I wonder how this will work out for him
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That's in the appendix. Nobody ever reads the appendix. Enoch is just more diligent than most.
The appendix is very important to Christian fundamentalists 😁
Hmmmm ….never knew so many of our learned friends subscribed to this platform?
I’ll wait till tomorrow I think!
At least they will get a break from him tomorrow as he shows up to shout nonsense at the Judge.
🤷♀️
Does Paddy Power have odds on the Mammy being there and being removed from court.
Might be worth slipping a pony on that
I doubt they'd give odds on that as it's an almost sure thing.
I'm sorry but you must live in a very sheltered world. People can and do raise objections to matters they don't agree with. Burke allegedly shouting or talking loudly at his principal falls very far down the scale of what some get up to, when they take a mind to object.
Burke's tactics currently seem to be to avoid the school disciplinary hearing and get the more substantive matter from his POV into the courts. He's in difficulty by virtue of a breaking court injunction last autumn but that arose from the suspension which arose from the disagreement with his principal which arose from his substantive objection on religious grounds. He's quite entitled as a citizen to use the courts and legal system to defend his position.
@Henry Ford III, I know that.
I was merely helping @manutd2007 to understand that using gender neutral pronouns, is not the same as calling "a boy a girl and vice versa".
He had no right to verbally abuse the principal. In my world professionals act in a professional manner. Clearly your world is much different.
There's a clearly defined grievance procedure for teachers that doesn't involve hassling your principal at a school function. Even religious people have to follow the rules.
"quite entitled" is a perfect description.
So we've reduced this whole matter now to the allegation that Burke verbally abused his principal. And that is his great crime.. allegedly shouting/ talking loudly/ addressing his school principal!!!!!!!!!!!
That's what it comes down to! Utterly ridiculous that it got this far and if I was the school, I know what I'd be doing.
It's very simple - If you shout at your boss , you get suspended.
Everything else is utterly irrelevant for now.
Burke's tactics currently seem to be to avoid the school disciplinary hearing and get the more substantive matter from his POV into the courts.
There is no other substantive matter. That's in yer heads.
Any points in law will have to based on factual reality, not what you or Burke would like it to be based on.
The Hearing will go ahead with or without him, he will I reasonably assume have his contract of employment terminated. Although he has been given so much leeway this far, fúck knows what will happen.
He will then if he wishes, appeal, go to WRC, labour court, etc.
At no point will his fantasy be indulged, because that isn't how the law operates.
What would you be doing? Repeating the same irrelevant point over and over and over and over, even though it's been shown countless times that it's not relevant? Because that's all you seem to be capable of here.
Under law. It's harassing a fellow employee, this employee also happens to be his boss, it's grounds for straight termination.
It's actually listed, so not even subjective.
So is abuse of school property. Straight termination for that one too. Toast. 🤷♂️
It "Got this far" because of Enoch Burke and Enoch Burke alone.
He shouted at this boss and they suspended him.
His pathway to resolution was to attend the disciplinary hearing and make his case and if it was found that the boss had overstepped then Enoch would have been vindicated and the Boss would have been censured in some way for their actions.
But instead he decided that he was simply going to ignore everyone and pretend it didn't happen and continue to attend school.
After multiple attempts to get him to adhere to the disciplinary process as laid down, the school were forced to get an injunction to prevent him from continuing to come to the school and disrupting other staff and pupils.
Even then , Enoch still wouldn't behave like an adult and kept coming to the school and ended up in jail for 100+ days because of it.
ALL of this is on Enoch and no one else.
that was the first of the things he did wrong. that is what he was facing disciplinary sanctions for. you think the school should have just ignored it. some of us expect higher standards from professionals.
It certainly isn't. It's the same as calling someone a bedside table or a garage door.
There is no such thing as gender neutrality, it is a contradiction in terms. And I hold that to be a scientific fact, not a religious belief, because I am not religious. (there are some exceptions in marine and microbial life, but we are talking about humans)
Burke is right and he is wrong. If I were faced with a situation as he was, that he was instructed in a professional setting to call a person by so-called gender neutral pronouns, I would just use their chosen name in all cases, e.g. Pat or Pat's.
Burke would be able to do the same, as what this pupil chooses to do, with parental consent, cannot affect his beliefs, one way or the other, but he must not engage in misconduct because of it and thats whats at issue here.
Any other person would have been fired by now, but institutions are afraid of the Burkes, which is a mistake and only emboldens them. When it comes to their behaviour, and I mean all the episodes in UL, Law Firms, Coroners Courts, Law Courts etc etc etc, people should have the confidence to treat them as everybody else (and some have), under their agreed policies and under the law of the land and trust that the law of the land will vindicate them in turn.
Burke should be back in prison for contempt now and Wilsons should have terminated him long before now.
I’ve decided im going to tell my boss, as loudly as is necessary, I’m no longer working on Sundays as it contradicts my religious belief.
If I’m suspended I’ll go to work regardless. (Mon-Sat only of course). It’s my right. According to Enoch anyway.
I might shout at a few customers while I’m at it, in for a penny and all that. sure what the hell, I might as well if it’s okay to be a complete tool for “religion” then why am I working Sunday.
what a clown I’ve been. Thanks to the Enoch defenders for showing me the true way of the world. I can get away with anything as long as it’s for my religious beliefs.
Well, yes, that was the reason that the school suspended him.
Burke is pretending it's about his religious beliefs, but the reality is, he refused to follow a legitimate instruction, he abused the principal and he brought the school into disrepute.
Now, I have my doubts as to whether all of that is sufficient to dismiss him, but it is certainly enough to suspend him with pay until a disciplinary hearing is called.
No, that is what you've reduced the matter down to.
You seem to forget there were others present, who felt Burke's behaviour was serious enough that it warranted their intervention to place themselves between he and the Principal.
The majority of the posters here see Burke's actions for what they are. Only a minority are attempting to downplay it
so-called gender neutral pronouns
So "They" is not a gender neutral pronoun?
Completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand, but the word "they" has been a perfectly acceptable singular gender neutral pronoun in English since at least the 13th century, and doing so is in no way contrary to any scientific fact. We use it all the time in sentences like "Did someone knock at the door? Are they coming in?", "I saw someone outside. They were wearing a red coat.", and always have done.
In fact, you just used their as a singular gender neutral pronoun in your post!
If I were faced with a situation as he was, that he was instructed in a professional setting to call a person by so-called gender neutral pronouns, I would just use their chosen name in all cases, e.g. Pat or Pat's.
With respect, it appears to me that the majority here are engaging in group think and seem happy to label Burke as some sort of monster and danger to society as a whole.
If/ when this is finished, I'd be thinking there's a good many conservatively minded schools in the country who will be happy to take him on as a teacher. There should always be a place in education for mavericks and those with different opinions.
It could be group think; everyone else mindlessly agreeing with each other simply out of a deep-seated psychological desire for conformity and acceptance, and you are the one lone sane rebel with your eyes open, able to stand tall against it.
or
You could be just wrong, and everyone else is just pointing that obvious fact out to you.
Objectively, which do you think is the most likely?
Nope, its a collective pronoun, used only to refer to a group, of all males or all female, or both males and females, or a person or persons unidentified and unknown.
I would never refer to a person as 'they' in their presence or about them in the presence of others. It is just ignorant and dismissive.
There is gender neutrality in language, both written and spoken and "they/them/their" are all pronouns that can be used in the singular to refer to a human being.
I'm not even going to waste my time and energy engaging in a debate about whether gender neutrality exists or not, because it's irrelevant.
If someone asks me to use "they/them/their" pronouns to refer to them, I'm just going to be a decent human being and respect their wishes.
There’s ‘mavericks’ and ‘mavericks’ I have to say.
What is Enoch's endgame?
You used it above. You havent got a leg to stand on 🤣
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