Id say the changes if and when then come will only apply to leases after that date, they couldnt apply it to existing leases retrospetively,
It would be better to only allow people who had previously farmed to avail of it and not people who simply bought land to lease it out.
Not an easter egg or a violin left in the shops .
60 euro difference for a identical 18% nut from a local Miller versus the crowd I'm with, with my crowd having more price drops come may, other crowd not a hope for the foreseeable, Local crowd has sheds full of dear barley so very reluctant to move prices
Fupping baxtards. Grassholes the lot of them
And the sad part is feed and fertilizer and electricity have come away down in the rest of the world. Good old rip off Ireland.
If you signed a long lease now/soon would you qualify for the tax free income over the full lease if they change the rules in a year or two? Might encourage a few undecided to lease out land now maybe
If a well funded dairy exit/reduction scheme does in-fact come into play next year, i reckon alot of co-ops and the white gold brigade will be scratching their heads with how many farms will go for it, of course the bigger units borrowed to the hilt will stay out of it, but theirs a large base of suppliers the wrong side of 60 who will pull the pin, especially if milk dips into 30's as is been muted now, it will be equivalent our worse than 2016, looking back this morning we averaged 29 cent for the year, if you take into account fertilizer was circa 230 can 18:6:12 350, good quality 16% nut was 255....
Both combined where circa costing 11 cent a litre, present day with fertilizer at current prices blended in with dear autumn stuff, and a good quality 16% at 430 euro, both combined for 2023 will be over 20 cent a litre, if you where to factor in increased machinery/diseal/electric/ contractor/detergent costs etc it's not good viewing when worked out on paper
Big rise on milk price now
I agree kg .it's something that sickens my hoop to be listening to. But the white gold shite comes from the same papers/social media that are lining us up for drawing and quartering on price cuts at the minute.......these people hear all the different details but they will choose to ignore it unless farmers press it home. I've encountered a few lately withe the white gold guff but when I reply with the savage cuts we've got and more to come,they are all well aware of what is happening
I dont know about that we are currently in a situation where milk price is heading to forty cent and land price us heading for the sky.dairy farmers are getting this "white gold"sh#te thrown at them everyday so dont expect too much lenancey in negotiations
The above argument only stacks up if milk is up in the high 40's and grain in the 300's, present day bar operations on owned lad with little debt will be farming at breakeven our in most cases a considerable loss for 2023, unless banks start doling out loans to finance the ridiculous rents been paid the market will level of again
It encouraged longer the move to longer leases though and if it it goes you will see yearly lets coming back to the fore which is not in best interest of tennents.it could be argued that only wealthy farmers are in a position to buy land and leasing suits smaller and young farmers as they dont have the capital to invest in land.
Eejits is right. A developer was buying land boundsing me a few years ago. I was interested in part of it and he said no. He'd buy it all and rent it out to me tax free. No way I said. I don't pay rent.
Maybe it’s not the farmer who has the most cows but the one who needs the least land who’ll benefit from the lower nitrates/banding and the possible drying up of rental land?
That would definitely be a good thing to make it less attractive, interest rates rising would help on that front also with positive returns on cash possibly coming too
I think it's better off gone, too many people speculating buying and renting out to us ejits then.
Might cut out investors too. The property market is better off not being meddled with in general imo.
Ok, Was it a success? I think it's just the big have got bigger on the back of it around here anyway..I suppose it may lead to more land coming for sale where it's left to people not interested in farming, which might be a positive.
It was on the ifj podcast today. Was brought in to make land available for young farmers originally. Costing dept of finance a lot of money now. Will cut land supply for sure.
What makes you say that? If the tax relief was scrapped what way do you think it would affect supply and price..I think it would tighten supply the same as housing and landowners would want the lad leasing to pay there tax aswell, making land dearer again.
Looks like the days are numbered for the lads letting out land tax free. I'd say it's no harm myself but it will effect the land rental market. All that tax free money was always too good to be true.
18000 cows supposedly burned alive, mental stuff
All grand of you’ve loads of land
On the teagasc point. There could be ulterior motive on not really going above on beyond to not say anything on stock numbers and it going below 170.
By going below it means more land per beast. And more forage made, more grass available and possibly less or no meal fed.
Reducing meal fed and increasing feed value of forage should be everyone's aim anyways.
But still it's up to farmers to fight their own case.
Edit: just saw Ginger, kind of same message.
If an honest discussion on nitrates was given by Teagasc and government bodies even to the EPA then the derogation wouldn't go.
By this I mean how nitrates really end up in groundwater and waterways. The whole truth.
Reasons how it happens : The one that everyone thinks of manure and slurry is how it can enter waterways. Same for human sewage. It's how it's spread and how the ground is and if there's plant cover and conditions to take it up.
Other reasons that people don't consider but are the single most important is the soil itself. If the soil has been ploughed. Any nitrate spread or natural nitrate from soil life is now free to move. The plant life and roots are gone in this time, the glue that held the soil together in this time is gone and nutrients wash through. The leachable ones that is, N, P, B, S. The air gets into the soil and bacteria consume carbon that otherwise was unavailable that held onto those nutrients. This happened in the drought of 2018. Nitrate levels went up. Because plants were compromised, air went into the soil got to the carbon and bacteria went into overdrive consuming the carbon. N leached when rains came.
Now what does this all mean for agriculture in Ireland?
Straight off cultivation is going to have an effect. This is at odds with the rhetoric from government bodies, teagasc, epa from what they are looking for.
So maize growing, to turnips, veg, potatoes, cereals, etc have a serious effect.
So that's increased veg growing to maize growing for anaerobic digestion all going to increase nitrate release.
Our environmentalists know this but just the same way they view rice production as a price worth paying re methane. They are willing to say nothing on the issue as it's viewed a result worth taking. Why? Because they want to court the view at the moment of it's all the cows and nothing else to get those numbers down. Get numbers on spreadsheets. Increase and promote anaerobic digestion and growing land for this purpose. If they come now and say turning a spade on soil releases nitrate. It muddies the water from the black/white view that is currently being screamed across the media to influence everyone. It confuses people.
Nitrate release on tilled ground of 7 to 10mg/litre.
On pasture 4 to 5mg.
To be honest in order to be sustainable long term, stocking rates need to be under 170 Kgs, growing grass at low cost with little fertilizer, growing some grain to supplement in winter and spring or perhaps maize and beet. With that kind of system lads can withstand the highs and lows.
The writing has been on the wall for a while now. Time for lads to stop burying their heads in the sand.
This crack of dumping culls, calves, flying herds and just depending on the milk cheque is grand until everyone starts doing it.
On/off grazing didn't go too well here today 😲
I've a relation. The father milked cows then got out. Son has got back into cows.
The son is all anti Eamon Ryan. Highly so. If he saw him I'd say he'd drown him.
However (I'm getting somewhere) he's so anti gone his frame of mind is just to show the two fingers.
Case of point he's put a dungheap not far from a river beside a road. He also put a cow trackway through the river.
He's pissing me off (a lifetime established dairy farmer) by doing this.
I'm not going to report him to the authorities. Authorities have probably seen it anyway and are licking their lips for water nitrate results.
I'm getting to a point. Should there not be a halfway house of a counsellor or such in the IFA or such that farmers could ask to have a word with other farmers that such a thing is not in anyone's interest. Without going the whole hog of reporting to government bodies.
Not sure if any of ye read Pat o Tooles recent article in the ifj. It's free to view anyway online.
Even if it goes to 170 the likes of Pippa and Holly will want more if they ever get their way.
The people pushing for it's removal are no more interested in science than the man on the moon. People pushing for this want to see numbers down. Be that number be the number of farmers, the number of cows, the number for N per ha, number of one off houses, number for gas being imported, number of cars, number for fuel sold, etc. Once the numbers go down, they happy.
