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There's a reason why this generation is "worse off" than their parents

JizzBeans

I'm referring of course to the Prime Time segment about Holly Carins remarks on her generation being worse than that of their folks. The segment went on to regurgitate the usual sound bites & interviews in the street malarkey:

"I have a good job and cant buy a house", "I went to college and cant buy a house", "I done everything right and I cant buy a house". Lisa Chambers didn't stand a chance trying to make her point with this nonsense in the background. This blame the government noise is getting so old now, cant open a newspaper, listen to the radio or watch TV without hearing about the gripes of this generation. Its always someone else's fault, banks, cuckoo funds, government, builders, landlords.

Society does not revolve around these people and only have themselves to blame, at least in part, for not owning their own home. Ive said it before, If you choose:

-To spend 4-6 yrs in college for a bullsh1t degree

-Change your car every couple of years/ avail of PCP

-Multiple holidays & city breaks each year,

-Load up on the latest tech & fashion,

-Travel the world for amazing experiences,

-shag of to Australia for 2-4 yrs.

-Become an influencer

Then don't be surprised if you have little to no savings or prospects down the road. Previous generations did not generally delay themselves with these sorts of choices. A house isn't something you can just have on a whim, its takes a lot of planning, saving and sacrifice. Its always seems to be someone else's fault, banks, cuckoo funds, government, builders, landlords.

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amacca

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120430907#Comment_120430907

not all change is good......its not necessarily a bad idea to be sceptical about the benefits of change imo. I consider myself adaptable but I do believe in looking before you leap.

it could be argued that at least some of the changes over the past 50 years haven't been good or at least weren't good for our species as a whole...perhaps if we hadnt embraced them so wholeheartedly we might not be up the particular kind of **** creek we seem to be in at the moment?

then again it was ever thus and modern life is a lot better in so many ways than it appears to have been in the past despite the constant angst/bitching/moaning etc that goes on.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120432855#Comment_120432855

This is what genuine socialist parties should be fighting against, instead of engaging in bonkers woke activism.

There are over 100,000 unemployed people, including 40,000 construction workers on the Live Register, so there is no need for Indian welders.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431840#Comment_120431840

No.

The cost of sites and finance and profits on houses are all too high.

These three costs need to fall a lot, which means there could be higher wages and lower house prices.

Schwiiing

I work in a small rural manufacturing business as a welder full time. Boss recently hired a group of 4 lads from India to weld full time. He paid for their visas, rented them a house and is currently paying them well below market rate for the job they do.

Recently, an engineer from India has appeared in the factory taking sketches and making CAD drawings of the machines we make. When asked he said he was sending the drawings back to India where the machine frames and parts will now be fabricated and will be shipped to Ireland for assembly only. Pretty much means my job is for the chop unless I accept a lesser contract as a general operative assembling the machines rather than fabricating and assembling as per my current contract just so my boss can further line his already bulging pockets.

Behaviour like this is rife amongst the companies in our sector and the same owners have been publicly whinging they cant retain or attract new staff. Wonder why?

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431931#Comment_120431931

The war in Ukraine and Brexit and COVID isn't going to help with the cost of materials either.

Flinty997

The shortage of tradesman/apprentices is simply because the sector constricted after the crash and it's slow to recover. Also we aren't building housing at the same level. While there is a shortage of people, we aren't building housing at the same level to support the same number of people either.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120430879#Comment_120430879

I think this crisis might have happened sooner. But it's not the prime driver imo.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431820#Comment_120431820

Like that doesn't happen. Also done by stealth in redundancy.

Same work across fewer people. Individual does more for less

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431892#Comment_120431892

The room for movement does not have to come from those actually doing the work. The actual physical construction cost of a house (even counting in the VAT) is 55% of the cost of providing that house as per SCSI 2020 report. That isn't selling price mind you - that is what they are saying it will "cost" to build the house.

Allinall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431870#Comment_120431870

Who’s going to build and sell all these decommodified houses, and how much do you think they should be paid for doing do?

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431867#Comment_120431867

Well it actually comes with planning permission for a new build out the back of it - but it is constrained to incorporate the new build into it. It will cost the buyer more to build with that constraint than it would without it ......... yet the asking is 320k now (down from, as I said, 370k previously when I saw it ......... I googled it and some of the old scraper sites still show it with 370k so I wasn't misremembering). It's basically a rural area about half a mile out from the edge of a village.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431870#Comment_120431870

Here we go, tinfoil hat time.

Starfire20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431840#Comment_120431840

housing should be decommodified

prunudo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431837#Comment_120431837

Great potential with good ventilation as the ad would probably say!

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431842#Comment_120431842

My question was more about seeing whether you could understand that just because market rate for a specific job dropped, doesn’t mean those who were paid at the higher market rate were being overpaid.

Starfire20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431820#Comment_120431820

if an employer is successful in suppressing wages, then they are a sh1tty company and every employee should take that as a major red flag and jump ship asap.

prunudo

So let me get this right, we have an issue where housing is being priced too high for young people to purchase. We also have an issue with attracting new entrants to the apprenticeships. So the solution is to raise their pay which in turn will increase the price of housing. Square peg and round hole springs to mind.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431704#Comment_120431704

I saw one of those modern houses for sale. I just checked now and not only is it still for sale, it has actually dropped by 50k to 320k!

It had been for sale on one of those liquidation sites a while back and I had come across it there.

It looks like a 2-roomed clay walled cottage with a tin roof, partially fallen in. Bargain at only 320k!!!

noodler

My parent bought a brand new house in the 80s on one income and a very low one at that.

I've a much higher income yet such an option is closed off for me.

The OP is absolutely deluded and needs to be challenged. There's never been this level of supply/demand mismatch before.

If, in the OP's rant, everyone could save more money, where would the extra houses come from? We've already massive demand chasing limited supply.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431782#Comment_120431782

Incorrect. Wages need to be considered for the future.

Also take into social welfare entitlements, which I think are far too high. My personal opinion.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431806#Comment_120431806

Out of interest, if market rate drops and an employee stays on the same wage, would you think they are being overpaid, and should have their wages cut?

Starfire20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431797#Comment_120431797

yes, they were underpaying and now have to pay more.

large companies tend to agree on a range for jobs and that then becomes "the market rate" across the sector

companies are just interested in getting labour as cheaply as possible.

calling it 'the market' is just a way to sanitise and avoid responsibility for underpaying.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431782#Comment_120431782

It really doesn’t mean they were underpaid, it means market conditions have changed, if wage doesn’t rise to new market rate, then yes they are underpaid. But my original point, one you seem unable to comprehend, is that if you are paid market rate, you are not being underpaid. P

There is more to it than just getting people though the door for less, there is continuity and the cost of hiring new staff/training them.

alias no.9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431726#Comment_120431726

That's a reasonable point in that a lot of apprentices got burnt who were mid cycle in 08 but plenty of others have started University courses with expectations of a buoyant jobs market in that field only for it to collapse before they finish. Some kind of pathway to complete the qualification even if they lose their sponsor would seem sensible.

The thing is however, small operators don't really need to take on apprentices. It can enable them to take on extra work in time but a skills shortage can just allow them to charge more for the level of work they already do.

Starfire20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431738#Comment_120431738

If employers in a sector of the market raise wages to attract new talent, that means that they were previously underpaying.

they would never voluntarily raise wages if they could get people through the door on less.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431735#Comment_120431735

Looks at thread tittle. Obviously I'm wrong.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431709#Comment_120431709

Again, the important thing to understand is that market rate is not a set rate. If employers in a sector of the market, as opposed to one employer can’t hire people, then market rate/average pay increases. But paying that new rate is still not underpaying, the market has set the new rate.

dontmindme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431654#Comment_120431654

No? Tell me...what else is it about?

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431714#Comment_120431714

Possiby an 'instability premium' is needed. Its not seen as safe work (safe in terms of providing a living, not 'health and safety').

alias no.9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120431657#Comment_120431657

The pay structure is very much in line with the benefits that the apprentice will be bringing, year by year. The benefits of taking on an apprentice are typically not seen by a tradesperson or company until about year 3. Year 3 wages are decent for someone still learning a trade.