That will take long than this year though. If much of the marshes flooded now were still wet in 20 years, hardly be surprised.
Bit of a encirclement starting there, would be a big propaganda win for Ukraine if it was to retake Bakhmut.
I don't know if it will, this seems like the natural plain for the river to run into and given the amount of water it'll be a long time before any kind of recession.
I presume the floods will recede when the river drains, but there's a lot of water in that river.
Indeed rumours flying around this morning that Russia had only intended to create a small breach in the dam, which is apparently what the initial blast did. This would have been sufficient to hinder Ukraine from crossing the Dnipro south of the dam and likely destroyed the tactical bridgeheads Ukraine had established on the aits near Kherson. The slower release of water would have meant the river remained impassable for a much longer period.
In keeping with the general incompetence of the Russian army though the sheer weight and force of the water made the breach much larger and as a result has also destroyed or damaged much of the first line of Russian defences on the west bank of the Dnipro.
Looking at the media photos the Ukraine army seem to be predictably taking a lead on the evacuation of civilians caused by the floods. As well as the logistics of crossing a flooded plain that commitment of troops surely stops any prospect of an attack from the Kherson region for at least a couple of weeks. As it seemed like the Ukrainian counter-offensive was still in the probing phase then I guess they may just put the brakes on the whole thing until that area has settled again.
Oh there most certainly would be a swift response that would put the Moscow dwarf in a box 6 ft under but the question remains is he unhinged enough to do it if defeat is inevitable.
I heard earlier that the russians may have blown more of the dam than they intended ,
for sure the flood swamped ukrainian positions on the the island in the river , which were largely in ukrainian hands at this stage, but it also swamped the russian positions on slightly higher ground ..
And it seems the russians didnt try to pull back from the flood till much later,
You made a stupid comment yesterday about me yesterday which i ignored. I have no "previous accounts" on this particular site, if you continue to make such accusations at the very least have the intelligence to back it up with evidence or pipe down.
In regards American intelligence, they are as right often as they are wrong. Perhaps you would remember to review their history before directing posters to read the thread from the start.
Looks like Prigozhin was right about Ukraine making an advance in Berkhivka.
The dam was blown by Ukrainians
Oh wait there be a conclusive piece of evidence deliberately delayed as the evil Kerminal denials get more like its a John deere not a leopard 2.
This war crime goes all the way to putler who needs to be helfired like many Isis leaders before him.
Does anyone really trust american intelligence anyway?
Blowing the Nuclear plant would bring the hammer down on Putin. No way central European countries would not respond with military force when nuclear fallout starts rendering their agricultural sector useless.
A bit like Tyrion Lanister in GoT, who passed on a different piece of disinformation to each member of the council to see which one found its way to Cersei, thus telling him who the snitch was.
Futhermore, didn't they previously lay claim to both sides of the river there as forever part of the Russian Federation? They even had a totally legitimate referendum on the subject.
They spliced Lindsey Graham Did Senator Graham Say that Russians are Dying in Ukraine, which is the “Best Money They Have Ever Spent?” - mythdetector.ge
You don’t even have to look at Russian papers- look at the comments in the daily mail- tons of high thanked comments clearly believing it was Ukraines doing.
There is no Russian side of the river.
It was more a question for debate and discussion than something I had thought through or have a strong view on, so thanks for the reply.
My own view is that the Russians will continue to destabilise as much internal infrastructure as possible, and quite possibly such that, nuclear reactors are impacted greatly but without a “direct hit” , thus Putin can claim it wasn’t his doing. It also ties up an awful lot of manpower to deal with such incidents
Its clear ground battles aren’t achieving desired outcomes- displacing as many Ukrainians and making vast areas un-navigable is an obvious option, including actions that destabilise nuclear reactors - I think it would be mad to discount this possibility as Putin at this stage is obviously quite mad.
I certainly read/ heard reports yesterday that there was an audible explosion in that time period, heard at distance. Haven't time to look back and find where I read it but noted on Euronews last night that the report stated that the dam was blown up. You'd think there'd be CCTV in the general area that would confirm this.
Reports this morning that residents on the Russian controlled side were getting a hard time fleeing due to suspicions of Russian checkpoints. But hard to know the truth in all this, also reported that the Russians had been evacuating the areas for a while and 'resettling' the people elsewhere, presumably at the point of a gun.
More like a desperate last attempt at the Ukrainian's 'king'. Russia hoping they make a blunder and don't sweep them off the board.
Are we moving to checkmate here? Yesterday the dam, tomorrow a nuclear power plant or at least the threat of such action to call a truce of some description?
?……??
quite a climbdown from it was definitely russia
'Can not say' is different to 'Do not know'
🤐
The initial pressure on a weak point would be a static problem. That momentum only becomes part of it when all that water gets moving after a breach. Once it gets started you don't want to be in the way.
oh it definitely changes calculus during the catastrophic failure. I'm sure anyone standing nearby calculating the bernoulli equation for that was swept away by a freight train of water, and a freight train after that, and that, and that, and that, and - that momentum adds to the maths.
Water pressure is only dependent on height, not volume.
Of course. Anyone in NATO with sensitive operational data at all levels could, at any time, compromise data willfully or negligently. But that is true of any organization of virtually any scope. In that circumstance however multiple intelligence agencies (many of them operated by countries within NATO) all spy on each other to verify intelligence and intercept the leaking of information (MI6, CIA, Interpol, Five Eyes, etc.). I mean this has been going on since what, the world wars, because someone can always defect, or have loose lips, you need to know what they know. For example, didn't the Allies let some Axis naval attacks get carried out so that we didn't leak, through logical deduction, that we had cracked their Enigma machines? The US Intelligence system would know what the information was that was shared for example, and through its world wide network of 'cables' if that information had found its way on opposing channels like in Russia, that would probably trigger a whole series of steps to deduce who the source of the leak was. TLDR, of course they could - at their own peril.
The FSB no doubt try to infiltrate every NATO member's military and security service as well as NATO HQ itself. Not just Tirkey unfortunately: they can always get someone greedy enough to take the bait.
Could countries in NATO such as Turkey who aren’t really as vocal against Russia as let’s say the USA, be compromised by let’s say the FSB and pass vital information to Russia.
Simple enough question.
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