Following on from here
New Munster chat thread folks. warning deserved there. https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=109477571#post109477571
He fell out of favour at Munster after the decision to move was made (which was likely weeks ago). He was number 2 at Munster right up to the November internationals. The fact that Harry Byrne (NZ tour), Frawley (SA dev Tour games+ Nov Int) and Crowley (SA dev Tour + Nov Int) all leapfrogged him internationally with far less provincial experience in the last 6 months was I imagine the deciding factor in his decision.
I’d bet one of his goals is to play in a World Cup, and his best chance of that would be for Scotland next year.
For those down the back, I'll repeat.
Healy is leaving Munster because he's looking play in international rugby, after giving it two seasons here he knows that won't happen under Farrell but may happen in Scotland so he has taken that option.
People keep saying he's underrated by Ireland as though that's the reason he's leaving. It's not. He's leaving because he's not rated at Munster.
He was never, ever, and I mean never, close to Carbery for Munster. Never.
He was also behind JJH, then he left. JVG really didn't like Crowley, but it seems Rowntree does and that's curtains for Healy.
The guy has done absolutely nothing to warrant a national call up. He is a loss to Munster only if Crowley fails to progress and he's no loss to Ireland at all.
He didn't have a brilliant season last year. He stank the place out against Exeter and lost the game against Toulouse.
Munster will hammer the Lions tonight and everyone will be talking about how great Healy is, but he has never played well against a top team
Do you know what, you might actually be right. Just looked him up and Wiki says he's 90kg.
Maybe my brain refuses to compute "Coombes" and "not unit" together.
For some reason i always thought of liam coombes as having a slight frame, didnt realise he was that size.
If you had "several pages of chat regarding Scottish rugby, and its depth at 10" on your 2023 bingo card you're certainly ahead of the game. 😂
I'm actually very intrigued about the game tonight. It can't have escaped the coaches how ineffective the more lateral attack was against Ulster, and how deep Crowley was receiving ball at 10. Add to that the over-reliance on Coombes for carrying in the tight channels and surely they've been working on mixing things up.
And interestingly, from 10-15, tonight's backline are all units. All 6"2 or more (bar Scannell) and most touching the 100kg mark. I'm looking for the likes of (L) Coombes and Daly to come in off the wing more, hitting the tight channels around the ruck hard with direct lines (either as decoys or otherwise). Take the pressure off (G) Coombes in this regard.
Lions are a tough side, they are fast and compete well at the breakdown, but they do lack the size of the other SA outfits. So tonight's game could be a good environment to try a few things out on the ground. Be a bit more direct. Work on the formation and organisation as you bring in big wings in as first receivers. Etc.
Or, with lads that size, you could see a lot more hoists, which will suit Healy. And height across the backline will also give Patterson a bit more margin for error as he develops his box kicking.
There is a certain Irony in all of this.
Crowley has skipped healy in the Munster and Ireland pecking order because of his performances on the Frawley tour to SA, a tour designed with the primary objective of advancing the development of one of the primary players considered to be Sextons replacement, which in fact benefitted Crowley not Frawley and what it has done is give a good young talent increased impetus to emigrate thereby putting Munster and Ulster in a weakened position, and by extension Irish Rugby.
I think he's played very well in his last 2 appearances. He seems to have worked on his biggest weakness which was his predictable distribution. The opposition could read him too easily and he rarely took the ball to the line and made breaks. Last week he scored a try and swiched up his distribution. He has plenty of motivation to perform tonight even if he's just trying to prove himself to Townsend
And Butler has been out with a knee injury for the last 6/8 weeks and isn't yet back to full training as far as I know.
Technically there is no clash with Benneton as players can come back from the squad session to play their game, but in practise, these players are unavailable most of the time
Carbery and Crowley will both be with Ireland (almost certainly)
Healy is our only other 10 apart from academy player Tony Butler
Scannell Could play at 10 at a pinch but that's not ideal
World rugby regulations require that clubs release players for the squad camp prior to the 6 nations
The International window for the 6 nations starts on 30th of Jan
but there is a squad session that starts the Monday before this window and ends Wednesday
Munster play Benneton on 28th, but Healy would need to be released to camp on 23rd, 24th and 25th (if he was called up)
I linked to this regulation above
do you think Healy has moved to Edinburgh without any communications with gregor townsend? Id imagine he was quite influential in the move, and most of the commentary ive heard around this cements this.
so if Townsend is talking to healy and urging a move to Edinburgh... and Townsend is most likely in his last cycle as scotland coach (6 years!)... do you not think at least a call up to a training squad is actually quite likely and not at all astonishing? Two days ago id have put a call up for ben healy at about 25%
With the news yesterday of Hastings injury id say at this stage its actually closer to 50/50
JVDW has started one game for scotland (the 3rd/4tgh play off in the ANC)
Weir hasnt started for scotland since that ANC as well. Ross Thompson has never started for scotland.
So while there are options there for townsend, im sure he would like to have, at the least, a look at Healy in training... he doesnt have to cap him at all if Healy doesnt perform.
I wouldn't be surprised at all. I think Healy has been extremely underrated by the Irish set up and most of the Irish media. He had a brilliant season last year and was genuinely challenging Carbery for the 10 spot at Munster. Its mad he has never been included in any senior Irish set up.
There is a recipe there, fast ball from patterson, flat wide pass from ben of the clan healy and fekitoa scores or puts a winger over.
Coombes in 2nd row is a loss because it takes him further away from the ball at times.
We have some risk with regards injury cover that could cause complications, players coming back like coombes on the wing and hodnett.
JOD has played some great rugby recently and he will need to carry the can a lot tonight with regards organisation on field.
Also a word on the ref I think Hollie Davidson is one of the best refs in the league, shes not just making up any gender quota numbers and is completely there on merit, she has a ton of experience across 15’s and 7’s and had the honor of reffing the World cup final recently, we have suffered some terrible refs both male and female at games in Musgrave park but she is Top class and far superior to many of the male refs that officiate in the league.
I think last weekend was the best 60 mins he's put together for us; some hard carrying and good tackling. Hopefully her can kick on from here, himself and Frisch could be a quality partnership.
I think fekitoa will do well tonight, would have preferred frisch next to him cause he would get better ball but he showed some form last week and looks happier.
Yep that's true. But put both those highly improbable things together, and it's as close to 0% chance of happening as makes no difference.
Anyways, there's a match on 2nite. How do we reckon he'll go at 10? Small bit concerned about our distribution in midfield.
If you had a scottish parent and you always wanted to play international rugby for scotland then you would have maybe played some rugby IN scotland for a scottish team and let the scottish management look at you, and then at the first offer (a year ago or so) you would have jumped at it.
Its fair to say Healts first choice for an international jersey wasnt a tartan one
Yes but if I had a Scottish parent then the Jersey I "always wanted to play in" would not necessarily be coloured green
The only way I can see him getting an Irish cap is if Munster pull the finger out and offer him the contract and playing time he wants and, in my own opinion, deserves
I grant you that its unlikley, but im not sure anyone other than Ben Healy can decide what Ben Healy is going to do.
You've missed the point. Even if we grant you that the "highly unlikely events that would lead to him being called up to Ireland" happen...
...he's still never going to accept.
Hence the “highly unlikely” portion of the post
He's just signed for Edinburgh. He'd essentially be ruling himself out of International rugby for the duration of his contract with them, at a mimimum, as Ireland don't pick overseas players.
It's never gonna happen.
If you were ben healy and the highly unlikley events that would lead to your call up happened then would you not consider a chance at playing in the jersey you always wanted to play in?
If you were Ben Healy, would you?
You should remember as well that AF has players from other provinces at his disposal as well. Harry and Ross Byrne at Leinster, Billy Burns at Ulster and Jack Carthy at Connacht to name just a few.
Also, considering they stayed in the country, I'd say Bill Johnston and Jake Flannery would have a better chance of an Ireland call up than Healy
+1. Can't see it happening at Ireland in a World Cup year though. AF wants to be the coach that brings the team through a QF, I'd say that every player that gets played in the 6N will be in his WC plans
What is it we owe the scots for? A world cup bid is it?
Even if Crowley is called up he will be released for the rest weeks. There are no international clashes in the URC calendar.
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