A paper cut would be a lot more painful than a minor tear. I can say that being from a medical background and having had 3 natural births.
Crazy I know but the perenium is literally designed to stretch and tear. It is the area of the body with the highest rate if blood flow to facilitate healing.
Childbirth can be dangerous but it can also go very smoothly. The younger the mother the less likely there will be complications. It's completely feasible this girl gave birth with zero assistance or assistance or someone with no medical training.
Surprisingly common it seems, and that's only the ones that are known about.
This 10 year study was 10 years later and Tom Inglis book; "Truth, Power and Lies: Irish Society and the Case of the Kerry Babies" was published in 2003.
He says; "a growing sympathy and understanding emerged towards women concealing pregnancy and instances of infanticide in the decades following the more punitive 1980s." But I fear there is still a way to go.
I wouldn't be surprised if the media attention hungry solicitor does show up on The Late Late Show or The Tonight Show
Equally she could have severely torn herself like my teenage sister did.
Glad your natural births went well, that's not the experience for every woman.
Anyway this isn't a hill I'm prepared to die on.
He could be planning on preparing the public to be sympathic to his clients instead of an angry mob.
The point of the conversation is that saying she absolutely would have needed medically attention is inaccurate
Please cite the biblical passages which state this. The conflation of Mary Magdalene with Mary of Bethany is accepted as being asserted mistakenly in late 6th century and Pope Paul VI inn1969 refuted this assertion as being erroneous.
But I never said she would have needed medical attention, so I don't know why you continually quoted me.
Mary Magdalene, who was introduced in Luke 8:2, with Mary of Bethany (Luke 10:39) and the unnamed "sinful woman" who anointed Jesus's feet in Luke 7:36–50. Pope Gregory's Easter sermon resulted in a widespread belief that Mary Magdalene was a repentant prostitute or promiscuous woman.
Now I wouldn't be the kind of person who 9s into bible readings but a quick google threw up what I was always led to believe.
Let's stick to the facts like many have suggested and leave the mumbo jumbo that caused all of this out of it.
I'm living in Spain since 2005...
Cura tried to talk me into having my baby adopted .... in 1996! 🤬 It was their standard offered "solution" for all unmarried women. They told me they could offer me a room in a residential home where I could have the baby adopted, once born. They tried to tell me how having a baby on my own would ruin my life, and I could give the baby to a "good family" to raise. I repeat - this was 1996, and I was 27 years old.
This is a discussion group.
It's amazing how people keep turning up moaning that people are on a discussion forum, well, discussing things.
I'm moaning that the very reasonable discussion has turned into an OT debate whether Mary of Magdalene was a prostitute or not.
We're only one step removed from arguing if the Easter Bunny would beat the Tooth Fairy in a boxing match.
Locals could have had really important information that has now been forgotten or the people with it moved on or have died since 84.
The gardai completely f**ked the case up by going out very early claiming to have had it solved and coercing evidence from the Hayes family. People in the area may have speculated baby john's mother was actually the mother if it had been unsolved but would have thought nothing of their information once they herd Joanne Hayes family had confessed to dumming of baby John shortly after he had been found.
No doubt the adoptive parents would be expected to make a substantial "donation" 🙄
I wonder how many women went off to Britain for an abortion after a chat with Cura telling them how a baby would ruin their life? Doesn't really seem to have been the most intelligent strategy in retrospect does it...
Perhaps it was a case of "Nothing to see here, Look over there" and off they all went to Abbeydorney.
If it was a hospitals/doctors check that brought Joanne Hays to the attention of the Gardaí I find it hard to believe Baby John was born with no medical intervention whatsoever and the pregnancy going unnoticed in Cahersiveen. It must have been a family with great power and influence in the town.
One thing. I'm pretty certain a DNA test can tell if parents are related.
To each other?
You think RTE would let themselves be open to any legal however remote by allowing the solicitor on a program where anything can be said especially in an on going investigation
lol yes.
I'm 100% certain that biological parents are related to their children. But I was pretty certain you could tell how closely related the parents are to each other. So I just googled it and it's possible to get an idea. So the police might have ruled it out already.
https://www.thetech.org/ask-a-geneticist/identifying-incest-dna
I remember a case I read about a few years ago. It was in a remote italian village. And a girl was murdered. They had no idea who the culprit was but they had his DNA profile. So they asked everyone in the village to volunteer a DNA sample. Since it was a small area they had a feeling that if enough people came forward they'd be able to figure out what family the perpetrator was from. It worked and that's how they caught the guy.
Here's the story if anyones interested.
Check out how they caught the Golden state killer after a few decades. I wouldnt want to be sitting at home thinking i had got away with a murder these days.
Movie about this on netflix at the moment - Yara
It’s not that hard to understand.
I was simply saying that we can’t even make any determination at this point about the mother’s age.
I wasn’t insulting her or passing judgement.
The only definite thing we can say about Baby John is that he was murdered at 5 days old.
Why “5 days” I wonder - what happened between giving birth and 5 days later?
Why did someone feel there was a “need” to kill a newborn child when there were many confidential ways to provide that child with a good home and family?
I don’t think I want to go there with the speculation on this thread but where my mind has wandered to already isn’t a good place. Hopefully all facts will be revealed in the next year.
He was killed on the third day, discovered 2 days later.
It’s what happened in those First 3 days, was he a normal healthy baby, was he fed, suckled? Where was he kept?
Loueze, It was good to have the option there but Cura were desperate to get their hands on those "valuable" babies. My Mam brought me to see them in the early stages of my pregnancy. It was drilled into me how beneficial adoption would be for everyone but I was adamant I wasn't going that route. I thoughf it had all been put to bed till 2 days after I had my baby the same lady from Cura arrived into hospital to see me. I thought how nice of her till I realised she really, really wanted him to be put up for adoption!! I ran her!! The proudest moment of my life!!
Now, I,ll shut up. I hope you made a decision you are happy with. Wishing you well.
Eye opening. I thought their only remit was to try and intercede to prevent abortions- a lot more sinister it seems- maybe a future public enquiry looms?
And why then the decision to kill?
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