Beau talks all the dam angles
Its not a hill, I am trying to ascertain the situation in good faith but objectively. You seem to be emotionally charged, don't blame me. It's still a war crime, if that's what you are looking for.
Would there be such a thing as a John Deere Leopard? (Asking for a friend.)
If they're not scorching earth, they're flooding it. Whether by explosion or negligence, it is entirely Russia's fault. Had they not invaded, the dam would still be intact.
Ukraine literally admitted to performing three HIMARS missile strikes on a flood gate as a 'test'. This occurred around Oct 24.
“There were moments when we turned off their supply lines completely, and they still managed to build crossings,” Kovalchuk said. “They managed to replenish ammunition. … It was very difficult.”
Kovalchuk considered flooding the river. The Ukrainians, he said, even conducted a test strike with a HIMARS launcher on one of the floodgates at the Nova Kakhovka dam, making three holes in the metal to see if the Dnieper’s water could be raised enough to stymie Russian crossings but not flood nearby villages.
The test was a success, Kovalchuk said, but the step remained a last resort. He held off.
Source
It is a dead end talking about how dams work or what they can 'cope' with because this refers to healthy dams. This was not a healthy dam, critical apparatus were shelled and hit with missiles. Go shoot some missiles at Ardnacrusha and then tell me how easy it is to control the water levels.
Guess we may learn more, sooner than expected.
I'll say again, if you want to pedantically dissemble the semantics of the destroyed remains of the dam, I'll leave you to it nonplussed.
Got in a fight with a lawnmower is the same thing as leopards ate your face then.
Or not at all ,as we've seen previously with American intelligence,
In Serbia during the Kosovo crisis, this actually happened. I met a farmer who put his harvester into the shed, but the delivery chute was too high and was sticking out, and NATO dropped a bomb on it. They blew up many washing machines and lengths of plastic piping, with small heaters in them to give the impression of a hot engine, and the whole lot covered in camouflage netting.
Well if US intelligence is calling it as the Russian's that did this then it must be true.
If Ukraine blew up the dam, either it was a stray missile that hit it by accident (unlikely given the level and accuracy of the damage) or they would be admitting to it as part of the counter offensive strategy.
In the absence of both of those, the most likely culprit is russia.
My heavy bet would be on russia in some ill fated scorched earth policy.
Yes some of the dam still exists, but now its a non-functioning dam. About one third of it is physically destroyed.
Yes, but it was still holding until yesterday, that's more than 8 mths, and while it may ultimately have collapsed as a result of the Himars strike you mentioned, they were not the cause of it collapsing now.
The biggest "whodunnits" of the war, so far, have been the destruction of the Nordstream pipeline and the bombing of the Kerch bridge. I don't recall the US Intelligence services trying to pin either of those on Russian immediately afterwards. Should they do that now then I reckon they'll have the receipts.
The size of the reservoir doesn't really change the pressure on the dam. The depth of the water is largely what increases the pressure. A shallow breach wouldn't be subject to as much pressure as a deep one.
It seems to have breached in 2 seperate parts of the dam, on the spillway and in the pump house section. Thats why I'm thinking it was no accident or knock on from previous hits.
Except this event is directly related to the war.
To me when there was the news of Ukrainian armed forces active recently on the eastern bank of the Dnipro it seemed it could be a plausible move by the Ukrainians to take the moskovyte held side of the dam and use it as a crossing point for their armoured vehicles to make a larger scale attack on the moskovytes in the area. The destruction of the dam when it looks to be the start of the counteroffensive by the forces of Ukraine points to it being a deliberate effort by the moskovytes to make the option of using the dam structure as a way to get heavy equipment across the river impossible. Since it was well known that the structure had been rigged with explosives by the moskovytes I think Ukraine will have made plans to work around this move but the fact so many posters on this thread are still swallowing the moskovyte line that it was the Ukrainians or some sort of accident is surprising.
Thank you for your considered response and not referring to my "ignorance".
Just saw on Sky News that cia knew of Ukrainian plan to attack pipeline. US had intelligence of Ukrainian plan to attack Nord Stream project -Washington Post | Reuters
America is sayings they cannot conclusively say who did it ,,,,,
No real surprise there
No Serbian. Washing machines and indoor plumbing where unlike in Russia, are in plentiful supply. The Serbs toured the waste and scrap metal yards collecting anything that could be repurposed and used as false decoys. Recycling at its finest !!! They were expert at it too, building their decoys in forests etc, and camouflaging them.
This would be a serious own goal by the Ukrainians if true
Earlier in the day iirc NBC reported White House did know and was undergoing process to declassify. Potential is they know but could not reveal how they knew, so officially they don’t know. You know?
Good long interview here with Mark Hertling, Jonathan Fink is a really good interviewer.
i haven't wathed that, but is it before or after the dam break?
If you want to stay with yourself head off
Very interesting timing.
And it just happened to fail in the early hours of the morning, in and around the time of increasing Ukrainian attacks on Russian positions. Give us a break, nobody is gullible enough surely to take that at face value. Are they? Never mind reports of explosion heard in the region at the time.
Take the propaganda to the Russian embassy here and stuff it up the ambassadors arse.
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