More evidence of systematic torture coming out of Kherson:
""On the third floor, men were beaten," she recalls. "When the person is being tortured with electricity, you hear it. It is a peculiar sound.
"Men were screaming in pain."
After the Russians took Kherson, investigators say they rounded up people with connections to the Ukrainian military or partisans who'd protested against their occupation.
They claim to have found 11 illegal prisons and four torture chambers in Kherson after it was liberated. More than 700 people have been reported as missing.
It's feared they are either dead or have been illegally taken to Russian-occupied territories, or Russia itself."
"Oleksandr Maksimenko, 69, shared a room with 15 other men, who he claims were relentlessly beaten and tortured. Some were electrocuted.
"It's horrible," he remembers. "One guy who was brought to the cell after his interrogation came back with a black tongue. It was so swollen it couldn't go back in his mouth."
Oleksandr says he shared painkillers with his cell mates. Temperatures often reached 40C and they were made to learn the Russian national anthem.
"One man was so bruised, he was almost fully blue from his head to his legs. It took him eight days to be able to stand up," he says.
Investigators say prisoners were often forced to confess to being a Ukrainian collaborator to be freed.
In Oleksandr's case, he had to appear on Russian state TV."
Who gives a ****? People are being blown to bits, all that matters is the support. Money and support going into Ukraine is absolutely critical for the war effort. If Zelensky wants to give a few minutes to someone who has provided millions in support and set up Ukrainian charities, he can, and it gets into news cycles, which is another front he's fighting.
I’d say we all did our little bit for the Ukraine. In my opinion Sean Penn is an egotistical muppet that wants his coverage for doing good like bono etc.
Steady now. Over in the Ukraine they are depending on good neighbours to round up cattle after bombings and dealing with fire fights in the streets.
They have real problems not like us have limited hotel options or dealing with higher prices
I was only being glib. But in reality the people nowadays won't back a war effort when a recession comes and they feel the pinch.
Regarding the missiles that struck Poland, it would be a lot easier to say it was Ukraine missiles rather than changing course and give a bit of retaliation back to Russia. There's no dealing with Russians and the West would be happy enough to keep things contained in Ukraine. Zelensky might be right. Also russia would have a propaganda orgasm if it was their missiles and the West never hit back
Again, who cares? He's raising millions for Ukrainians.
The money and support is what matters.
I would not be so sure about that. What is so unbearable about experiencing a little pain - be it higher prices or whatever- compared to what millions of Ukr are experiencing. If we take a little pain we still have a very peaceful environment, a roof over our heads in the vast majority of cases and a lot of basic supports from the public and private and vol sector
Much of the cost is finally cutting ourselves off from being energy reliant on a dictator who wants to destroy Europe.
Ye sound like people who got there double payment from the government this week. I'm talking about next year when there might not be a throw away budget
I think you are “the people” you refer to in your initial posts.
Don’t assume and extrapolate your own behaviours to general public.
Agree to disagree.
There’s always the decent lads in Saudi and Qatar that we can rely on
We get the vast majority of our oil and gas from the UK.
Last I checked they aren't invading Europe and threatening us with nukes. If they were, it probably wouldn't be such a good idea to be funding such an invasion directly through energy purchases.
Anybody who ever read a bit of history will know there is no appeasing dictator's. I was of the same opinion in 2014 when Obama chickened out just like Chamberlain in the late 30's.
Trump only stoked Putin's ego as well by referring to him as a strong man and admiring his ability to wield power.
If he was allowed to grab Ukraine. Moldova would have been next and meddling in Hungarian and Serbians politics as well as eyeing the tame over of Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia. He would have worked to destabilize those countries and install a leader who would take his lead from him.
Remember as well.the attack.on the HSE computer system a few years ago.
Nah they just oppressed us for 800 years, murdered our ancestors children, watched our ancestors starve and took an enormous chunk of our country as part of a truce deal.
If time is half as kind to Russia as it was to the UK, this invasion will be forgotten rather quickly.
Unfortunately, we get our fuels from all places including the Russians
Whataboutery.
That was in March. We used to be getting around 3% (6% oil/oil products) from Russia, but have been generally lowering that since the invasion.
A lot of other commodities come from there. Fertiliser metals other feedstuffs. That’s the thing about global markets. You are bound to end up buying from less than desirable regimes etc
They were at it in the 20th century as well. Some shocking stuff in Kenya.
We should be in an era of cooperation and mutual goals.
The recent US humiliation in Afghanistan. The latest conflict in the Ukraine. Wars should be a thing of the past.
A country isn't a person. Neither is it's history. Boris Johnson or Rishi Sunak weren't colonising Kenya. It's low-brow whataboutery.
War in Europe was something we all thought was consigned to history, Putin had other ideas.
Fair enough. What’s the best way out of this? Talks I think as Putin unfortunately is going nowhere
According to Oryx, closing in on 1,500 Russian tanks destroyed/captured. Staggering numbers for a modern conflict.
Not really the Iraqi lost over 3k in Desert Storm as oppose to about 150 US tanks ( I think most US crews survived).
By ya 1500 is not a great result
You don’t talk to someone that’s gone NAZI level barbarity to your country while you’re winning.
And before you say the West is the problem, prolonging the war, without the West Russia would have done to the whole Ukraine what it already has done to the parts it has occupied.
Would you be okay with being abandoned and your country being over run by Orcs?
Its not about being abandoned. Non neutral countries have been providing weapons since the start.
The longer the war goes on the more casualties there will be. It looks like there is a desire to move towards talks.
Indeed but that was over three decades ago, a world superpower picking off pieces sitting in the desert mostly by air.
This is almost the reverse, a neutral democratic country defending against a military superpower, with a lot of the tanks being taken out the hard way
Unless the west are happy to let Putin keep what ground he now holds it's not the time to end this war. Russia are a long way from been beaten yet.
They were providing weapons to the Saudis
![Photo of [Deleted User]](https://w7.vanillicon.com/v2/75b34dced3d0cbcff090228687435d54.svg)
![Photo of [Deleted User]](https://we.vanillicon.com/v2/eedacf599b4135dfd56d6fdbddcbd867.svg)
