10L generally doesn't open until 7am so any departures and arrivals scheduled before then will all have to use 10R. Some days depending on what works might be going on around the airfield/ATC staffing levels etc., 10L may not open as early as usual. That seems to have been the case this morning. At the moment 10L/28R is not allowed for low visibility approach operations due to new runway commissioning and phasing-in rules but it is fully equipped for low vis ops as and when it will be permitted.
Ah .... 10L has just been opened for landing I see.
Apologies if this has been asked before, but why is 10L not used in weather like today's weather is? I've noticed in the recent bad weather that when the wind is easterly, all arrivals and departures have been using 10R. Maybe there's Low Visibility Procedures in operation, but why would that prevent use of the North runway, at least for easterly landings and if so, why? All a/c this morning having to join either the north or south holds, each doing multiple circuits, before being brought onto the 10R ILS, and a conga line of departures queuing to line up on the same runway. Is there some technical reason that 10L can't operate in the same way that 10R does when the weather closes in?
Thank you!
There are 700 scheduled movements today.
I saw the post a few pages back with the number of flights that evening in the proposed curfew slot at around 130 between departures and arrivals. What would a typical number of total flights per day be? Just wondering if the removal of about 65 flights is such a huge dent in that number?
No
That's the excuse that wannabe dictators have always used to sieze power.
Well then the idea of paying people to move falls flat.
Fingal County Council said they have the right to come in and demolish daa property. This is Ireland, it will never happen. Daa should force this national issue once and for all around the planning farce here... there are elections in final next year , local councillor idiots , want to maximise their chances of being reelected. These decisions are way out of their paygrade/ petty small dick syndrome...
Or Ryanair could day they will stop all flights from Dublin if this goes ahead, until its sorted properly. See how quick national government will have to deal with the fcc morons then...
But it’s an emergency.
