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Family 5 moving home to Ireland from USA

Emcekelly

Hi,

Myself and hubby (both Irish) moved to the midwest in the USA for his job 7 years ago. His career has gone very well, i've stayed at home with kids (who are 10, 8 and 6 currently). Previously had lived 2 years at home and 2 years before that in the states. So total 9 years in states.

Our 2 years at home was supposed to be permanent but turned into a shitshow. Owned a home in Dublin in negative equity at the time, rented it as we were living in a different part of Ireland and had to rent. Renting 3 places in 2 years, moving b/c of mold, finances etc. The whole rental/housing scene left a very bad taste and thats why we emigrated again. At the time, we were broke and couldn't get ahead. It really was the most difficult time of my life so there is defo a feeling if fear about doing the move again.

Really we just came here to get ahead financially and have stayed here for finances. Things were kinda crap at home and we came with nothing. We now have possibly enough money for a cash buy for a house if we move home so the move has proved successful financially. Its been really nice not worrying about money and hubby doing very well in his career.

We have a deep convo every few months going back and forth and can never quite make up our minds. We miss the culture, sports, friends and most of all family (Esp me with family and its been incredibly hard raising kids with no support and a hubby working long hrs).

Our home, cars here etc are fab but apart from that we feel disconnected from American people/life. We (esp I) have made a few friends but maybe only 2 that are decent and just feel its all very superficial here. Its culturally lacking, sports for kids are super competitive and insanely expensive and time consumming (Think 2 grand per yr for an 8 yr old playing soccer, wth). Lets not talk about college fees here and of course the gun issue. We still feel like outsiders and i think always will.

Schools are good where we live, kids are happy, everything is ultra convenient in day to day living but we feel we are very much alone as a family of 5 here. I worry if anything was to happen esp to hubby, we are screwed. I don't want to die here or retire here is something we say to eachother. Not appealing.

Youngest two kids are enthusiastic about Ireland. Oldest is by far the most American and not as enthusiastic but he's the most outgoing so i think he'd be ok. Move would probably be a year from now if it were to happen. That puts him at 11 but turning 12 shortly thereafter.

I'm Dublin, hubby's west of Ireland. Job may be in Limerick or Cork. Wanting slighly rural but close enough to city. I wouldn't consider if we had to be saddled with a big mortgage but the fact we could be mortgage free (we are both early 40's) is very appealing and makes the move more financially feasible.

We would like to be closer to our aging parents to help out and visit, to have our kids connecting to family and cousins etc, to have some craic again. My hysband is worried about being burned financially again and isnt quite sure on salary yet. Certainly not anything like he makes here but i'd still think fairly decent. I'm a qualified secondary teacher so thats always an option too esp once kids are settled and we've got our footings.

Anybody moved home with school age children? Any experiences or advice appreciated.

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screamer

I have a friend who moved home from the US with kids around the same age. The kids had a hard time settling in, couldn’t get used to the lack of things to do/ shops and weather. Also got a hard time in school because they were very tanned and the other kids being mean used to call them the Mexicans. Anyways, the eldest kid has never settled, far as he’s concerned America is where he wants to be and I think he’ll head back there as soon as he can. I have another friend who moved back from Australia about 4 years ago with older kids to rural Laois. The kids hated it and the eldest 2 now 20 and 18 packed up and went back to Australia just after Christmas, they just couldn’t take the weather here. Im sure there are others who have moved back successfully but I know when we considered moving abroad we decided wherever we were when eldest started school is where we would stay. It very much depends on where the kids identify as home, and if they can adapt. Ireland for sure has good points but it’s a huge adjustment for kids used to bright lights and lovely weather. Good luck with it all, you’ll make the right decision, no matter what that is.

3DataModem

I would urge caution.

"Schools are good where we live, kids are happy, everything is ultra convenient in day to day living"

These are very important considerations. You are going to be putting some or all of this at risk. Think carefully before considering what you are prioritising above this.

"but we feel we are very much alone as a family of 5 here."

Every family of 5 is "alone" to some degree. The business of being a family is somewhat isolating. You think that isolation will disappear moving to Limerick or Cork? It won't. Dublin? It won't.

I'll tell you about a family very close to me. The couple moved away in early 2000s, a short term plan. Had three kids... and never stopped talking about their long term plan to move "back to Ireland". Their kids were always dreaming about what it would be like "back in Ireland".

They moved back with a 13, 11, and 8 year old. They lasted less than a year. All their friends had "changed" (they hadn't, they were just 15 years older with kids of their own). Nobody was grateful or excited to have them around, people had their own lives to live. Nobody was in their 20s anymore.

"We would like to be closer to our aging parents to help out and visit, to have our kids connecting to family and cousins etc, to have some craic again."

I understand the parents thing. But putting your children's happiness and your family harmony behind your aging parents is unwise, IMO.
The cousins thing... so you visit the cousins, and they don't necessarily get along straight away, then what? You are trying to enforce a friendship when they already have friends and a network etc in school.
Have some craic again... you make your own craic, you can make time for hobbies, social activities, and friendships where you are... but you don't because presumably you are focused on your young family of five. NOBODY with 3 kids has time for any craic, without a lot of work.

Bottom line: tread carefully.

tinpib

The 2 stories above of people whose "failed" is because they moved. It's impossibble to hear stories of people whose move home failed by staying where they are! I'm sure there is a name for this, maybe some spin on survivor bias?

You won't know until you go. But their points are valid, a lot of upheaval plus possible "the grass is greener" in Ireland, that this idyllic scenario you have of life in Ireland might not play out.

I'm single but lived abroad and I totally get the elderly parents bit. I'm glad to be back to help out as they turn 80.

It's a huge move for you to make, it could be good, could be sh!t as they say.

Str8outtaWuhan

If you think kids playing sports in the US is expensive, with til the Grab All Association get their hands into you. Think of it this way, if you return here you are saddling yourself and your family with generations of debt we have accumulated to bail out German banks.

enricoh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861325#Comment_120861325

Ah yes the grab all association - E90 for my 6 year old for the year. E60 for gear n gumshield etc , pair of boots on top. 2 grand for her kids soccer in the US.

Iirc 40 billion of the 240 billion we owe is from the banks- the rest is from having world class welfare payments , COVID payments, benchmarking etc.

Baybay

Different times but my family lived in one part of Ireland until I was nearly seven & then we moved to another European country. I hated it. I was put into a lower school year to help make friends, figure out how things worked without having to try too hard in lessons. I thought they thought I was stupid as schoolwork was so easy. The other kids thought I was a bit too clever as I was obviously repeating things I’d already learned while they were doing it all for the first time. I hated it more, especially when the bullying started & I begged to go home. Turns out my father was unhappy too so after eighteen months or so, we came home. But to a different part of Ireland. I was devastated initially but now wherever I go, that part of Ireland is always home. Some of my happiest memories are there. I always feel a little bit “other” even now but everyone has something that makes them a little bit different I suppose.

enricoh

If you can come back more or less mortgage free you are in a great position op. Watched a documentary on opioid epidemic in the states it didn't look like the American dream for anyone with kids - scary stuff.

Even if hubby took a hit financially you could get jobshare in a school no bother. I was around when oul lad passed away last year n if I wasn't it would have eaten me up I reckon. If the kids are teenagers its a lot tougher - more hormones floating around!

Str8outtaWuhan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861447#Comment_120861447

And cul camps, club draws , fundraisers, gaa lotto, pay for bus etc.. no one in this country involved in gaa pays just 200 a year for their kid. Do the math.

suilegorma

I absolutely would not rely on having a community available if you return. People have busy lives with kids school, activities etc. and you probably experience a greater effort being made when you visit as it is infrequent. But I have found as the years move on that it is the people who you are interacting with on a daily basis, school parents, sports parents, that become your network. So certainly you can build a new one if you return but it might not be the one you think of now. Of course every family is different but I have seen this pattern repeated.

I can imagine the massive push factors of gun violence and college costs to be on your mind. In terms of college, bear in mind the residency rules if planning on returning for free fees Moving could potentially take time so make sure you are up to date on requirements, albeit paying non EU fees would be considerably lower than a US college education. Hard to tell right now but eg a medical or legal degree in Ireland is a lot lower cost if you think any of your kids will go down that route.

Consider also the Irish language requirement and the ages it begins for newly moved students. This may or may not have a bearing on your decision or timing as it adds another layer to the school experience if a new language that is not the everyday language is expected to be learned.

I imagine also that your children all have their own personalities and they would all react differently to a move...some of them might feel at home like they never left, others unsettled and wish to return to the old life. And there might be seasons to these feelings, they might change over time.

Have you thought about the things that might make life more enjoyable there i.e. a move to a different part of the country, maybe somewhere with a more European population or even more Irish to get the social/cultural connection you crave? Going back to work which might expand your social circle? Spending school holidays in Ireland to get the connections?

It is a massive decision, and as you have experienced, not irreversible. I hope you are able to make a decision that works for you all. Nowhere is perfect, Ireland has plenty of issues, weather, housing, healthcare etc.

Spear

This isn't related to site Feedback. Confirm your email address so you can post properly, then I'll move this to a forum that's related to the topic instead.

suilegorma

And also another consideration...would you consider a whole new location, eg Australia, Canada, UK which are English speaking and might offer similar career opportunities but maybe offer more of what you miss where you are now? Not what you want to be closer to your family but might bridge the gap of other concerns.

On the salary change, it can feel like stepping back if you don't get the number you want. But do a proper review of your disposable income and not just the headline salary to reassure that your standard of living won't fall.

And you mention retirement. It's a long way off maybe but what is your plan and how would the move factor into that? What about your own projections for retirement income, is your property expected to cover that or are you loading into your husbands in the US? How does your social insurance record in Ireland sit and what can you do to improve your potential income in retirement? Being mortgage free in early 40s is excellent and would allow you to focus on retirement savings.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861325#Comment_120861325

What ?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861513#Comment_120861513

I think you’re in the wrong thread , I’m sure there’s a thread for people who couldn’t make the u16s somewhere

Emcekelly

Well that's a concern to hear. I do think my oldest could be the one to struggle. He is very friendly, outgoing and confident (borders on precocious i think) and that goes down well here. I don't think it would go down as well at home.

Sometimes i do think he needs a more balanced environment. We live in a bubble here, very nice suburbs where everyone is generally doing very nicely and my kids think this is just the norm in life and its really not.

Many of the kuds he goes to school with live in mega mansions, have everything you could think of and he feels hard done by because we are from the more normal estate. To me, i live in a mansion but my kids think because we dont have a pool, a massive kitted out basement and don't go on several hols a year, its not fair.

Unfortunately you try to pick where you live here based on school systems so you end up in socio-economic divided communities that are more glaringly obvious here.

Emcekelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058305366/family-5-moving-home-to-ireland-from-usa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861296#Comment_120861296

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861504#Comment_120861504

Thanks Enricoh,

We live in a suburban bubble wrap. Our main village is like the the movie version of the USA. Thats thr way my motger described it when she came to visit. Im not worried about that. The teenagers don't get up to much mischief here.

Our main reason for staying and being here is $ and beyond that nothing much so thats why it's a never ending discussion about Ireland.

markjbloggs

Let me be 100% clear - as someone who was in your situation many years ago.

DON'T MOVE BACK HERE

We did, and I curse that decision every day. I cannot emphasise enough the drop in living standards and career suicide as a result of that decision.

-Health, transport and housing are 3rd world.

-Schools are hit and miss, some are good but others are mediocre.

-What you remember as Irish culture is rapidly fading.

Just my 2 cents ....

Emcekelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861617#Comment_120861617

Thanks. We have discussed moving to the east coast. Property tax is a bitch and to have the same lifestyle we have here (Indiana) my husband would have to earn consideribly more.

Husband has a very nice pension plan here that would cover us both nicely. Also shares yearly. I get anxious of the thought of something hapening to him, he is the earner. Id get a dexebt pay out but then i think i'd be stuck alone here.

We both worked prior to moving in Ireland but woukd need to work on pensions going home and work on kids college.

Emcekelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861595#Comment_120861595

Done

Emcekelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861540#Comment_120861540

The whole community thing doesn't really exist for us here. In the midwest you get very few foreigners and i'm constantly asked why on earth we moved here in an incredulous tone. Hubby works for a pharmaceutical.

Most people that live here are from here and have lifelong connections, friends and family so they aren't that interested in making friends. They are nice and friendly and laid back but they don't need new friends. I always mostly feel like an outsider.

I have one female friend group made through an exercise class. We have fun when we meet up but the craic is vastly different than female friends at home. Another group i tried to connect with were very clicky and one of two of the people ghosted me (cringe). Hard to explain that dynamic but it didn't work. Some people i've made friends with and really invested time into making those connections moved states which is very common here. Its exhausting trying to constantly find your type of peoole. 7 years in this house and community and its still meh.

Had a friend who works for the same company as hubby over from Ireland come visit us and i can't explain the relief i felt and the flow of the convo. It only occured to me after she left, how different it was from coversing with women here. No 'you do you girl' or 'oh i just love you friend'. All that bullshit frazzles my brain.

I went back to work a couple of mornings. Nice people, mostly a good bit older than me but overall they don"t socialise outside of work.

Kids and Irish. Yeah thats a pain in the arse. Oldest could get an exemption, 10 yr and over. Possibly middle but not youngest. He is only starting Kindy this year. They start school at 5-6 here and mine have all been 6.

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120862939#Comment_120862939

And moved to the Coming Home forum accordingly.

brokenbad

The same applies here in Ireland - if you move into a new community as a "blow in" it can be difficult to integrate yourself and make new connections - particularly in rural areas where some folks can be quite cliquey and view outsiders with suspicion. A pretty narrow minded view - but true. The Ireland of old where everyone knew everyone and people rambled to each others houses is a thing of the past.

Emcekelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120861325#Comment_120861325

Well currently, for 3 kids 10 and under, we are talking about 5 grand per year. It will really increase with age and thats not the only kicker. Our soccer season months are a nightmare. Kids don't all hop on a mini bus for away games. Families attend all games here, parental involvement is huge. When he starts travel in 2 years, its out of state i heard. That means so much more money, hotels and family time.

The youngest looks like soccer would be his thing too. The oldest swims. Training 5 times per week and swim meets (they take up half day). Its literally insane. We are two parents who grew up playing alot of sport. Our boys are typical boys who are into sport, run everywhere and want/need sport.

There's very little rec anything past 8/9 years here. Its competitive or nothing. It really sucks. Its very costly, almost prohibitive and involves significant parental involvement/time. Oh and get this for the wonderful price of thousands per year, you still need to do volunteer hrs or you get charged more.

suilegorma

You know what, I have heard Irish people described in the same way, entrenched in their family and existing friends :) Not to trivialise your situation as it is so hard to not have close friends or people on your wavelength, it's exhausting and missing the social interaction especially if you are home a lot and your husband is working long hours is hard. If you do move back to Ireland, really think about where you live. Even near a city rural locations still have a bit of suspicion of outsiders, although certainly easier to make friends with kids as you have a natural thing in common. And it sounds as if you are really up for making the effort.

suvigirl

A different time perhaps, but we moved home to Ireland when I was 11, in the 80s. Massive shock for me, being used to living in the middle of a city, to move to a small rural town near the border.

Honestly don't think I spoke much to my mam for a few months, but I settled grand, as did my younger siblings. I could have had an exemption from irish, but my mam made me do it. I caught up within a year and did honours in the leaving cert.

it was different times in the 80s & we didn't come from anywhere fancy & definitely didn't have much, but it was still a shock.

I'm definitely glad we came home & my siblings too.

Just to maybe give you another perspective.

memisemoi

Sports aren't too dissimilar here these days. The days of firing the kids onto a mini bus off to matches is long gone - or it is where we live anyway. Competitiveness is in soccer/GAA from very get-go (even though it's not really meant to be), so there's that.

Swimming - parental volunteering is non-negotiable across the world. It's how it works (we've a competitive international swimmer in this house). His pool sessions are 6 days a week (twice a day on some days). Galas are whole-day/weekend events, with the nationals being 5 days long. So yeah, that's not changing if you move back! Attendance at the galas for parents is only necessary when they're assigned a duty (officiating, chaperone, etc) if you're not on duty, there's no expectation for you to be at the event other than dropping/collecting the swimmer! The swimmers stay with their clubs during the events.

What I would say is regards to access to opportunities in sports: Ireland is more restrictive. Every parish has GAA and soccer, but to avail of other sports, you'd have to choose your location carefully! Just something to be mindful of.

We moved back to where I grew up 9 years ago (from another part of Ireland, so you'd think meh, no big deal)... took me 2 years to settle and finally see the positives. Kids settled fine, as did the husband. Took the older lad 9 months to really settle though, but me, two years at least. I grew up here, a small village, 20 minutes from larger towns, and I struggled horribly. I was lonely, and to be frank, the family support is great but support can come at a cost too (interfering family).

The difference in cost of living was enormous for us. We were able to give the kids chances to try all sorts (equestrian, archery, athletics, soccer, GAA, rugby, swimming, etc, etc) whereas where we used to live, we wouldn't have had a pot to p1ss in at the end of every month after food/utilities/childcare/mortgage were covered, even with two salaries coming in.

Emcekelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863317#Comment_120863317

Thank you, this is helpful to know about sports.

When you say the cost of living what are you comparing?

purplefields

I had to opportunity to move to USA about 15 years ago, and to this day I bitterly regret the decision that I did not.

My friend that did move is a multi-millionaire now. Not a chance that he'd move back to Ireland.

Even though I do not have a mortgage and would be on good wages by international standards, I am not exactly living the high life here. Ireland is death by a thousands taxes, charges, duties and levies. Any money you have will soon be eaten up by the Irish Government. Heaven help the typical Irish person on industry average wage and a mortgage!

I also can't stand the Irish climate. Horrible grey, depressing damp the year round.

I hope my children have the sense to get out.

memisemoi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863414#Comment_120863414

We moved from north east Kildare to west county Limerick. Our mortgage where we live now is similar to what we had, but our money goes further. Sports cost less - for example, one hour of horse riding here was the same price as half an hour there. Childcare cost less when we needed it. Rent (when we were building) was a fifth of what we'd have paid in rent had we stayed where we were originally after we sold up.

DamianLong1234

One thing to keep in mind, if you do come back, you are sentencing your children to a life in poverty without the ability to purchase a home for themselves and possibly dying on the streets (due to homelessness). I wouldn't come back if I were you to be honest.

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863873#Comment_120863873

Isn't it possible to have dual citizenship with Ireland and US ... so that's not quite true ?

The tyranny of choice it seems.