It was a witch hunt with corrupt gardai involved.
No-one in their right mind would come forward when they saw what the gardai did to an innocent person.
Could you blame them?
This case reminds me of the missing postman, Larry Griffin, who went missing Christmas Eve 1929 while in a village pub with people he knew.
Whatever caused his death we don't know maybe he fell due to being drunk or was in a fight but everyone there, two Garda, school principal, publican and one or two others never spoke of it.
There was a search that lasted years, a collapsed murder trial, and endless media interest and yet a wall of silence.
The silence was such that an author who researched the matter believes that descendants of the conspirators know less about the case than readers of her book.
Here we have an infant baby, viciously stabbed to death, yet nobody speaks out. No comment 40 years later.
The parents still being together is extraordinary; infant death for "natural" ends a lot of relationships how a couple could survive the violent death of their child beggars belief.
How would a couple sit down and go about planning a family after something like happened baby John? How do you look at your other children, family photos and not break?
40 years later or not a Garda investigation is warranted, part of the criminal justice system has to be about saying to the victim "you matter, we will find out the truth and prosecute this case".
"A file has been sent to the DPP"
Has it, already?
The Times article says a file is being prepared, that could take months, years even.
Or are you just making stuff up?
But who do they need to talk to and for who's benefit?
They don't need to talk to us to satisfy our curiosity.
A file has been sent to the DPP, if there is any talking to be done it will be done in court to answer any charges.
That's the only talking the couple are obliged to do.
If either of them cared one jot about the baby, they should apologise for not speaking up about with happened to their son.
They can easily say the deceased man only told them on his deathbed and at that point as Hayes had be cleared and apologised to, it was easier to say nothing. For that we are sorry and should have come forward.
Job done.
The grave has been vandalised several times over the years. In 2004 on the the 20th anniversary of Baby Johns death the caretaker of the graveyard replaced a small wooden cross on his grave with a small granite headstone to which was inscribed 'I Forgive'. Soon after he did that someone smashed it with a sledgehammer. The caretaker believes it is someone local who is connected to Baby John that has been vandalising the grave over the years, Gardai have also said that they believe the same.
Yeah what's this about.
They should have come out years ago with the truth.
Very apt descriptions of both O'Carroll and Callinan. Just very recently watched the Kerry Babies episode of Crime and Confessions on RTE Playback https://www.rte.ie/player/series/crimes-and-confessions/SI0000012595?epguid=IH000414513 O'Carroll resorted to some foul language when interviewed and it was in relation to the IRA. He seemed like someone with PTSD and seemed to have no awareness of how he was coming across.
The parents need to talk, their son was brutally murdered, staying quiet isn't acceptable.
It's sad seeing Baby John's grave, I wonder who takes care of it and if his parents have ever visited it?
He may not be too far out though as the suggestion seems to be that the mother of baby John had a father in the Gardai (who had passed away before 1984) but she also had a brother in the Gardai who passed away less than 5 years ago.
The guards totally own the blaming of Joanne Hayes. This couple may be guilty of a number of crimes but that's not one of them.
What is the actual truth in this Kerry Babies case may never be known. It is very convenient for the couple to blame someone who is now dead - thus meaning nothing can be confirmed or denied. This dead person may have had no involvement at all.
What we do know for sure is that this couple stayed quiet for 39 years while another woman was blamed and shamed. Thats also a crime in my opinion.
The dead person cannot be charged with the murder. Whether it can be proved who actually killed the child and what part others may have played in the crime remains to be seen.
Today's Times;
The mother's father's was dead before the baby was born.
You seem to have only half read the news story.
From an article I read today it insinuated that a dead relative may have been responsible. Hasn't it been said that the mother of the baby had a guard for a father. Now dead. Maybe he was responsible and he got his Garda mates to cover it up. Hence why they so heavily pointed the finger at Joanne Hayes??
If that's the case then f**k them and let them rot in hell!
If this turns out to be the story and the person is dead it goes no further I presume, unlikely the parents are going to admit to anything that they could be charged with. If the speculation is true it certainly looks like it had a fairly serious effect on that person's life too, no excuse of course but what a thing to have to live with!
Not premium, it's free to read if you register.
Almost like "look over there" to distract and happily point the finger at an innocent person and leave that lie sit for all them years.
Because they chose to protect the relative instead maybe?
Still doesn't explain why the parents didn't report their babies murder
I missed that post but I remember it going on..
The indo seem pretty sure of their story. They're saying a male relative of the couple who died in the last 5 years may have felt shamed by the birth. He later suffered serious addiction issues. Tellingly they mention that he "was in the Kerry area at that time" which I think implies that he didn't live his whole life there.
Given the couples ages, and that reportedly one of their fathers was dead long before that time, i speculate that it wasn't the baby's grandfather. People with serious addiction issues don't often live very old.
No knowledge here of anything even though I live in Kerry - I'm not going asking anyone close and I'm 60 miles away in a different direction.
Yes that is the speculation, was posted here some time back but might be deleted now, there was enough info in that post to figure out the speculation, sounded very plausible!
Behind a paywall, but seems to be typical Indo cllickbait.
Are they speculating that the actual murder of the baby might not have been carried out by a parent or grand parent?
The state apologised in 2018 - 30+ years later than they should have.
The belligerent, grossly incompetent and corrupt Gerry O'Carroll, continued to say that he believed Joanna Hayes was guilty until just a couple of weeks ago.
And he still refuses to apologise for making statements of his belief in her guilt AFTER the state apologised and paid compensation.
If one good thing comes from this is the pedestal that some (and in particular himself) put Mr O'Carroll on, has well and truly collapsed into smithereens and he is now seen as the ultimate corrupt and incompetent gombeen that he is
This will not come as a surprise to a lot of people, let's hope the truth is not buried with him.
"Died within the last 5 years", maybe half that?
Certainly most of the old rural schools, built around the 1860s were built by the community. Had nothing to do with the church. They got their hands on them when we got our 'freedom'.
🙄
Are you one of those fools who thinks the RCC was doing us some sort of favour - primary education has been paid for from taxes for nearly 200 years. It's the reason they are called National Schools but they and the protestant churches took control of the system for their own ends - and to this day they control 95% of the taxpayer-funded primary education system - and are allowed to decline to hire teachers who are not of the "right" religion into state-funded jobs.
It won't change anything but it may give an answer to something she has been wondering all these years.
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