I agree, too many of these smaller often called 'accidental landlords' just don't understand business. Perhaps they live in the more sheltered lives of employees in the public service or private enterprise where income & tax matters are more predictable. They look over their shoulders and see the big investors with a different model and start moaning.
I'm firmly of the opinion that all people should take responsibility for their own pensions, including public servants. The state set up the PRSA legislation many years ago and that is a relatively straightforward vehicle for saving. If others want to dabble in property speculation and 'investing in buy to let for their pension' - well they need to understand that business, it's risks and it's tax obligations.
The difference can be quite significant. A sole trader can pay into a pension fund and deduct the contributions from their income. A landlord can't. A landlord buy a bed. The USC goes on to his gross income before the cost of the bed is deducted. Add up all of the various differences and they are quite a lot especially for samll landlords with big mortgages and low rents.
That's obviously but your opinion, as opposed to a verified fact, but it looks completely incorrect to me.
Why would the government have introduced all the difficulties for landlords if that was the case? RPZ, a totally ineffective RTB, bans on recovering your property? Makes no sense.
Well, that should be an area to address - I can't see a logical reason why rental income shouldn't be allowed to be invested in a pension scheme and used to reduce tax liability. Income is income.
That's true and I don't think many landlords who are looking to get out now will hang around until the next budget either.
A miscalculation on the part of Government, a failure to see where things were heading and then panic responses to avoid sudden overflow of hotels and homeless accomododation.
You have one group of landlords that do get a much lower rate of tax often 0%. Then you have another group that pay 50+%
You have a group of individuals that get their income from jobs but because they rent a house they get a tax break. You have another group that gets their income from jobs and rental income that get no tax break.
150,000 and falling per the latest figures. This compares to 500k plus homes occupied by people renting
Still a fair number of people.
If things are so great for them why are exiting the market?
Im out because I dont believe anything from them anymore.
I dont for one minute believe there will be a significant tax reduction for me that doesnt have 100 hoops and forms for me to deal with.
And most of all they have proven that they are happy to change legislation every time the wind blows. You could never trust that if they did change something to make it better for landlords they wouldnt change it right back or make it worse in another 6 months.
The pitch is unplayable. The goal posts are running all over the place. The referees is saying he will give you a free next in the second half. Its time to just leave the pitch and get out of the game because you are being made a mug out of.
As you walk off the pitch the manager is in the dressing room saying ahh poor you, come on in here and have a nice warm shower, pick up that soap over there in the corner will you like a good lad.
That is one issue among many. there may have been some logic with passive income but residential investment is now an active business.
Well part of it is indeed regulation. The market in Ireland has been historically fairly unregulated compared other countries where the likes of rent controls in cities are the norm. Thus it is difficult to bring in such protections in Ireland without causing disruption. Going further back a lot of landlords were paid in cash and evaded tax. Harder to get away with that now.
There's also been massive capital appreciation in recent years and some people are going to want to cash out.
In addition, some landlords were accidental and so it was always a temporary thing.
Finally, some are not cut out for it and should not have got into the business in the first place.
Can you put an estimate on the activity requirement? How many hours per week on average over the year would you put on it?
Great question, and one none of the landlord haters are able to answer with a reasoned response.
I see a lot of greyed out responses/posts from a certain blocked criminal former president. I'm guessing his audience is very small now :)
I think you speak for many in the same situation!
Im seeing those greyed out boxes too. Makes the threads so much better :)
And its a nice bonus that people, well most people have stopped quoting him too.
Now to be fair the €500 tax break in the rent tax credit is paltry to someone paying €2,000+ per month in rent.
The tax break is only an indirect subsidy into the landlord's pocket anyway.
How?
It allows renters to pay rent that they might not be otherwise able to afford.
Most subsidies end up in the pockets of those that provide the product. Whether that be for an EV car or solar panels etc.
Like when the government introduces a scheme to help first-time-buyers, you find that the price of a new house will jump by about that amount.
Nope, it’s was a tax credit for renters, not change to the rpz rules.
You might have heard of a thing called inflation? It means that things cost more compared to what they used to cost.
There will be a lot of people who use that credit to pay rent that they otherwise might not be able to afford due to other costs increasing.
In terms of cost to society, that will be offset somewhat by the bringing into the tax net formerly non-tax-compliant landlords.
Whilst some of these things are true, its also a very hostile environment for landlords currently and there have been many changes to the relevant legislation over the last few years that have made the landlords role very unpredictable and uncertain.
Govt intervention has really pushed landlords out of the game and banning landlords from selling their own property was likley the final push out of the exit door for many.
It really is a mess and the worst is yet to come in terms of the fall out for tenants, sadly.
I think a part of it is tenants can overhold for ridiculously long periods of time and rent owed is more or less unrecoverable.
In addition its not viable to go after delinquents that damage property to recover costs.
I wonder if this could be sorted by a system where very large deposit held in escrow out of the landlord and the tenants hands would work...if a landlord is nervous about a tenant overholding but a tenant wants longer term security then maybe the deposit should reflect the length you can stay as a tenant up to some maximum like 2/3 yrs...if you pay your rent then the deposit is yours, if you don't then it goes to the landlord and you are out on the button when the time is up and the money goes to landlord?
As for damages, we'll I suppose the state would have to actually impose consequences on those causing damages for a change so I won't hold my breath....but perhaps a significant deposit held outside of landlords and tenants grasp might focus minds when it comes to ripping out light fixtures, putting holes in walls and doors, flooding places etc etc....
Might be less likely to do it if you weren't getting a couple of grand back?
Sure as a sole trader who pays tax at the normal specified rates on my taxable income I often resent larger businesses that pay low corporation taxes. Just as the small oft called 'accidental' landlord resents the tax arrangements for REITs.
But these are different entities. If you want the same tax arrangements as a REIT, then become one.
No you have got that ridiculously wrong.
Yeah it just makes the thread a landlord love in when you block everyone that has an opposing view. Pretty childish.
Nope.
you said:
”But people with more than 1 property do not need more money.”
Thats a pretty ridiculous statement to come out with tbh.
There’s opposing views and then there’s trolling.
Im not a landlord by the way I just have a healthy dose of common sense.
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