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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    Hey I'm the same Reduce what you can. I have a tiny carbon footprint. Way smaller than the likes of MR Ryan and Gretta. Suggested it a few times Make planed obsolesce illegal and have refurbish options from other than the companies. Supermarkets anything liquid in big tanks you buy a bottle that's reusable plastic fill it and they weigh and charge you tones of simple stuff can be done.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    go build more windmills and solar, I hear they always offer loads of electricity exactly at peak times in deep dark winter peak hours /s

    Umm, you do know that winter is the windiest time of the year, right?

    image.png




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    And what happens when everyone uses at the suggested time. I await with baited breath.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,333 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    New ESB camps coming up soon

    ”Between the hours of 5-7 we ask all customers to reduce usage and instead go outside and start blowing at your nearest cheap, reliable, wind turbine.”

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    Made me laugh thanks. Levity is needed sometimes.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,333 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    Indeed it is. The crazy thing about this thread is that most want to get to a point where we are reducing our pollution levels, including air, water, and land. It's the how that's causing the most friction. Anyone that thinks wind or solar will replace all fossil fuels is as bad as someone who wants to use nothing but fossil fuels.

    The truth is we will need all the options currently available, plus new technologies to meet our energy needs now and in to the future. The option of just "cutting back" is tantamount to say just take a significant cut in your standard of living and there'll be no debate about it. That's not how it should work and many many people are starting to ask important questions about the current path we are on and for very good reasons.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    Great post. Problem is when you point out the glaring issue you get labelled. I hate to pick sides but one side comes up with low hanging fruit solutions like I have that could do more than steaming ahead trying to hit an impossible target. 2030 would be like Riding a horse on a ship on the open ocean trying to hit a target with a bow and arrow on another ship on the open ocean.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,333 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    I mean, I haven't seen anyone round here deny we are impacting the environment in a negative way, at least not in a while anyway.

    I do have a huge problem with the climate catastrophe narrative that talks about tipping points and cascades, like they have any idea what that even means nevermind whether it's even possible or not. Even if we did nothing regarding renewables (and in all honesty we may as well not the China are acting) humans will still be around for a long long time. Low lying coastal cities have been lost to the ocean before and it will happen again. However, thanks to the ingenuity of humans and our ability to harness cheap energy there's very little we can't deal with as a specie's, which seems to be forgotten all too often.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    I had to laugh at the BBC making a song and dance about an ice pack the size of London breaking off only at the very end they Said it's part of the normal process for the Ice pack according to scientists.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,860 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Climate Imperative, another one for the list, look out for the En-ROADS simulation model (John Gibbons pushing it, enough said), feeding the alarmist echo chamber. The billionaires are creating perverse incentives, i.e the British Cobra problem. The more groups the billionaires give grants to, the more alarm is generated.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



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  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 99,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,518 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    "very little we can't deal with"

    and what about those species that we depend on?

    Our track record for not wiping out entire species isn't fantastic.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,546 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Ok capt’n maybe you can answer these questions as no one else can on this thread:

    1) How many GW of wind turbines and how many GW of solar do we need to install, to keep the lights on for the shortest day of the year (December 21st I think?) when there is a high pressure system off the west coast resulting in little to no wind.

    2) how many acres of land do we need to install the solar mentioned above?

    3) What is the cost to the taxpayer to install this infrastructure?

    Please answer in the context of us not relying on any fossil fuels in the scenario I’ve mentioned in 1).

    Thanks.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,546 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Ah you’ve got the night shift this time.

    It’s the crux of the problem that you refuse to acknowledge.

    But to be fair- your consistent.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nope, just not looking forward to again seeing someone else giving answers that won't be acknowledged and instead get trolled with endless mindless questions that could easily be answered with a bit of research all of which results in a descent into false equivalence and strawman arguments

    It's a regularly occurring pattern, hence:

    But hey, maybe I'm wrong and this time it'll be different



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,546 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    You’ve just spent an entire post saying nothing!

    Oh dear.

    Ill wait until someone who actually has the ability to answer the question (to be fair it’s not that complicated) comes along.

    Im hoping Capt’n can answer.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    to be fair it’s not that complicated

    I don't know, you seem to have struggled with accepting answers over the last 6 months every time an answer has been given by several posters

    I mean, you keep asking the same questions approx every 30-45 days

    Anyway, best of luck, hope you get the answers you're looking for this month



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,546 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    It hasn’t been answered.

    Maybe you are struggling with the question? It’s ok to admit you don’t really understand.

    Sure take a break for a bit and leave it to someone else- or would that get you in trouble?



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  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 99,778 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    As you well know we don't have to fully decarbonise until 2050.

    In the meantime we can still use 20% of previous emissions until 2030 so can use some gas and over time the gas would change from using less methane to more hydrogen. (Next year we'll have gas turbine that don't need to idle but instead can spin up from a cold start in 6 minutes.) For some EU countries having 30% of annual gas demand storage is the norm. Hydrogen storage in the Corrib or Kinsale fields is one option. Geothermal May Beat Batteries for Energy Storage and might be another grid scale option. Iron flow cells or sodium-sulphur batteries should be cheaper than lithium which only offers a few hours for part of a grid. But hydrogen storage is doable at grid scale with exiting kit.


    The IFA reckoned they could get 3GW of solar on farm buildings. Deutsch Ban Bord na Mona have more than enough land, floating wind farms are a thing, possibly even offshore. You can put solar on railway sleepers, Deutsche Bahn reckon they can get 5GW that way, IMHO they'd get more beside the tracks. In France new car parks will have to have solar. There are lots of ways of getting solar with ZERO land usage.


    image.png

    French farmers are covering crops with solar panels to produce food and energy at the same time Some plants like shade so this would have to be done anyway.


    image.png

    When it comes to solar farms, sheep are great groundskeepers. There's more space than have panels otherwise they'd be shading each other as the sun moves. There's also grass under the panels. And sheep can shelter under them.

    I hope you'll now understand that solar panels. even on farmland, don't displace other activities.


    Back before the pandemic when gas was cheap and there were no limits on emissions wholesale prices were much lower than today. I cba looking it up because gas isn't cheap anymore and even if it was we have limits on emissions but solar in the UK and EU isn't a million miles away from those prices.

    The bottom line is we have to reduce emissions by 80% to meet the 2030 target. Options that can deliver in time are wind and solar and insulation or there'd have to be draconian demand reduction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,860 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    The churnalist rewrote a press release on behalf of the battery salesman. They always have have the line "powers [n] homes", they never mention the megawatt/gigawatt hours, how much can actually be discharged in real world conditions before the remaining batteries charge is too low, they don't talk about maintenance costs and expected lifetime of the batteries (depreciation) before needing to be replaced. Batteries do not generate power, they don't discuss costs of charging the batteries versus cost of sale (i.e. P & L) of a unit of electricity from these when conversion losses as accounted for. The true cost of unreliable intermittent generation is hidden? The current deployments can only discharge for perhaps 2 hours at most, and how were the batteries charged in December during the cold spell? It could not have been wind or solar.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,546 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Ok.

    How many GW of solar and how many GW of wind do we need installed to reach 80% of grid needs on December 21st (shortest day of the year) with a high pressure system meaning little to no wind.

    In your answer take this one day in isolation please.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,860 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    I hope you'll now understand that solar panels. even on farmland, don't displace other activities.
    

    I look forward to seeing all those sheep and goats grazing contentedly in the fields of solar panels across the country. Did the greens ban herbicide yet?


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,478 ✭✭✭beggars_bush


    Its mainly the beef herd that needs to shrink, due to the methane emissions and the excess of slurry created



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    An international survey on climate issues comes to similar conclusions as other surveys on the topic here over the years.

    • Only just over one in three people in Ireland (36%) think that governments are taking necessary measures to protect the environment – slightly less than the global average of 39%.
    • Young people are the least confident in the Irish government, with only 28% of 18 to 34-year-olds agreeing with the suggestion that governments are doing enough.
    • 35% of 35 to 54-year-olds and 44% of those aged 55 and above backed the government’s approach.
    • The findings are similar to previous polling conducted by Ireland Thinks for The Journal in 2021, when only 33% of people said the government was doing enough on climate.
    • In total, 29,739 individuals from 36 countries were surveyed on their views and beliefs about climate change. 
    • In Ireland, 85% of people polled said they believed that rising global temperatures are a threat to humanity.


  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The different types of spin used by polluting companies to make themselves appear more environmentally friendly than they are

    Greencrowding

    Greencrowding involves hiding in a group and moving at the speed of the slowest adopter of sustainability policies. e.g. the plastics industry

    Greenlighting

    Greenlighting, in a greenwashing context, is when a company spotlights a particularly green feature of its operations or products. This tactic aims to draw attention away from environmentally damaging activities being conducted elsewhere. e.g. EV's

    Greenshifting

    Greenshifting is when companies imply that the consumer is at fault and shift the blame on to them e.g. carbon footprint

    Greenlabelling

    Greenlabelling is a practice where marketers call something green or sustainable, but closer examination reveals this to be misleading.

    Greenrinsing

    Greenrinsing refers to a company regularly changing its ESG targets before they are achieved. Short for Environmental, Social and Governance, ESG is a set of standards measuring a business's impact on society, the environment, and its transparency and accountability.

    Greenhushing

    Greenhushing is when organisations deliberately choose to under-report or hide their green or ESG credentials from public view to evade scrutiny. Greenhushing firms may hide under the guise of being ‘quietly conscientious’ - fighting the good fight without shouting about it. Yet by remaining vague, they may be giving the impression they are greener than they actually are.



  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    This is very welcome, the last ever exemption for the burning of farm waste. There won't be any more after this. Cleaner air, yay!




  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    A report from Bloomberg shows that investment in replacing coal, gas and oil has matched the investment in those fuel sources for the first time and the trend is only going one way. Its going to surprise some posters where the bulk of the investment is being done

    Global investments in the clean energy transition hit $1.1 trillion in 2022, roughly equal to the amount invested in fossil fuel production, the research firm said in its “Energy Transition Investment Trends 2023” report. Never before has the amount spent on switching to renewable power, electric cars and new energy sources like hydrogen topped $1 trillion.

    image.png

    While the amount represents a 31% jump from 2021, it’s still just a fraction of what’s needed to slash greenhouse gas emissions and fight global warming. BNEF estimates annual investments in the transition must triple for the rest of this decade to give the world a shot at reaching net-zero emissions by 2050. 

    BNEF’s data show that China was by far the leading country for attracting energy transition investment, accounting for $546 billion or nearly half of the global total. The US was a distant second at $141 billion, while the EU would have been second if treated as a single bloc, at $180 billion. Germany retained its third place, while the UK dropped one place to fifth as France climbed to fourth.

    image.png

    More below




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  • Posts: 15,801 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I predicted this many months ago, that the GP would prioritize being in govt to effect positive change in relation to climate policies and it wouldn't matter to them who they would have to go into partnership with.

    Indeed, it woul d likely suit SF down to the ground to have the GP in power with them as they could, as FFG have done, allow the GP to take the flack from those who are against the climate action policies.

    THE Greens could go into Government with Sinn Féin after the next election — as long as that party focuses on the environment, Eamon Ryan has said.

    Asked would be prop up Mary Lou McDonald’s movement in office, the Green Party leader confirmed on RTÉ Radio 1 that he was prepared to do so.

    “I've always said that the scale and the urgency of change needed on the environmental side means that we can't sit back and wait for the ideal partners (in Coalition),” Mr Ryan said on This Week.



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