DNA is not speculation though.
And their solicitor is, from my reading of it, pretty much saying they are possibly the parents.
After that it's who murdered them that needs to be established.
And how do you feel about what Joanne Hayes was put through?
I could easily throw out a load of Whatsapp messages to a load of people asking who the two arrested are.
I'll probably get replies, some accurate, some not.
But I'm not going to seek that information in the first place because even though I am curious about this case and the latest developments speculation about the identities of the two arrested is just that, speculation.
People are malicious gossip mongers, giving absolutely no thought to extended members of the family who would have nothing to do with this case, younger members of the family who will be affected and ignoring the fact that, as yet, no charges have been made and the full facts have yet to be estaished . People are creaming themselves with utter glee at the chance to rubber neck and spread "news" of what they've been told by someone who told them something told by someone else. As grown adults, do they really think they are showing respect to a murdered innocent by behaving like this? And before you lecture me on how Kerry people are, I am one, I live here and I haven't heard anyone try to mention who they are. Most of us over a certain age remember well the public hounding of the Hayes family and similar horsesh1t stories doing the rounds about them and don't want to repeat that. Let the law, and the courts deal with this and show that poor baba some respect.
Very easy to comment from behind a keyboard totally removed from the situation decades on from the actual events.
I don't know anything about theses people or what they were going through at the time or in the years since.
I'll reserve judgement until if more information is known, if it is ever known.
Obviously you are in different whatsapp groups than i am.
Yes there are the official groups where its club business only, but most clubs have splinter whatsapps too there people can be a bit more, shall we say, less restrained with what they post to each other. Not everyone would be invited into these that might be in the official group, especially if they were sensitive souls. Its the same with childrens class groups. You would have the regular one and then one without the teacher or the parents who were friends with the teacher, mostly so everyone else can have a moan about the teacher or the school :)
Not a single person I know ever suspected or claims to know anyone who ever suspected these people.
DNA doesnt hide any secrets. Alot of families are finding out secret relations from years and generations back through DNA. Children born outside of marriage and adopted, children born from affairs etc.
The fact that this couple remained quiet all these years knowing that another woman was being put through hell is criminal. Thats whats hard to understand - its hard to have compassion for them. Even if they didnt kill the baby themselves - the woman in the couple definitely knew she had a baby at that time and it disappeared. How they could sit back and watch Joanne Hayes go through what she did? They even stayed in the Kerry area. Its shocking.
I presume you mean known since the arrest and release, as opposed to known or suspected for years?
They really don't though
I've been in plenty of soccer groups and nothing is shared except the business of soccer
Kids I know share everything . Picture of a car crash comes up on Facebook and they're whatsapping it
Adults its business only ime
Well i know someone close to it who told me the ins and outs of how it was done.
But for the whatsapps, its friends and aquaitances who are sending around the whatsapps. I imagine everyone in Kerry is in a whatsapp group of any description that has had the news at this point. Even my local GAA whatsapp group in Dublin is receiving those posts now.
News spreads. People are interested and curious. Thats why you are in this thread too, so you shouldnt climb too high up on your horse :)
In fairness kids do WhatsApp on a different level
They share every sort of sh1t
Aren't they just grand people to be wattapping all that info around fir people's amusement. How do they get their info?
If the house is a crime scene then it’s no secret anymore. Where were they living in 1983/4?
You make it sound like a spy story
It was reported they got the close match after the DNA trawl
It's not complicated after that
You must be seriously out of the loop :) Im in Dublin, havent been to Kerry since the summer before last, and I have whatsapps from friends with the names, where they went to school. Who their relatives are and even pictures of the gardai standing guard outside their house. Its far from a secret now.
And as a person who lives in Kerry and has family members living in the general area of Cahirsiveen I'll say their names are not circulating widely in Kerry.
No body that I have talked to about the arrests has volunteered their names.
One person volunteered that they were actually living in another town not Cahirsiveen.
Then again maybe I'm not the right person to be commenting, I'm not actively going around trying to find out who they are.
I imagine everybody is shocked because nobody knew it was them at all for all these years. I myself didnt know them at all.
The question about how they got them ..... It was very clever actually but i was asked to remove the full detail.
Lets just say if you had my DNA and then you asked for everyone around me for DNA to test, you could tell who was my brother, sister, half brother, aunt, uncle, cousins. Then you could "find" dna of the people you deduced were my parents, just to make sure you were 100% sure of what you had deduced.
After that you bring in your suspects of who are my parents and ask them to tell their side of the story and would they ever be so kind as to provide a DNA sample, because somehow they dodged giving their DNA before. Then you say, off you go home know and wait for the real knock on the door.
It was in the media that the couple were pointed to by relatives who came up in a DNA trawl
Well, I live here in Kerry and I haven't heard a word.
Not at all strange that people would be forced to confess to crimes not committed. Ireland at that time was a very different place. The Church and state worked as one. The archbishops and clergy held huge power. Elections won and lost at church gates. The garda heavy gang was fact.
According to the examiner their house is a crime scene and they are staying with somebody else.
Absolutely no hiding who they are now.
The local gossip mongers must be in meltdown mode this week.
Paud o Connell (their solicitor) on Newstalk just now, bullishly predicting their exoneration..
It's like he's trying to rush the Gardai into mistakes by pressing for a DPP decision.
Mr Funny in court, - trying to raise his own profile before the barristers get involved and he fades into the background as a messenger boy.
What defence could they possibly have for keeping quiet all these years? If they are the true parents of John well then their past has caught up on them and they now are condemned in the court of public opinion. But were they aided and abetted in keeping this quiet and allowing the finger to be pointed elsewhere? Was there something rotten in the administration of policing at the time. Clarity should be brought to bear and a proper tribunal constituted to get at the truth.
She and a number of other members of her family (all female I believe) confessed to the killing which was shown to be preposterous. Ultimately it to the state 35 years to attempt recompense and €2.5m was paid. Given the State’s lengthy attempts to deny liability or provide compensation in other arenas, Do you think that there is any reasonable case to be made that any of the Hayes family had any involvement whatsoever? This is not one of those reasonable suspicion positions, there was never any evidence whatsoever of a connection with Baby Iohn other than that confected by certain gardai. One of those gardai is now saying it could all have been resolved if they allowed Joanne Hayes to show where she had left her child’s body. Ultimately it was found a few feet from where she stated it was.
Im not local to the area myself so nothing of this couple - 2 questions for you?
Were you shocked that this couple were involved?
Did the locals have any inkling at the time that this couple could be the parents?
If they are the parents through DNA theres no incriminating to be done.
And if they didn't murder their child they certainly know something about it.
I posted yesterday how exactly they were tracked down and had to remove it until its been released in full.
Everyone in my family knows who they are too and hardly any of us still live in the country even, or the province for that matter. Cant see how its much of a secret in the neighborhood at this point. Id say yould be hard pressed to find anyone who didnt know down there today.
The Garda grandfather had died years before this happened, and was not involved
We'd all like it solved, but they have the right to 'no comment' in reply to any question. nobody can forced to incriminate themselves.
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